QUESTION FOR DVD

[IOLAIRE]

OK DVD, over on the General Gassing forum we've got a question about blocked engine breathers that I have been answering and it raised the issue of crankase ventilation to atmosphere instead of recycled through the air filter.
Now I know this is illegal, but it's been so long since I had anything to do with that particular legislation that I can't remember what it is.
So the question is, from what year of vehicle is it illegal to have crankcase ventilation to atmosphere, and is it allowable on a track vehicle modified for racing, i.e. a non street car?
Many thanks.

[sparkythecat]

There doesn't appear to be anything in the MOT test about this and nothing obvious in the Construction & Use Regs. Probably something to do with Euro II emissions and Type Approval Regulations, but legal issues aside, I doubt you'd be allowed on a racetrack with the crankcase vented directly to to air. At the very least there would have to be some form of oil seperator or catch tank to prevent oil on the track.

BTW what does DVD stand for in this context?

>> Edited by sparkythecat on Wednesday 5th January 00:24

[IOLAIRE]

sparkythecat said:

Legal issues aside, I doubt you'd be allowed on a racetrack with the crankcase vented directly to to air. At the very least there would have to be some form of oil seperator or catch tank to prevent oil on the track.

I know that Sparky; that's not the issue here, and a catch tank is still allowing the vapour to escape to atmosphere.
It's just the legal aspect I need clarified.

[mojocvh]

I doubt you'd be allowed on a racetrack with the crankcase vented directly to to air.

So rocker cover breathers are OK?

MoJo.

[Dwight VanDriver]

IOLAIRE

Regrettably I cannot come up with a specific offence, dates, for what you mention nor do I have any recollection of any prosecution in this matter.

As crankcase gases through escaping combustion gases will contain microns of soot and other noxious vapours it will no surprise that there should be some sort of pressure valve/cleaning procedure required. It does not seem to be covered by Reg 54 M.V [Con and Use] Regs 1984 -exhaust gases passing into atmosphere not having passed through a silencer etc- wonder if it could be stretched?.

Presumably legislation, if any, was brought in when they changed from the road draught ventilation system to open many years ago and may be covered by EEC Type Approval as mentioned above.

Reg 61 MV [C & U] Regs (as amended) ( every vehicle to be constructed and maintained so as not to emit any avoidable visible vapor etc). It does deal with emissions of smoke, gasses etc but to me is only understandable to the author or motor vehicle engine boffin because it is tied in with a plethora of EEC Regs which causes my poor brain to crash. There is a table [II] to the Reg that does contain various dates of first use in relation to the EEC Reg about the emissions.

What is permitted on a race track is nearly always not allowed on a road.

I have not bothered to go elsewhere under Clean Air/Environmental legislation.

I know this doesn't help and I can only suggest contact with your local VOSA Office as they do carry various portable emission testers at roadside checks and considered to be the ultimate authority on such matters.

DVD

[IOLAIRE]

Thanks for the trouble you've gone to DVD.
The regs I am thinking about are related partly to the manufacture of vehicles and how that relates to the breather systems, and also the MOT test regulations which, of course, are updated almost every year, so it becomes a bit of a minefield.
When I used to tune the police Jags, they had a beautiful polished alloy housing on the front of the cylinder head that carried the breather fumes to the air filter assembly to recycle them.
Inset was an enamel badge that read, "Jaguar crankcase device, California approved 1961".
Now the States was always Jaguar's biggest market and California had the strictest emission control laws probably in the world, so I'm assuming Jaguar did this for that market. But it just goes to show how long ago some countries were tackling emission problems.
I utterly detest dirty, smoky engines, and even when I used to do the Quattros, I would never interfere with the breather system; but some of the lads on the motoring forums were asking about breathers and I warned them about the legal aspect of it.
It is certainly an MOT failure so we're just going to have to leave it at that.
Thanks once again.

[sparkythecat]

IOLAIRE said:

It is certainly an MOT failure so we're just going to have to leave it at that.

I'd be interested in your source of that information. I can't find anything relating to crankcase breathing in relation to MOT tests.

The only thing I could see is that the examiner should visibly check for 'excess smoke'.

I've looked here amongst other places.

I'm curious as to your sources because my 73 Jensen Healey has the crankcase vented to air and it's never been questioned.

[IOLAIRE]

sparkythecat said:

IOLAIRE said: It is certainly an MOT failure so we're just going to have to leave it at that. I'd be interested in your source of that information. I can't find anything relating to crankcase breathing in relation to MOT tests. The only thing I could see is that the examiner should visibly check for 'excess smoke'. I've looked here amongst other places. I'm curious as to your sources because my 73 Jensen Healey has the crankcase vented to air and it's never been questioned.

I mean in modern cars with cats and recycled breather systems; if you disconnected them on some cars they just wouldn't run properly, because you are interfering with the mixture settings.
Due to the age of your Jensen, it is exempt from a lot of the current regs.

[Boosted LS1]

If you wanted to disconnect them you could still introduce metered air but clean stuff into the inlet tract after the throttle. It should run ok then. Personally, I'm all for breathing the fumes back through the engine.

Boosted.