DVLA - Fine for non licenced vehicle
Discussion
Was greeted this morning by a letter in the post from the DVLA demanding £40 fine and £27.50 arrears for not relicencing a car I traded-in last september.
Have wrote the response below, will be interesting to see what response I get...
(My Address)
8th January 2005
F.A.O Mrs P Woolley
Enforcement Manager
DVLA Continuous Registration Centre
(DVLA Address)
REF: Failure to relicence vehicle: *******
Dear Mrs. Woolley,
This morning I received a letter from you notifying me that vehicle ******* has not been licensed, and therefore imposing a fine of £40 and payment arrears of £27.50.
This came as somewhat of a surprise as I have not been the owner of the vehicle since September 3rd 2004, when I part-exchanged it for a new vehicle at ********** ******. I have enclosed a copy of the sales receipt for my new vehicle which shows a deduction of £1500 for part-exchange of the vehicle in question.
At the time of the part-exchange the salesman took the entire V5 and explained that he would notify the DVLA. Presumably he has not done this?
Therefore I shall not be paying the above costs and await a response from you. Furthermore, your letter states that the fine shall be increased to £80 after the 30th January 2005 which is three weeks away. I expect your response in good time to meet that deadline should you insist on payment from me. If this is not the case then please be advised that I will surcharge your department £40 for unnecessary extra costs and stress caused.
I have tried to telephone your department today, which is closed, and found your answer-phone message extremely patronising. No amount of ‘PR spin’ is going to change the fact that you are not ‘offering’ me a penalty as it is described in the message, but that you are infact trying to ‘enforce’ (hence your job-title) payment of a fine for a car which no longer belongs to me.
I look forward to your swift response.
Yours faithfully
Iain Groom
Encs: 1 no. copy of your letter dated 2nd January 2005.
1 no. copy of receipt for purchase of new vehicle.
Have wrote the response below, will be interesting to see what response I get...
(My Address)
8th January 2005
F.A.O Mrs P Woolley
Enforcement Manager
DVLA Continuous Registration Centre
(DVLA Address)
REF: Failure to relicence vehicle: *******
Dear Mrs. Woolley,
This morning I received a letter from you notifying me that vehicle ******* has not been licensed, and therefore imposing a fine of £40 and payment arrears of £27.50.
This came as somewhat of a surprise as I have not been the owner of the vehicle since September 3rd 2004, when I part-exchanged it for a new vehicle at ********** ******. I have enclosed a copy of the sales receipt for my new vehicle which shows a deduction of £1500 for part-exchange of the vehicle in question.
At the time of the part-exchange the salesman took the entire V5 and explained that he would notify the DVLA. Presumably he has not done this?
Therefore I shall not be paying the above costs and await a response from you. Furthermore, your letter states that the fine shall be increased to £80 after the 30th January 2005 which is three weeks away. I expect your response in good time to meet that deadline should you insist on payment from me. If this is not the case then please be advised that I will surcharge your department £40 for unnecessary extra costs and stress caused.
I have tried to telephone your department today, which is closed, and found your answer-phone message extremely patronising. No amount of ‘PR spin’ is going to change the fact that you are not ‘offering’ me a penalty as it is described in the message, but that you are infact trying to ‘enforce’ (hence your job-title) payment of a fine for a car which no longer belongs to me.
I look forward to your swift response.
Yours faithfully
Iain Groom
Encs: 1 no. copy of your letter dated 2nd January 2005.
1 no. copy of receipt for purchase of new vehicle.
Ahhh. Careful. There is a piece of V5 you are supposed to tear off when trading it in. If you did not do this you need to tread carefully.
In these situations I usually go for the "There is a problem and I need your help" approach.
One time I didn't tear off the strip when selling a car. Got the letter you did (but no fine...). I just write to them apologising for the mislaid piece of the form and informing them to whom I had sold the car.
They were satisfied with that back then. These days things are a lot more draconian...
Good luck. I hope you don't end up needing to pay.
In these situations I usually go for the "There is a problem and I need your help" approach.
One time I didn't tear off the strip when selling a car. Got the letter you did (but no fine...). I just write to them apologising for the mislaid piece of the form and informing them to whom I had sold the car.
They were satisfied with that back then. These days things are a lot more draconian...
Good luck. I hope you don't end up needing to pay.
Yeh, it was an error on my part. The salesman took the whole V5 and said he'd do it and I just didn't think about it at the time.
I expect I'll end up having to pay, but the answerphone message wound me up this morning so I thought I'd have a go anyway.
The answerphone message went along these lines...
"This office is currently closed. Our opening times are (The same working hours as yours so there is no way you can call us). If your query is relating to our OFFER of a penalty for not licencing a vehicle please note all communications must be made in writing..."
PR spin just winds me up... I feel better after writing the letter though.
I expect I'll end up having to pay, but the answerphone message wound me up this morning so I thought I'd have a go anyway.
The answerphone message went along these lines...
"This office is currently closed. Our opening times are (The same working hours as yours so there is no way you can call us). If your query is relating to our OFFER of a penalty for not licencing a vehicle please note all communications must be made in writing..."
PR spin just winds me up... I feel better after writing the letter though.
Don is right.
There is an offence of failing to notify change of ownership on sale/acquisition of a vehicle and DVLA go to great lengths to help people to do so.
Red section at the bottom of the old V5 should have been completed by both Trader and old Registered Keeper and whose responsibility was to send to DVLA.
Motor Trader would eventually cause details of change to be recorded but you cannot blame DVLA for their errors or that of the old Reg Keeper.
DVD
There is an offence of failing to notify change of ownership on sale/acquisition of a vehicle and DVLA go to great lengths to help people to do so.
Red section at the bottom of the old V5 should have been completed by both Trader and old Registered Keeper and whose responsibility was to send to DVLA.
Motor Trader would eventually cause details of change to be recorded but you cannot blame DVLA for their errors or that of the old Reg Keeper.
DVD
The best collective "motorists liberation authority" aproach to this lot would be to bin all the V5s, stop paying road tax, refuse to answer their letters and in fact just seal up the letter box (on the grounds of terorist threat if its good enough for the magistrates court its good enough for us). Then buy guns to deal with the car thieves with hats on. 
DO NOT SAY THE DEALER DID IT FOR YOU!!! It is your obligation to inform them, if you say the that the dealer was/did do it for you as far as the DVLA is concerned YOU have not told them and hence are still liable!
So the moral is, if your p/xing your car ensure YOU send the slip off, if your dealer asks you to do it yourself, it is not him being funny or lazy, its for your benefit
So the moral is, if your p/xing your car ensure YOU send the slip off, if your dealer asks you to do it yourself, it is not him being funny or lazy, its for your benefit
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