At the end of dual carriageways....
Discussion
Say for example, if I were driving along a 2-lane dual carriageway in lane 2 and overtaking traffic in lane 1. I am approaching the end of the dual section and the merge-left arrows are visible in front. But the traffic in lane 1 is now slowing from 70 to 60 and there isn't much of a gap to slot in to.
I am side-by-side with a vehicle in lane 1 with.
Do I (would you) :
(1) speed up and attempt to force one's way in to a gap in front of the vehicle that is alongside on the left? Forcing the vehicle to slow down once in, in order they create a safe separation distance.
(2) slow down and slot in to the space behind the vehicle alongside on the left, again possibly forcing another vehicle behind to slow more to create a safe separation distance?
The highway code doesn't seem to give priority to any vehicle in that situation or give guidance on which of the above should be done. (Or does it?)
I am side-by-side with a vehicle in lane 1 with.
Do I (would you) :
(1) speed up and attempt to force one's way in to a gap in front of the vehicle that is alongside on the left? Forcing the vehicle to slow down once in, in order they create a safe separation distance.
(2) slow down and slot in to the space behind the vehicle alongside on the left, again possibly forcing another vehicle behind to slow more to create a safe separation distance?
The highway code doesn't seem to give priority to any vehicle in that situation or give guidance on which of the above should be done. (Or does it?)
Merge in turns lanes!!!! Arrrh
They would work if alot of drivers understood merge in turn meant and weren't happy cause head on collions rather than allow someone to merge.
I always try and find a slot very early so I don't have to find out if the driver I am merging in front of is mentally unstable and end up in the path of oncoming traffic! (white Van drivers more often than not)
Since there are a number of these on my daily commute I have had some near death incidents with people hell bent on not losing a cars length. I remember a van a few weeks ago I manage to get a good car length in front so I wasn't merging tight on him and he booted up the inside of me and proceeded to force me over a solid white line onto the other side of the road.
They would work if alot of drivers understood merge in turn meant and weren't happy cause head on collions rather than allow someone to merge.
I always try and find a slot very early so I don't have to find out if the driver I am merging in front of is mentally unstable and end up in the path of oncoming traffic! (white Van drivers more often than not)
Since there are a number of these on my daily commute I have had some near death incidents with people hell bent on not losing a cars length. I remember a van a few weeks ago I manage to get a good car length in front so I wasn't merging tight on him and he booted up the inside of me and proceeded to force me over a solid white line onto the other side of the road.
If I were to ask the question from the viewpoint of the other vehicles :
for example, if I were in lane one and I am approaching the end of the dual section, I am behind a line of cars with vehicles also behind me. A car in lane two approaches and reaches my front offside quarter. Do I:
(1) Maintain speed and its up to the lane 2 vehicle to safely merge?
(2) Slow down to create a gap in front?
(3) Speed up to 'force' lane 2 vehicle in to gap created behind me?
Again if anyone can find something in the Highway Code that gives a clear indication on the responsibilities/priorities of each driver then this thread would come to a happy ending
I guess the above situation exists in all cases where a multi-lane highway reduces to fewer lanes. (eg. road works).
for example, if I were in lane one and I am approaching the end of the dual section, I am behind a line of cars with vehicles also behind me. A car in lane two approaches and reaches my front offside quarter. Do I:
(1) Maintain speed and its up to the lane 2 vehicle to safely merge?
(2) Slow down to create a gap in front?
(3) Speed up to 'force' lane 2 vehicle in to gap created behind me?
Again if anyone can find something in the Highway Code that gives a clear indication on the responsibilities/priorities of each driver then this thread would come to a happy ending
I guess the above situation exists in all cases where a multi-lane highway reduces to fewer lanes. (eg. road works).
AA999 said:
If I were to ask the question from the viewpoint of the other vehicles :
for example, if I were in lane one and I am approaching the end of the dual section, I am behind a line of cars with vehicles also behind me. A car in lane two approaches and reaches my front offside quarter. Do I:
(1) Maintain speed and its up to the lane 2 vehicle to safely merge?
(2) Slow down to create a gap in front?
(3) Speed up to 'force' lane 2 vehicle in to gap created behind me?
Again if anyone can find something in the Highway Code that gives a clear indication on the responsibilities/priorities of each driver then this thread would come to a happy ending
I guess the above situation exists in all cases where a multi-lane highway reduces to fewer lanes. (eg. road works).
Whilst in principal it would be good for everyone to understand the concept of merge in turn, the 'Highway Code' interpretation is always going to be that the person committing the overtake bears the primary responsibility for safely re-entering the original lane.for example, if I were in lane one and I am approaching the end of the dual section, I am behind a line of cars with vehicles also behind me. A car in lane two approaches and reaches my front offside quarter. Do I:
(1) Maintain speed and its up to the lane 2 vehicle to safely merge?
(2) Slow down to create a gap in front?
(3) Speed up to 'force' lane 2 vehicle in to gap created behind me?
Again if anyone can find something in the Highway Code that gives a clear indication on the responsibilities/priorities of each driver then this thread would come to a happy ending
I guess the above situation exists in all cases where a multi-lane highway reduces to fewer lanes. (eg. road works).
The specific pieces in the Highway Code around multi-lane carriageways are as follows, and they all put the emphasis on the overtaking or lane changing driver bearing the responsibility and the cars in the original lane having priority:
133
If you need to change lane, first use your mirrors and if necessary take a quick sideways glance to make sure you will not force another road user to change course or speed. When it is safe to do so, signal to indicate your intentions to other road users and when clear, move over.
134
You should follow the signs and road markings and get into the lane as directed. In congested road conditions do not change lanes unnecessarily. Merging in turn is recommended but only if safe and appropriate when vehicles are travelling at a very low speed, e.g. when approaching road works or a road traffic incident. It is not recommended at high speed.
137
On a two-lane dual carriageway you should stay in the left-hand lane. Use the right-hand lane for overtaking or turning right. After overtaking, move back to the left-hand lane when it is safe to do so.
138
On a three-lane dual carriageway, you may use the middle lane or the right-hand lane to overtake but return to the middle and then the left-hand lane when it is safe.
AA999 said:
If I were to ask the question from the viewpoint of the other vehicles :
for example, if I were in lane one and I am approaching the end of the dual section, I am behind a line of cars with vehicles also behind me. A car in lane two approaches and reaches my front offside quarter. Do I:
(1) Maintain speed and its up to the lane 2 vehicle to safely merge?
(2) Slow down to create a gap in front?
(3) Speed up to 'force' lane 2 vehicle in to gap created behind me?
Again if anyone can find something in the Highway Code that gives a clear indication on the responsibilities/priorities of each driver then this thread would come to a happy ending
I guess the above situation exists in all cases where a multi-lane highway reduces to fewer lanes. (eg. road works).
Highway Code Rule 168for example, if I were in lane one and I am approaching the end of the dual section, I am behind a line of cars with vehicles also behind me. A car in lane two approaches and reaches my front offside quarter. Do I:
(1) Maintain speed and its up to the lane 2 vehicle to safely merge?
(2) Slow down to create a gap in front?
(3) Speed up to 'force' lane 2 vehicle in to gap created behind me?
Again if anyone can find something in the Highway Code that gives a clear indication on the responsibilities/priorities of each driver then this thread would come to a happy ending
I guess the above situation exists in all cases where a multi-lane highway reduces to fewer lanes. (eg. road works).
Being overtaken. If a driver is trying to overtake you, maintain a steady course and speed, slowing down if necessary to let the vehicle pass. Never obstruct drivers who wish to pass. Speeding up or driving unpredictably while someone is overtaking you is dangerous. Drop back to maintain a two-second gap if someone overtakes and pulls into the gap in front of you.
Highway Code Rule 162
Before overtaking you should make sure
the road is sufficiently clear ahead
road users are not beginning to overtake you
there is a suitable gap in front of the road user you plan to overtake.
/endthread?
Edited by GadgeS3C on Tuesday 3rd February 15:37
I am left wondering why on a near daily basis that so frequently when I reach the end of a dual section and I am in lane 1 of a line of traffic that there are people wanting to force/push their way in from lane 2 by creating a "move or crash situation".
I'm not sure on the mentality of the drivers at fault but it seems that if they can place the front of their vehicle ahead of your own (by even just a fraction of distance), then this entitles them to force you to move out of the way.
I notice that even if they are driving expensive vehicles that they still are not all that bothered about their actions and possible consequences. I would have thought the drivers of sub-£500 daily hacks would be the ones to give the least to$$, but seemingly not.
I'm not sure on the mentality of the drivers at fault but it seems that if they can place the front of their vehicle ahead of your own (by even just a fraction of distance), then this entitles them to force you to move out of the way.
I notice that even if they are driving expensive vehicles that they still are not all that bothered about their actions and possible consequences. I would have thought the drivers of sub-£500 daily hacks would be the ones to give the least to$$, but seemingly not.
dealing with the bad attitude of others and coping with them safely without causing confrontation is an art of advanced driving
In the last 25 years of driving LGVs and cars I have NEVER had an issue when merging so that proves it can be done with experience and careful planning
there have been many times that I have left a forward gap enough for those intending to push in whatever to go in to as I have observed them prior to it happening
In the last 25 years of driving LGVs and cars I have NEVER had an issue when merging so that proves it can be done with experience and careful planning
there have been many times that I have left a forward gap enough for those intending to push in whatever to go in to as I have observed them prior to it happening
AA999 said:
I am left wondering why on a near daily basis that so frequently when I reach the end of a dual section and I am in lane 1 of a line of traffic that there are people wanting to force/push their way in from lane 2 by creating a "move or crash situation".
I'm not sure on the mentality of the drivers at fault but it seems that if they can place the front of their vehicle ahead of your own (by even just a fraction of distance), then this entitles them to force you to move out of the way.
I notice that even if they are driving expensive vehicles that they still are not all that bothered about their actions and possible consequences. I would have thought the drivers of sub-£500 daily hacks would be the ones to give the least to$$, but seemingly not.
I'm sure for some it's an ego trip, winning is everything. I'm not sure on the mentality of the drivers at fault but it seems that if they can place the front of their vehicle ahead of your own (by even just a fraction of distance), then this entitles them to force you to move out of the way.
I notice that even if they are driving expensive vehicles that they still are not all that bothered about their actions and possible consequences. I would have thought the drivers of sub-£500 daily hacks would be the ones to give the least to$$, but seemingly not.
By getting into the small gap ahead of you rather than pulling into the large gap behind - they 'win'. They do it because they can.
Better just to fall back a bit and let them get on with it.
Moonhawk said:
Better just to fall back a bit and let them get on with it.
I do this .... just about every time.But there are some instances whereby hitting the brakes may cause additional risk from the pleb who 'merged in turn' their vehicle about 0.5m from my rear bumper as they force their way in to the gap between myself and the following vehicle in lane 1.
I know some may be able to plan ahead on this so that 'hitting' the brake never happens, but often is the case that these lane 2 late merge drivers leave it to the last possible moment to make their decision on what they are going to do.
I remember reading about the terms "defensive driver" and "reactive driver"..... I think the UK has way too many 'reactive drivers', in that they are only noticing and acting on situations that are already happening and are no more than 30m in front of them.
Its just annoying to say the least. But being a 'good' driver is to keep calm and carry on I guess.
It comes down to how sensible you want to be and whether your part of the problem, or part of the solution.
The issue I have on my commute is I can either sit behind lorries or risk overtaking now I always plan early to get across I avoid like the plague hanging out to the end of the second lane. Unfortunately unlike ROG I have not achieved perfect master pistonhead advanced driver status and very occasionally find my self in a situation
However occasionally on my commute when traffic is heavy they are all nose to tail on the lead up to the merge in turn I have been left with little other choice.
You overtake a lorry on a hill and crest the hill to find nose to tail cars with no gaps all the way to merge section what are you supposed to do.
The issue I have on my commute is I can either sit behind lorries or risk overtaking now I always plan early to get across I avoid like the plague hanging out to the end of the second lane. Unfortunately unlike ROG I have not achieved perfect master pistonhead advanced driver status and very occasionally find my self in a situation
However occasionally on my commute when traffic is heavy they are all nose to tail on the lead up to the merge in turn I have been left with little other choice.
You overtake a lorry on a hill and crest the hill to find nose to tail cars with no gaps all the way to merge section what are you supposed to do.
jbsportstech said:
It comes down to how sensible you want to be and whether your part of the problem, or part of the solution.
The issue I have on my commute is I can either sit behind lorries or risk overtaking now I always plan early to get across I avoid like the plague hanging out to the end of the second lane. Unfortunately unlike ROG I have not achieved perfect master pistonhead advanced driver status and very occasionally find my self in a situation
However occasionally on my commute when traffic is heavy they are all nose to tail on the lead up to the merge in turn I have been left with little other choice.
You overtake a lorry on a hill and crest the hill to find nose to tail cars with no gaps all the way to merge section what are you supposed to do.
I'm being a little facetious, but if you overtake a lorry on a hill and crest the hill and find nose to tail cars in both lanes, what would you do? I'm presuming you would just crash?The issue I have on my commute is I can either sit behind lorries or risk overtaking now I always plan early to get across I avoid like the plague hanging out to the end of the second lane. Unfortunately unlike ROG I have not achieved perfect master pistonhead advanced driver status and very occasionally find my self in a situation
However occasionally on my commute when traffic is heavy they are all nose to tail on the lead up to the merge in turn I have been left with little other choice.
You overtake a lorry on a hill and crest the hill to find nose to tail cars with no gaps all the way to merge section what are you supposed to do.
If there is room to stop, there should be room to merge. If there really isn't room to merge, then the consequence of your overtake is that you will have to stop, indicate and wait till someone lets you in.
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