Child booster seat required if it makes things dangerous?
Discussion
Hi all,
we have a 6 year old girl, she is approx. 1m 20 so falls short of the age and height requirements for booster seats. Currently looking at a 4 seat toy that, whilst it has rear seats, they are small bucket type. Placing a booster seat on top may be less safe than no booster seat at all. The seats are designed with anti submarining and could essentially be described as child seats as is.
The car in question is a late run XK-R convertible.
we have a 6 year old girl, she is approx. 1m 20 so falls short of the age and height requirements for booster seats. Currently looking at a 4 seat toy that, whilst it has rear seats, they are small bucket type. Placing a booster seat on top may be less safe than no booster seat at all. The seats are designed with anti submarining and could essentially be described as child seats as is.
The car in question is a late run XK-R convertible.
Hamish Finn said:
What is your question exactly?
May be something like "Do you think if I put my 6-year-old in an XK R rear bucket seat without the proper seating arrangement required by law that she will be either a, decapitated, b, thrust into the front seat passenger or c, ejected from the vehicle in a collision should one occur?....Oh!...and you guys may be able to help me with that."If in doubt, don't take her out.
yes that is exactly what I am asking.
I am stating that sometimes putting a booster seat or cushion on a specific seat type can negate the safety "benefit" they proclaim to make. So if you consider the rear seats are basically the same as a bloody booster seat, would this negate the need for a booster seat.
I am stating that sometimes putting a booster seat or cushion on a specific seat type can negate the safety "benefit" they proclaim to make. So if you consider the rear seats are basically the same as a bloody booster seat, would this negate the need for a booster seat.
PHCorvette said:
yes that is exactly what I am asking.
I am stating that sometimes putting a booster seat or cushion on a specific seat type can negate the safety "benefit" they proclaim to make. So if you consider the rear seats are basically the same as a bloody booster seat, would this negate the need for a booster seat.
I think you need to look at where the seat belt is in relation to your child. Perhaps ask the good folk at a Jag dealership what heights the seats and belts are designed for.I am stating that sometimes putting a booster seat or cushion on a specific seat type can negate the safety "benefit" they proclaim to make. So if you consider the rear seats are basically the same as a bloody booster seat, would this negate the need for a booster seat.
PHCorvette said:
So if you consider the rear seats are basically the same as a bloody booster seat, would this negate the need for a booster seat.
You can consider them "basically the same" as anything you like. Whether the law shares your view (hint: it won't) is the relevant question.PHCorvette said:
Hi all,
we have a 6 year old girl, she is approx. 1m 20 so falls short of the age and height requirements for booster seats. Currently looking at a 4 seat toy that, whilst it has rear seats, they are small bucket type. Placing a booster seat on top may be less safe than no booster seat at all.
I looked into this when mine were younger. I decided that the rear buckets were safer than adding another seat on top. Personally, I thought they were safer than booster seats attached to a normal sized rear seat. The seat belt crosses the centre of the chest and there is obviously no possible movement of the seat itself and no chance to misfit the seat/belt.we have a 6 year old girl, she is approx. 1m 20 so falls short of the age and height requirements for booster seats. Currently looking at a 4 seat toy that, whilst it has rear seats, they are small bucket type. Placing a booster seat on top may be less safe than no booster seat at all.
rotarymazda said:
PHCorvette said:
Hi all,
we have a 6 year old girl, she is approx. 1m 20 so falls short of the age and height requirements for booster seats. Currently looking at a 4 seat toy that, whilst it has rear seats, they are small bucket type. Placing a booster seat on top may be less safe than no booster seat at all.
I looked into this when mine were younger. I decided that the rear buckets were safer than adding another seat on top. Personally, I thought they were safer than booster seats attached to a normal sized rear seat. The seat belt crosses the centre of the chest and there is obviously no possible movement of the seat itself and no chance to misfit the seat/belt.we have a 6 year old girl, she is approx. 1m 20 so falls short of the age and height requirements for booster seats. Currently looking at a 4 seat toy that, whilst it has rear seats, they are small bucket type. Placing a booster seat on top may be less safe than no booster seat at all.
Looking forward, if we do get one, if I feel she is safer in the seat I will do it.
The key considerations from a safety perspective are whether the belt in the back sits correctly across her lap, or rides up on her tummy. Also whether the shoulder belt sits on the shoulder, or the neck. Tummy and/or neck = no go.
Manufacturers often produce specific seats for models with tight rear seats - 3 series convertible seat options would be worth looking at.
Sometimes Isofix seats, because of the base required for the fittings, will fit better in sculpted seats. Try something like a BeSafe iZi Up Fix (or even the non-Isofix version). Not cheap but the base is fairly narrow. None of the bog standard options are likely to fit.
Manufacturers often produce specific seats for models with tight rear seats - 3 series convertible seat options would be worth looking at.
Sometimes Isofix seats, because of the base required for the fittings, will fit better in sculpted seats. Try something like a BeSafe iZi Up Fix (or even the non-Isofix version). Not cheap but the base is fairly narrow. None of the bog standard options are likely to fit.
I was shown this recently - not EU approved yet but apparently imminent.
Rather than raising the kid up, it pulls the belts down to the correct position. It might be an acceptable solution (I'd consider one for the lotus).
http://www.mifold.com/
(edit to actually add the link)
Rather than raising the kid up, it pulls the belts down to the correct position. It might be an acceptable solution (I'd consider one for the lotus).
http://www.mifold.com/
(edit to actually add the link)
Looks an interesting product and unlike most actually makes reference to the applicable standards. Totally devoid of side impact protection, but then cheap booster only seats don't have any either. For cars with limited space and a decent plethora of modern safety restraints and a child not prone to falling asleep with their head on a side airbag/under a curtain airbag it looks useful.
I suspect that won't arrive on the market until late summer by the time they've got the approval though....
I suspect that won't arrive on the market until late summer by the time they've got the approval though....
Thanks all for some sensible positions on this. JAguar do a branded specialist seat for the XKR but the research on the jag forums suggested its just a rebranded version of the very cheapest motehrcare item and does not fit the recess of the seat. If only there was an isofix booster cushion
PHCorvette said:
Thanks all for some sensible positions on this. JAguar do a branded specialist seat for the XKR but the research on the jag forums suggested its just a rebranded version of the very cheapest motehrcare item and does not fit the recess of the seat. If only there was an isofix booster cushion
The problem with booster cushions is that they offer no side-impact head protection. For that reason I would avoid using them if you can - look at the crash test videos on youtube showing what happens using a booster only.Recaro do a very light full height seat that works with the belt rather than a harness type. I would have a look at those and see if they fit. They seem to fit in most things.
Also, have a look at the Merc head resraints that clip onto the headrest rails. They look a bit like a HANs devide - you may be lucky in that they may fit your jag.
Finally, there is a chap on PH who is a crash test engineer for child car seats. If you search for child seats on PH you'll find his name so a PM may help you find something.
Good luck
rhinochopig said:
The problem with booster cushions is that they offer no side-impact head protection. For that reason I would avoid using them if you can - look at the crash test videos on youtube showing what happens using a booster only.
Recaro do a very light full height seat that works with the belt rather than a harness type. I would have a look at those and see if they fit. They seem to fit in most things.
Also, have a look at the Merc head resraints that clip onto the headrest rails. They look a bit like a HANs devide - you may be lucky in that they may fit your jag.
Finally, there is a chap on PH who is a crash test engineer for child car seats. If you search for child seats on PH you'll find his name so a PM may help you find something.
Good luck
That'd be Boobles in this thread, although I think he no longer posts due to work issues so PM may be only option?Recaro do a very light full height seat that works with the belt rather than a harness type. I would have a look at those and see if they fit. They seem to fit in most things.
Also, have a look at the Merc head resraints that clip onto the headrest rails. They look a bit like a HANs devide - you may be lucky in that they may fit your jag.
Finally, there is a chap on PH who is a crash test engineer for child car seats. If you search for child seats on PH you'll find his name so a PM may help you find something.
Good luck
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
All booster seats, whether high back or base only, use the adult seat belt. The confusion comes from some seats being capable of use as Group 2 seats with a harness and Group 3 with adult belt.
I recall struggling to find a way to install a Group 2 seat into the back of a 3 series soft top years ago at a child safety event - nothing fitted properly due to the sculpting of the seat base and narrow width....
she currently has a full booster seat for the side and head protection, if it will fit it will be brilliant but suspect it will sit positioned on two smallish contact patches.
I understand Graco do one that may fit, I will take the two we currently have to the test drive and take a look. If not, it wont hurt, we used to sit with 8 of is in the back of a Morris Marina and drove down A roads to Wales for holidays. 2 on the front seat and one in the footwell. All survived.
I understand Graco do one that may fit, I will take the two we currently have to the test drive and take a look. If not, it wont hurt, we used to sit with 8 of is in the back of a Morris Marina and drove down A roads to Wales for holidays. 2 on the front seat and one in the footwell. All survived.
In law she has to use a booster seat as the rear seats in the Jag or say a 911 are not e marked and therefore require a booster seat.
Personally having had my kids in the rear of a 911 similar situation I didn't use a booster seat and was happy that afforded them a safer form of seating...
Just don't get stopped.
Personally having had my kids in the rear of a 911 similar situation I didn't use a booster seat and was happy that afforded them a safer form of seating...
Just don't get stopped.
I would start by checking the vehicle handbook to see if the rear seats are approved for use with CRS. There will be a table or statement in there to indicate what groups can be accommodated by the vehicle. It is possible that the vehicle cannot accommodate any CRS so check the handbook first.
Could always use something like the bubblebum inflatable booster seat? That barely raises the child, is narrow and also allows you to adjust the seatbelt height.
I bought one to use on holiday (for my daughter not me) and sometimes use it in the back of my 911. I've got various seats that fit in the back including the porsche one but feel that the bubblebum is a better and safer fit for my 4 year old.
I bought one to use on holiday (for my daughter not me) and sometimes use it in the back of my 911. I've got various seats that fit in the back including the porsche one but feel that the bubblebum is a better and safer fit for my 4 year old.
I believe that most child seat manufacturers will tell you which of their seats are compatible with which vehicles, and most retailers are happy to let you try them out if you are not sure about ease of use or have other concerns. If the seat is approved for use with the vehicle it should be adequately safe and, with respect, the manufacturer is probably better qualified to make that assessment than you.
As an example Kiddyfix, whose seats I have used for my grandchildren and found very good, show a seat which is listed as compatible with the XK 2006, although it it doesn't distinguish between the coupe and convertible. There is a facility to enter your vehicle model on the relevant product page to check compatibility. Here is the example I used:
http://www.kiddyuk.com/car-seats/guardianfix-pro-2
If you are in any doubt they state that any of their retailers will offer advice or I daresay you could contact them direct.
I assume that if there is a compatible seat you would prefer to use that.
As an example Kiddyfix, whose seats I have used for my grandchildren and found very good, show a seat which is listed as compatible with the XK 2006, although it it doesn't distinguish between the coupe and convertible. There is a facility to enter your vehicle model on the relevant product page to check compatibility. Here is the example I used:
http://www.kiddyuk.com/car-seats/guardianfix-pro-2
If you are in any doubt they state that any of their retailers will offer advice or I daresay you could contact them direct.
I assume that if there is a compatible seat you would prefer to use that.
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