Car damaged - Police not interested
Discussion
A few weeks ago my car was parked in a shopping centre car park. Another driver reversed into my car, breaking the front indicator light, then drove off. This was witnessed by several people, two of whom gave me the person's registration, make and model of the car and volunteered to act as witnesses should I need them to.
Although there wasn't a lot of damage (£30 for new indicator lights), I was annoyed that this person had hit my car, KNEW they'd hit my car and still drove away. The witnesses say the person was definitely aware they'd hit it. So I report it to the local Police.
Anyway, today I get a letter saying that they're not going to take the matter any further. Excuse me?? They're obviously not going to give me this person's name and address so I can write to them and suggest they pay for my repair, but they're also not going to pursue it at all.
As far as I'm concerned, this effectively amounts to the Police condoning someone causing damage to another person's property, wilfully leaving the scene and not doing anything about it. How can this be right?
Yes, I can hear many of you saying, "It's only £30" but it's the principle of the thing. This person will now know that they can cause damage to someone else's car and drive away with impunity.
I am REALLY
annoyed. 
>>> Edited by birdbrain on Saturday 26th February 19:22
Although there wasn't a lot of damage (£30 for new indicator lights), I was annoyed that this person had hit my car, KNEW they'd hit my car and still drove away. The witnesses say the person was definitely aware they'd hit it. So I report it to the local Police.
Anyway, today I get a letter saying that they're not going to take the matter any further. Excuse me?? They're obviously not going to give me this person's name and address so I can write to them and suggest they pay for my repair, but they're also not going to pursue it at all.
As far as I'm concerned, this effectively amounts to the Police condoning someone causing damage to another person's property, wilfully leaving the scene and not doing anything about it. How can this be right?
Yes, I can hear many of you saying, "It's only £30" but it's the principle of the thing. This person will now know that they can cause damage to someone else's car and drive away with impunity.
I am REALLY
annoyed. >>> Edited by birdbrain on Saturday 26th February 19:22
birdbrain said:
Anyway, today I get a letter saying that they're not going to take the matter any further. Excuse me?? They're obviously not going to give me this person's name and address so I can write to them and suggest they pay for my repair, but they're also not going to pursue it at all.
Does their letter say why? In your shoes I'd be down there asking them why they don't want to deal with this crime, especially as you have already provided them with enough evidence to solve it.
On the 26 March 2000, my taxi was kicked when I asked the 5th passenger to get out of the car. I can only carry 4. They went back into the pub. I called the Police, and to give them their due, they arrived in 2-3 minutes. I, with witnesses, explained what happened, whilst the offender looked out of the pub window. Police refused to take action and gave me a postcard with a crime number on it, which I still carry in my diary. If I get stopped by the Police, I will ask if they have solved this incident before I co-operate with them in future.
On 3 January, I posted this:
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?f=10&h=0&t=146618
and it seemed to be the concensus here, that police attention to minor crimes (ie not involving injury) was unnecessary.
It's obviously not so satisfactory when you are on the receiving end though...
Cakes eh? You can have them or eat them...
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?f=10&h=0&t=146618
and it seemed to be the concensus here, that police attention to minor crimes (ie not involving injury) was unnecessary.
It's obviously not so satisfactory when you are on the receiving end though...
Cakes eh? You can have them or eat them...
I can't how the police can collect money with your claim - even though it involves failing to stop at the scene of an accident, like another thread on this site where the police were interested.
I suggest either getting a better handshake or getting snapped by a gatso, the CPS live and breath for that.
Of course plan B could involve casting a good eye over the car park and finding out where the othe car is parked, just in case you need to get close to it..
I suggest either getting a better handshake or getting snapped by a gatso, the CPS live and breath for that.
Of course plan B could involve casting a good eye over the car park and finding out where the othe car is parked, just in case you need to get close to it..
Now hang on a minute guys; you all know how I feel about the BiB if they step out of line, but if this happened in a privately owned car park, there are very few sections of the Road Traffic act that apply, so it's highly possible that they can't do anything about it even if they wanted to.
They should have explained this to you of course.
What you can do however is raise a small claims action against him for all your expenses in your county court.
This is a very quick, straightforward process that you can initiate yourself at minimal expense; you can get all the information and the forms from the clerk's office.
If you have a witness, he doesn't have a leg to stand on, and I guarantee you'll get an offer to settle as soon as the citation pops through his letterbox.
They should have explained this to you of course.
What you can do however is raise a small claims action against him for all your expenses in your county court.
This is a very quick, straightforward process that you can initiate yourself at minimal expense; you can get all the information and the forms from the clerk's office.
If you have a witness, he doesn't have a leg to stand on, and I guarantee you'll get an offer to settle as soon as the citation pops through his letterbox.
MrsMiggins said:
Anyway, today I get a letter saying that they're not going to take the matter any further. Excuse me?? They're obviously not going to give me this person's name and address so I can write to them and suggest they pay for my repair, but they're also not going to pursue it at all.
Does their letter say why? In your shoes I'd be down there asking them why they don't want to deal with this crime, especially as you have already provided them with enough evidence to solve it.
Well, It's a civil matter Madam, nothin' we can do see? Goodnight ma'am! Don't have night mares now! We've all heard it haven't we?
birdbrain said:
As far as I'm concerned, this effectively amounts to the Police condoning someone causing damage to another person's property, wilfully leaving the scene and not doing anything about it. How can this be right?
>>> Edited by birdbrain on Saturday 26th February 19:22
As far as im concerned its the police saying that accidents will happen
greasenipple said:but if you do have an accident, eff off quick and don't admit responsibility, in case anybody finds out that you shouldn't have been driving, don't have insurance or your car's a crockash1t...
As far as im concerned its the police saying that accidents will happen
Still, nobody was hurt, and if that's the new guidelines, what can you do eh?
Question is was it a road/public place? If not Bib not involved but in the old days could assist with name and address of other person involved. Maybe something in DPA now prevents that.
But if a road then we have an apparent offence of failing to stop/report (damage to another vehicle) and may be due care or even Criminal Damage.
Having reported the matter I assume Bib will have made some enquiry and interviewed the other involved.
In relation to the fail to stop every Bib knows that under the High Court judgement of Harding v Price [1948] fail to stop report offence doesn't apply where the driver was unaware of the accident and had not wilfully or negligently shut his eyes to the obvious.
Backed up in Hampson v Powell [1970]. The damage stated is small and therefore possible the other unaware so that goes out of the window.
Due care?. Very, very doubtful that CPS will santion a prosecution for minor damage only bumps involving vehicles manouvering in a confined space and really who could blame them. So thats out.
Criminal damage - cannot prove intent, wouldn't even be considered.
As IOLAIRE states the course of action left, other than going through own Insurance, is through the Small Claims County Court where negligence hasn't to be proved beyond any reasonable doubt but on the balance of probability.
Pity though that BiB hasn't seem fit to advise why no action.
Doubt this will appease the poster but an attempt to do so.
DVD
But if a road then we have an apparent offence of failing to stop/report (damage to another vehicle) and may be due care or even Criminal Damage.
Having reported the matter I assume Bib will have made some enquiry and interviewed the other involved.
In relation to the fail to stop every Bib knows that under the High Court judgement of Harding v Price [1948] fail to stop report offence doesn't apply where the driver was unaware of the accident and had not wilfully or negligently shut his eyes to the obvious.
Backed up in Hampson v Powell [1970]. The damage stated is small and therefore possible the other unaware so that goes out of the window.
Due care?. Very, very doubtful that CPS will santion a prosecution for minor damage only bumps involving vehicles manouvering in a confined space and really who could blame them. So thats out.
Criminal damage - cannot prove intent, wouldn't even be considered.
As IOLAIRE states the course of action left, other than going through own Insurance, is through the Small Claims County Court where negligence hasn't to be proved beyond any reasonable doubt but on the balance of probability.
Pity though that BiB hasn't seem fit to advise why no action.
Doubt this will appease the poster but an attempt to do so.
DVD
lanciachris said:
Just one of the things that I hate about the way BiB are forced to behave.
Well said. It's not 'The Police' who aren't interested. This is 'The System' my friends and it stinks!
Investigation WILL have gone into this. Most probably from a civilian in the traffic unit at the area HQ (individual nicks rarely have such depts). They will, for whatever reason, have written this understandably frustrating letter.
It's a pisser and i sympathise, but lets please not turn this into the usual "I phoned the Police and they weren't interested" thread
. There are many factors at work here.... Your insurance company (and even you if you word it correctly
) can write to DVLA and get the owners details. They will provide them to someone who requires it for a valid reason. Can you provide any further details from the letter or is it the bog standard "This has been investigated but unfortunately etc etc" crap that we give out?
As a foot note, had i been called to that i would have bent over backwards because i've been in a similar situation. Oh, and for the 'they won't investigate because it wasn't going to net them cash like the camera's' brigade that are here.....I've been a copper for over seven years.....I've never held a laser gun or had zilch to do with camera's or any other such thing. Open your eyes and look at the bigger picture please. A tiny (and i mean TINY) number of Police have anything to do with traffic matters at all. I don't have the time. I'm too busy answering 999 calls trying to help people....
Rant over!!! (Wipes sweat from brow...)
Hollywood Wheels said:
Just one of the things that I hate about the way BiB are forced to behave.
Well said. It's not 'The Police' who aren't interested. This is 'The System' my friends and it stinks!
People generally switch the meaning of "the Police" between "the Police Officers" (who are in the main good), and "the Police Service" (which is basically crap).
Unfortunately, what the "Police Officers" do not grasp, too often, is that the majority of people will not differentiate between the Service and the Officers. As the front line, the Officers will get the criticism etc. for the failings of the Service.
Autismuk,
you are absolutely correct
I can understand completely why the public tend to take this view of us. It's very much a result of the 'them and us' situation created by the 'yes' men in charge of the Police, who do minimal time on the street before climbing the promotional ladder and fighting crime from behind a desk Mon-Fri 9-5.
They then attend 'Management Courses' and treat PC's on the street as simply numbers on a piece of paper. And all the time they stay off the streets they are avoiding the complaints, injuries, and stress that me and my colleagues regulary suffer from. But it won't change. I don't bulls**t people like i used to. I tell them that i'll put a report on that will just be lost amongst all the others. They tend to appreciate my honesty! I wish i had time to investigate stuff but it just doesn't happen. We're strapped as it is and there's always calls to be answered. I just get a bit pissed off when people start harping on about speed camera's etc. It's nothing to do with me!!!
you are absolutely correct
I can understand completely why the public tend to take this view of us. It's very much a result of the 'them and us' situation created by the 'yes' men in charge of the Police, who do minimal time on the street before climbing the promotional ladder and fighting crime from behind a desk Mon-Fri 9-5. They then attend 'Management Courses' and treat PC's on the street as simply numbers on a piece of paper. And all the time they stay off the streets they are avoiding the complaints, injuries, and stress that me and my colleagues regulary suffer from. But it won't change. I don't bulls**t people like i used to. I tell them that i'll put a report on that will just be lost amongst all the others. They tend to appreciate my honesty!
I wish i had time to investigate stuff but it just doesn't happen. We're strapped as it is and there's always calls to be answered. I just get a bit pissed off when people start harping on about speed camera's etc. It's nothing to do with me!!!Hollywood Wheels said:
Autismuk,
you are absolutely correct
They then attend 'Management Courses' and treat PC's on the street as simply numbers on a piece of paper. And all the time they stay off the streets they are avoiding the complaints, injuries, and stress that me and my colleagues regulary suffer from. But it won't change. I don't bulls**t people like i used to. I tell them that i'll put a report on that will just be lost amongst all the others. They tend to appreciate my honesty!
No of course, it's not. It's fairly clear from the various trafpol here that they basically go after "dangerous speeders" and apply sensible discretion. This is my personal (non extensive) experience of trafpol.
However, all signs here (Norfolk) say "Police Enforcement Cameras" and I believe the NIPs come with "Norfolk Police" on them .... so you guys will get the flak. I think the Police *need* to disassociate themselves totally from Cameras, Speed Trapping etc.
It is certainly true in Social Care that the "aim" of many people is to get a deskjob isolated from the actual "work" as soon as possible. These jobs tend (sadly) to be better paid.
The people who are rubbish at the actual job (in your case, catching/detecting Crims.) tend to be really keen on the management side, as it means they can avoid the actual job. Then they brown-nose & con their way up, and the clueless are making operational decisions.
I do not think this is unique to the Police at all ; I *know* it operates in Education, Social Services and Health (and probably lots of other things I don't know anything about). The system is run by people who neither know nor care about the job and the people who work in it.
The solution is the same ; always the same.
Fundamentally the paper pushers become just that ; they are secretarial staff, *below* the average coppers. Management Decisions etc. all the way down the ladder should be made by experienced long term hands-on Cops who have done the job and still do it. Mindless paperwork tasks are offloaded onto admin ; but still under the control of actual Policemen.
What seems to happen is that that above a certain operating level it becomes entirely management bulls**t ; and these people are the ones making the decisions, which are passed down to the working Cops at the bottom, who have to try as best they can.
I suspect, as with everything I know of, the bureaucracy is largely duplicated and pointless, and comes from the upper level engaging in empire building schemes (more budget/staff) and then finding things for them to do.
I suspect if your paperwork was designed by a Sarge with 25 years experience it would be much better !
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