Discussion
SS2. said:
It's 14 calendar days - the SCP would need to make allowances for increased delivery times resulting from weekends, Bank Holidays, etc.
Oh so it should of been with me on thursday then, if i get it today its down to me to fight it in court i guess.Edited by SS2. on Tuesday 18th April 13:09
HantsRat said:
This thread is pointless without context. Did you drive past a speed van? Were you stopped at the roadside? What offence do you think you committed? The 14 day NIP only applied to certain offences which many people do not know.
If was a speed van so the 14day rule for NIP applies, as in person they give you a NIP there and then if they can deal with it at the side of the road else its a 6month wait for a summons.Dan_M5 said:
If was a speed van so the 14day rule for NIP applies, as in person they give you a NIP there and then if they can deal with it at the side of the road else its a 6month wait for a summons.
In that case give it a couple of days. If nothing then you are in the clear. Are you the registered keeper of the car?I'm waiting myself at the moment. Scamera van. Worst case is he *might* have got me about 40 in a 30mph. Widest 30mph road in the town with great visibility, few pedestrians etc. Which is why they sit there to cash in, as anyone who is driving to the hazards and conditions wouldn't naturally be doing 30mph or less.
EU_Foreigner said:
Date of offense is included in the 14 day rule, so 2nd of April --> 16th was the final red letter day 
The 14 days starts the day after the alleged offence, the posting must be within a reasonable expectation of being delivered within the 14 days, so (ignoring weekends etc) they can post first class on day 13 and be correctly serving the NIP, 2nd class not.The 'ordinary course of post' for 1st class mail is considered to be 2 business days.
This means that a NIP would have to be posted (1st class) no later than Day 12 for it to be presumed served on Day 14 ie the second business day after posting.
And yes, the day of the alleged offence is Day 0, not Day 1.
This means that a NIP would have to be posted (1st class) no later than Day 12 for it to be presumed served on Day 14 ie the second business day after posting.
And yes, the day of the alleged offence is Day 0, not Day 1.
Edited by SS2. on Tuesday 18th April 14:44
SS2. said:
The 'ordinary course of post' for 1st class mail is considered to be 2 business days.
This means that a NIP would have to be posted (1st class) no later than Day 12 for it to be presumed served on Day 14 ie the second business day after posting.
And yes, the day of the alleged offence is Day 0, not Day 1.
Thanks for the update, RM/PO claim 1st class is next day........This means that a NIP would have to be posted (1st class) no later than Day 12 for it to be presumed served on Day 14 ie the second business day after posting.
And yes, the day of the alleged offence is Day 0, not Day 1.
Edited by SS2. on Tuesday 18th April 14:44
KevinCamaroSS said:
SS2. said:
The 'ordinary course of post' for 1st class mail is considered to be 2 business days.
This means that a NIP would have to be posted (1st class) no later than Day 12 for it to be presumed served on Day 14 ie the second business day after posting.
And yes, the day of the alleged offence is Day 0, not Day 1.
RM/PO claim 1st class is next day........This means that a NIP would have to be posted (1st class) no later than Day 12 for it to be presumed served on Day 14 ie the second business day after posting.
And yes, the day of the alleged offence is Day 0, not Day 1.
Gidden said:
The method of serving notice is then specified in subsection (1A), which is as follows:
(1A) A notice required by this section to be served on any person may be served on that person -
(a) by delivering it to him;
(b) by addressing it to him and leaving it at his last known address; or
(c) by sending it by registered post, recorded delivery service or first class post addressed to him at his last known address."
It is only since 1994, when this section was introduced by the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act, that service by first class post has been permitted. Prior to that service by post had to be effected by using registered post or recorded delivery.
Subsection 1(3) then specifies:
"The requirement of subsection (1) above shall in every case be deemed to have been complied with unless and until the contrary is proved."
Accordingly, the burden is placed on the defendant to show that there has been no compliance with the requirements.
These provisions do not in terms provide when the notice is served. That is a matter of fact. However, section 7 of the Interpretation Act creates a presumption that letters sent by post will be delivered in the ordinary course of post. It states:
"Where an Act authorises or requires any document to be served by post (whether the expression 'serve' or the expression 'give' or 'send' or any other expression is used) then, unless the contrary intention appears, the service is deemed to be effected by properly addressing, pre-paying and posting a letter containing the document and, unless the contrary is proved, to have been effected at the time at which the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post."
What constitutes the "ordinary course of post" in this context is set down in a Practice Direction, and for first class mail it is the second working day after posting.
Again, therefore, this establishes a presumption that can be rebutted.
Accordingly, subsection 1(3) of the 1988 Act deems that there will be compliance with subsection (1) unless the contrary is proved, and section 7 of the Interpretation Act deems service of the letter to have been effected at a time when it would have been delivered in the ordinary course of post, defined as after two business days, unless the contrary is proved. The effect is that there is a rebuttable presumption that service has been effected in the ordinary course of post.
(1A) A notice required by this section to be served on any person may be served on that person -
(a) by delivering it to him;
(b) by addressing it to him and leaving it at his last known address; or
(c) by sending it by registered post, recorded delivery service or first class post addressed to him at his last known address."
It is only since 1994, when this section was introduced by the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act, that service by first class post has been permitted. Prior to that service by post had to be effected by using registered post or recorded delivery.
Subsection 1(3) then specifies:
"The requirement of subsection (1) above shall in every case be deemed to have been complied with unless and until the contrary is proved."
Accordingly, the burden is placed on the defendant to show that there has been no compliance with the requirements.
These provisions do not in terms provide when the notice is served. That is a matter of fact. However, section 7 of the Interpretation Act creates a presumption that letters sent by post will be delivered in the ordinary course of post. It states:
"Where an Act authorises or requires any document to be served by post (whether the expression 'serve' or the expression 'give' or 'send' or any other expression is used) then, unless the contrary intention appears, the service is deemed to be effected by properly addressing, pre-paying and posting a letter containing the document and, unless the contrary is proved, to have been effected at the time at which the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post."
What constitutes the "ordinary course of post" in this context is set down in a Practice Direction, and for first class mail it is the second working day after posting.
Again, therefore, this establishes a presumption that can be rebutted.
Accordingly, subsection 1(3) of the 1988 Act deems that there will be compliance with subsection (1) unless the contrary is proved, and section 7 of the Interpretation Act deems service of the letter to have been effected at a time when it would have been delivered in the ordinary course of post, defined as after two business days, unless the contrary is proved. The effect is that there is a rebuttable presumption that service has been effected in the ordinary course of post.
Also see CrimPR 2015, rule 4.11(2)(b).
"Unless something different is shown, a document served on a person ... is served ... in the case of a document sent by first class post or by the equivalent of first class post, on the second business day after the day on which it was posted or despatched."
"Unless something different is shown, a document served on a person ... is served ... in the case of a document sent by first class post or by the equivalent of first class post, on the second business day after the day on which it was posted or despatched."
Thought I had one due but reckon I must be about clear by now. In fact thought I had two due. Really need to improve my observations, clearly they are not as good as they once were.
Most recent was 29th March in Hull. 14 days takes you to the 12th. Have since had 4 postage days. Hoping that's it done with.
Most recent was 29th March in Hull. 14 days takes you to the 12th. Have since had 4 postage days. Hoping that's it done with.
SS2. said:
The 'ordinary course of post' for 1st class mail is considered to be 2 business days.
This means that a NIP would have to be posted (1st class) no later than Day 12 for it to be presumed served on Day 14 ie the second business day after posting.
And yes, the day of the alleged offence is Day 0, not Day 1.
Thanks for clarifying that.This means that a NIP would have to be posted (1st class) no later than Day 12 for it to be presumed served on Day 14 ie the second business day after posting.
And yes, the day of the alleged offence is Day 0, not Day 1.
Edited by SS2. on Tuesday 18th April 14:44
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