Missing item in post - small claim?

[-C-]

Bit of background info for the saga.

Purchased an item through Ebay, paid for through Paypal.

Short version is the item was signed for by the courier & left outside my house somewhere, of course said item is no-where to be seen, no doubt straight in the back of the couriers van & on Ebay itself again...

Courier actually returned to house & re-carded me to say he had left the parcel outside my house & apparently admitted to signing for it on my behalf to the local depot when I kicked off.

Now, I have to deal with the shop I bought with, as my contract is with them. Ebay & Paypal have wiped their hands of any case as the item is 'signed for' in their eyes. Shop will no longer communicate with me, as they are under no obligation to other than a moral one (clearly they don't have any!).

Given the item was not of small value (~£500) what are my options now? Can I threaten to take the shop to the small claims court over this?

[Keldemebeh]

Surely it's the courier's fault, so why should the shop be held responsible?

[budgie smuggler]

Keldemebeh said:

Surely it's the courier's fault, so why should the shop be held responsible?

Because they employed the courier.

[LordHaveMurci]

Paypal SHOULD get involved here as effectively the parcel was NOT signed for.

I'd be contacting the seller & advising them that you will be taking small claims action against them unless they resolve the issue, in all probability they will have a fight on their hands with the courier but that's not your problem, or shouldn't be anyway.

[essIII]

Surely the shop should refund you and then take the matter up with the courier.

I recently bought some new brake calipers through eBay - they didn't arrive, I contacted the seller, they said the courier were st, sent me out another set and presumably chased the courier to cover the costs of the original set.

The only thing clouding this is the signature. I'm amazed Paypal would was their hands of this if you told them that although the item was signed for, it was signed for by the delivery driver himself - they're normally very much on the side of the buyer in cases like this.

[Keldemebeh]

budgie smuggler said:

Because they employed the courier.

I see, every day is a school day!

[PurpleMoonlight]

Keldemebeh said:

I see, every day is a school day!

The delivery contract is between the seller and the delivery company.

The purchase contract is between the seller and the OP.

The OP cannot therefore sue the delivery company, he can only sue the seller.

The seller can sue the delivery company.

[-C-]

LordHaveMurci said:

Paypal SHOULD get involved here as effectively the parcel was NOT signed for.

I'd be contacting the seller & advising them that you will be taking small claims action against them unless they resolve the issue, in all probability they will have a fight on their hands with the courier but that's not your problem, or shouldn't be anyway.

They have a signature - that's all they care about. I've had this before with a dispute - I do partially understand their point of view in that anyone living at the property could sign for a parcel & the recipient could claim non delivery.

However their blanket 'signed for, not our problem' mentality has wound me up a treat - the courier has all but admitted it's their fault, but getting this as actual progression is proving to be challenging. Obviously for reference, I opened a PP dispute but lost it on the above information.

I am guessing I can threaten & potentially carry out legal action then? If it was £20, I wouldn't be bothered, but for £500, its the principal of the matter.

[LordHaveMurci]

-C- said:

They have a signature - that's all they care about. I've had this before with a dispute - I do partially understand their point of view in that anyone living at the property could sign for a parcel & the recipient could claim non delivery.

However their blanket 'signed for, not our problem' mentality has wound me up a treat - the courier has all but admitted it's their fault, but getting this as actual progression is proving to be challenging. Obviously for reference, I opened a PP dispute but lost it on the above information.

I am guessing I can threaten & potentially carry out legal action then? If it was £20, I wouldn't be bothered, but for £500, its the principal of the matter.

You have paid for the receipt of goods, if those goods fail to arrive then it is the sellers responsibility to replace or refund THEN chase their courier up.

Some couriers will try to deny liability, we've had it before & we ended up letting them take us to Small Claims Court after taking legal advice. We won.
The solicitor we spoke to read their T's & C's & said we didn't have a leg to stand on, take it to court
He went on to explain that no court in the land would uphold those T's & C's as they were so one sided & unfair.

[-C-]

So would the approach be to threaten small claims court action with the shop in this instance?

[LordHaveMurci]

-C- said:

So would the approach be to threaten small claims court action with the shop in this instance?

Not sure I'd threaten, I'd advise them that is the next course of action you'll be forced to take should they not reimburse you for goods not received.

[-C-]

Fair enough - i'll get creating a response. Thanks

[Du1point8]

LordHaveMurci said:

-C- said:

So would the approach be to threaten small claims court action with the shop in this instance?

Not sure I'd threaten, I'd advise them that is the next course of action you'll be forced to take should they not reimburse you for goods not received.

This++

Im a seller and every time a courier fks up the order (stacking paint cans that split, damage to goods) I always sort it out at my own cost as customer comes first then I have to take it up with the courier and get the cost price off them and any unnecessary extras (2nd delivery, etc).

I cant understand why the shop thinks its ok to ignore you.

[catman]

Clearly, as the Courier Company have provided a signature for delivery, the supplier thinks that you're trying to scam them.

I would scan the cards and send them to the supplier, with an account of the conversations you have had with the Couriers, including the name of the courier who signed for the delivery if possible.

Give them 7 days to refund or replace and then send a letter before action. Send copies to Ebay/ Paypal too.

Tim

[48k]

-C- said:

Courier actually returned to house & re-carded me to say he had left the parcel outside my house & apparently admitted to signing for it on my behalf to the local depot when I kicked off

Do you have a record of that bit?
Otherwise I fear it's just going to be one persons word against another.

[Boosted LS1]

The seller is responsible for delivery and has to prove that it was received by the purchaser. A signature that isn't the op's won't stand up to scrutiny should the matter reach the county court imo.

[xjay1337]

I had exactly the same thing with Auto Performance. Tracking said signed for. No package delivered.

One call to AP and they had a replacement consignment out next day for me.

[A205GTI]

Send them a copy of your signature and ask for a copy of the signature that signed for the goods that would usually tell them, but agree poor service by seller as it is his responsibility to ensure goods are delivered.

[Who me ?]

e bay- contact seller and suggest either a replacement , or negative feedback. Most sellers are keen to avoid negative FB as it affects sales.

[wibble cb]

Hermes recently 'delivered' a parcel for me to my dads address, said it was left safely in the back porch.....my fathers house doesn't have a porch (front or back)....thankfully the seller refunded me and sent another which mercifully did turn up correctly, but again labelled as left safely in the back porch...!