Contentious Probate
Discussion
Looking for someone who has experience of this.
My wife has filed for probate on her late mothers estate to be met with a caveat, this has been lodged by MiL step daughter who has been provided for under the will.
Will was drawn up in 2012 by a local firm of solicitors, local solicitor has been contacted but has advised us that she can't act for my wife, but needs her consent to release the files to the step daughters solicitor.
Slight fly in the ointment, wife is due to commence treatment for cancer next week, so not going to be in great shape for a while.
Any thoughts or recommendations on a good solicitor?
My wife has filed for probate on her late mothers estate to be met with a caveat, this has been lodged by MiL step daughter who has been provided for under the will.
Will was drawn up in 2012 by a local firm of solicitors, local solicitor has been contacted but has advised us that she can't act for my wife, but needs her consent to release the files to the step daughters solicitor.
Slight fly in the ointment, wife is due to commence treatment for cancer next week, so not going to be in great shape for a while.
Any thoughts or recommendations on a good solicitor?
1. I wish your wife well with her treatment
2. I take it relations with the caveator aren't good?
3. Consider putting the treatment first & doing nothing about the will. Let the caveator do her stuff for a bit and wait until you know what she is after. If she does nothing in 6 months then the caveat could expire
No lawyer btw, so don't act on this as any sort of advice
2. I take it relations with the caveator aren't good?
3. Consider putting the treatment first & doing nothing about the will. Let the caveator do her stuff for a bit and wait until you know what she is after. If she does nothing in 6 months then the caveat could expire
No lawyer btw, so don't act on this as any sort of advice
JPJPJP said:
3. Consider putting the treatment first & doing nothing about the will. Let the caveator do her stuff for a bit and wait until you know what she is after. If she does nothing in 6 months then the caveat could expire
Firstly, I hope all goes well for your wife.I'd concur with point 3.
Why do people get so arsey about wills?
Your wife has more important and urgent things to think about but she does need to instruct a solicitor IMO to watch her interests, for example advising whether she needs to do anything specific (IIRC HMRC want their pound of flesh within a given period) or indeed whether she is under any obligation prior to grant of probate to show any papers to the caveator. IIRC, after 6 months the caveat automatically lapses unless a court says or does otherwise.
Peter
psi310398 said:
IIRC, after 6 months the caveat automatically lapses unless a court says or does otherwise.
A caveat does indeed last for six months.However the problem for the person who wants to apply for the Grant is that the caveator can renew it as often as they like.
http://www.anthonygold.co.uk/latest/blog/how-to-pr...
That can potentially cause big problems in settling the estate.
The prospective executor/administrator can challenge it by issuing a warning.
http://www.anthonygold.co.uk/latest/blog/how-do-yo...
The caveator then has to decide whether to defend the challenge.
http://www.anthonygold.co.uk/latest/blog/defending...
Much will depend on whether the caveator has good grounds or is just being an awkward ****
Issuing a warning will force them into the open and make them justify their reason/s for issuing the caveat.
Nobody on here can tell whether the stepdaughter has valid grounds. The OP's wife is the only one who may know the back story.
As said, she needs to obtain professional advice to protect her interests: in particular whether or not to enter a warning.
HMRC will only be wanting their pound of flesh if the value of the estate exceeds the IHT threshold..
http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/inheritanc...
As others have said, hope the treatment gives well.
The course of action depends a bit in the estate size.
If it's less than say 50k, especially if that's to be shared, be in no hurry, a messy legal debate can eat into the value.
If it's over say 200k, with an unoccupied property etc appoint a decent solicitor and get them to do the executor work on your behalf. An unoccupied property needs maintenance and costs money, something you don't want on your plate.
The course of action depends a bit in the estate size.
If it's less than say 50k, especially if that's to be shared, be in no hurry, a messy legal debate can eat into the value.
If it's over say 200k, with an unoccupied property etc appoint a decent solicitor and get them to do the executor work on your behalf. An unoccupied property needs maintenance and costs money, something you don't want on your plate.
Red Devil said:
Nobody on here can tell whether the stepdaughter has valid grounds. The OP's wife is the only one who may know the back story.
As said, she needs to obtain professional advice to protect her interests: in particular whether or not to enter a warning.
This.As said, she needs to obtain professional advice to protect her interests: in particular whether or not to enter a warning.
I do a reasonable amount of contentious probate work and it's far from uncommon for an aggrieved relative to Google it or take limited initial advice from a solicitor and find out a caveat can be entered with very little effort and at minimal cost. It doesn't mean that there is any substance to the caveator's claim - the Probate Registry simply processes the application, it doesn't consider what underlies it.
When your wife's health allows, take some initial advice of your own. You could in the meantime write to the caveator and ask her to set out the reason for entering it and what claim she believes she has.
Happy to help with some (free unofficial) further guidance as and when circumstances allow and you have more info, if you want to drop me an e-mail through my profile, OP.
Many thanks for all the well wishes and for the advice both on and off the forum.
I always knew my MiL was a smart articulate formidable woman, the notes taken by her solicitor of many years are comprehensive, she has clearly articulated the reasons for the changes and none of them suggest coercion.
My wife is of the view that things can just sit as they are for now, the MiL property is close by and we pop in regularly, will look towards getting some insurance just in case, but if the property sits empty for a year then so be it, her energy is needed elsewhere for now.
I always knew my MiL was a smart articulate formidable woman, the notes taken by her solicitor of many years are comprehensive, she has clearly articulated the reasons for the changes and none of them suggest coercion.
My wife is of the view that things can just sit as they are for now, the MiL property is close by and we pop in regularly, will look towards getting some insurance just in case, but if the property sits empty for a year then so be it, her energy is needed elsewhere for now.
Lurking Lawyer said:
Red Devil said:
Nobody on here can tell whether the stepdaughter has valid grounds. The OP's wife is the only one who may know the back story.
As said, she needs to obtain professional advice to protect her interests: in particular whether or not to enter a warning.
This.As said, she needs to obtain professional advice to protect her interests: in particular whether or not to enter a warning.
I do a reasonable amount of contentious probate work and it's far from uncommon for an aggrieved relative to Google it or take limited initial advice from a solicitor and find out a caveat can be entered with very little effort and at minimal cost. It doesn't mean that there is any substance to the caveator's claim - the Probate Registry simply processes the application, it doesn't consider what underlies it.
When your wife's health allows, take some initial advice of your own. You could in the meantime write to the caveator and ask her to set out the reason for entering it and what claim she believes she has.
Happy to help with some (free unofficial) further guidance as and when circumstances allow and you have more info, if you want to drop me an e-mail through my profile, OP.
Red Devil said:
HMRC will only be wanting their pound of flesh if the value of the estate exceeds the IHT threshold..
http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/inheritanc...
And if it does, in my recent experience HMRC will take 8 weeks to assign you an IHT reference number, without which you can't pay any IHT and hence can't apply for probate*, then when they do finally assign a reference number and you transfer the initial IHT amount to them it will take a further 6 weeks for them to send back the acknowledgement that then allows you to apply for probate.http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/inheritanc...
* Actually that's not quite true. My solicitor put in the probate application which was held in limbo until the IHT acknowledgement was received, at which point the probate office issued probate within a week.
Initially you have to pay all of the non-property IHT straight away. There is a six month time limit on that, starting from the end of the month in which the deceased died. Then for the property IHT you can choose to pay in ten annual instalments until the property sells, at which point you must pay the remaining balance.
Dr Mike Oxgreen said:
Red Devil said:
HMRC will only be wanting their pound of flesh if the value of the estate exceeds the IHT threshold..
http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/inheritanc...
And if it does, in my recent experience HMRC will take 8 weeks to assign you an IHT reference number, without which you can't pay any IHT and hence can't apply for probate*, then when they do finally assign a reference number and you transfer the initial IHT amount to them it will take a further 6 weeks for them to send back the acknowledgement that then allows you to apply for probate.http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/inheritanc...
* Actually that's not quite true. My solicitor put in the probate application which was held in limbo until the IHT acknowledgement was received, at which point the probate office issued probate within a week.
Initially you have to pay all of the non-property IHT straight away. There is a six month time limit on that, starting from the end of the month in which the deceased died. Then for the property IHT you can choose to pay in ten annual instalments until the property sells, at which point you must pay the remaining balance.
Dr Mike Oxgreen said:
And if it does, in my recent experience HMRC will take 8 weeks to assign you an IHT reference number, without which you can't pay any IHT and hence can't apply for probate*, then when they do finally assign a reference number and you transfer the initial IHT amount to them it will take a further 6 weeks for them to send back the acknowledgement that then allows you to apply for probate.
I don't know how much difference it makes if there is an IHT liability but wrapping up my mum's affairs recently I was asked if I wanted to do it online as part of a beta test. Worked fine and got the reference number to allow probate to proceed straight away.Update
Almost 2 years after I applied for probate the Grant has been issued.
It has been a long and expensive legal process, which didn’t go all the way to court as the party who originally lodged the Caveat conceded providing I meet all my incurred costs.
In the process I had to obtain my mums medical records which for me was heart wrenching as it felt like a gross invasion of her privacy, the other party tried to claim that my mum didn’t have breast cancer and I forced her in to having unnecessary surgery such was my undue influence.
I was fortunate to secure a solicitor who has provided me with an excellent service and made a very difficult time easier to navigate.
As for my own health, I’m recovering from further surgery but against the odds I’m still here
Almost 2 years after I applied for probate the Grant has been issued.
It has been a long and expensive legal process, which didn’t go all the way to court as the party who originally lodged the Caveat conceded providing I meet all my incurred costs.
In the process I had to obtain my mums medical records which for me was heart wrenching as it felt like a gross invasion of her privacy, the other party tried to claim that my mum didn’t have breast cancer and I forced her in to having unnecessary surgery such was my undue influence.
I was fortunate to secure a solicitor who has provided me with an excellent service and made a very difficult time easier to navigate.
As for my own health, I’m recovering from further surgery but against the odds I’m still here
Tumbler said:
Update
Almost 2 years after I applied for probate the Grant has been issued.
It has been a long and expensive legal process, which didn’t go all the way to court as the party who originally lodged the Caveat conceded providing I meet all my incurred costs.
In the process I had to obtain my mums medical records which for me was heart wrenching as it felt like a gross invasion of her privacy, the other party tried to claim that my mum didn’t have breast cancer and I forced her in to having unnecessary surgery such was my undue influence.
I was fortunate to secure a solicitor who has provided me with an excellent service and made a very difficult time easier to navigate.
As for my own health, I’m recovering from further surgery but against the odds I’m still here
Good news on both fronts!Almost 2 years after I applied for probate the Grant has been issued.
It has been a long and expensive legal process, which didn’t go all the way to court as the party who originally lodged the Caveat conceded providing I meet all my incurred costs.
In the process I had to obtain my mums medical records which for me was heart wrenching as it felt like a gross invasion of her privacy, the other party tried to claim that my mum didn’t have breast cancer and I forced her in to having unnecessary surgery such was my undue influence.
I was fortunate to secure a solicitor who has provided me with an excellent service and made a very difficult time easier to navigate.
As for my own health, I’m recovering from further surgery but against the odds I’m still here
It's a shame that wills seem to encourage throbbers to come crawling out of the woodwork.
I hope you now have peace to continue your recovery.
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