Prohibited right turns and U-turns
Discussion
TfL says:
When using the red route you will see signs with a red outer circle, they have the following meaning:
No right turn sign
Can do
Go ahead or make a left hand turn.
Can't do
Turn right.
no mention of no U turns except at the specific sign.
No idea whether this is only in London though.
ETA: It seems fair to assume that as there is a specific sign for No U turns that a No right turn sign would not take its place or count for both.
When using the red route you will see signs with a red outer circle, they have the following meaning:
No right turn sign
Can do
Go ahead or make a left hand turn.
Can't do
Turn right.
no mention of no U turns except at the specific sign.
No idea whether this is only in London though.
ETA: It seems fair to assume that as there is a specific sign for No U turns that a No right turn sign would not take its place or count for both.
Edited by Pothole on Tuesday 20th February 13:17
jamei303 said:
Does a 'no right turn' sign on a dual carriageway also prohibit a U-turn?
I am pretty sure it doesn't, because although you are turning around and crossing to the other half of the carriageway, you are not leaving the road and turning right into the side road.
simple answer - no I am pretty sure it doesn't, because although you are turning around and crossing to the other half of the carriageway, you are not leaving the road and turning right into the side road.
you need a sign prohibiting u-turns to actually prohibit u-turns...
it would seem strange though to have a situation where you could u-turn / not right-turn unless the turning is no-entry, meaning that oncoming traffic also can't left-turn there... as to u-turn is more disruptive to oncoming traffic than a right-turn when you are across and away...
if there is a space in the dual carriageway, and they are banned, then it would normally only be allowing traffic from the right-hand turning to come across (or oncoming traffic to right-turn / u-turn) in either case, the road layout would normally discourage your use by not having a slip / gradual entry into the gap...
I've been in a car where the driver has approached a "no right turn" sign at a junction, and simply manoeuvred his car to turn left through 270° to use the road off to the right!
I told him I was pretty certain it wasn't legal to carry out the manoeuvre, to which he replied: "Why?.......I haven't turned right at any time!"
I told him I was pretty certain it wasn't legal to carry out the manoeuvre, to which he replied: "Why?.......I haven't turned right at any time!"
Alucidnation said:
What was written on your ticket op?
Didn't get a ticket, just performed the above manoeuvrer after debating the legalities in my head for a few seconds. It would be good to know definitively for future reference.The actual situation was traffic lights with the right-turn lane coned off and a temporary no right turn sign.
I made a picture at work because I'm bored:
jamei303 said:
I can't find any legal definition of the "no right turn" sign other than "no right turn". Maybe that's it and it's down to case law?
why should it be down to case law...no right turn means no right turn
no u-turn means no u-turn
the two are not the same
if you shouldn't do either, then either the junction will be blocked off, or both signs will show...
why would one sign also mean what another sign means?
you might be over thinking it!
looks valid
like the neat segregation of red cars in one direction and silver in the other direction...
(good diagram!)Right turns. Got caught a few weeks ago doing such. See below.
I was exiting the B&Q car park at the Romford store, and basically wanted to turn right at the car park exit. Except there is a No Right Turn sign, so you have to go left, around the roundabout, and then proceed to the A12. Except, on this occasion, a mini car transporter was blocking the roundabout, causing a mini traffic jam. It looked as if he's over shot the entrance to Sytners BMW dealer forecourt. So, seeing the prescribed exit route effectively blocked, I turned right. Have a look at the lamppost opposite. Yes, a bloody camera. So a £65 fine lands on my mat a few weeks later. Would the enforcement office believe my story? Basically no, get stuffed.
I was exiting the B&Q car park at the Romford store, and basically wanted to turn right at the car park exit. Except there is a No Right Turn sign, so you have to go left, around the roundabout, and then proceed to the A12. Except, on this occasion, a mini car transporter was blocking the roundabout, causing a mini traffic jam. It looked as if he's over shot the entrance to Sytners BMW dealer forecourt. So, seeing the prescribed exit route effectively blocked, I turned right. Have a look at the lamppost opposite. Yes, a bloody camera. So a £65 fine lands on my mat a few weeks later. Would the enforcement office believe my story? Basically no, get stuffed.
jamei303 said:
Does a 'no right turn' sign on a dual carriageway also prohibit a U-turn?
I am pretty sure it doesn't, because although you are turning around and crossing to the other half of the carriageway, you are not leaving the road and turning right into the side road.
The fact that near me both are specifically prohibited probably means your are overthinking things and it would be a little difficult to enforce as it's not visibly prohibited or clear in the HC.I am pretty sure it doesn't, because although you are turning around and crossing to the other half of the carriageway, you are not leaving the road and turning right into the side road.
Seesure said:
jamei303 said:
Does a 'no right turn' sign on a dual carriageway also prohibit a U-turn?
I am pretty sure it doesn't, because although you are turning around and crossing to the other half of the carriageway, you are not leaving the road and turning right into the side road.
The fact that near me both are specifically prohibited probably means your are overthinking things and it would be a little difficult to enforce as it's not visibly prohibited or clear in the HC.I am pretty sure it doesn't, because although you are turning around and crossing to the other half of the carriageway, you are not leaving the road and turning right into the side road.
jamei303 said:
Alucidnation said:
What was written on your ticket op?
Didn't get a ticket, just performed the above manoeuvrer after debating the legalities in my head for a few seconds. It would be good to know definitively for future reference.The actual situation was traffic lights with the right-turn lane coned off and a temporary no right turn sign.
I made a picture at work because I'm bored:
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