How to get a copy of a Will?
Discussion
I am after some advice regarding tracing a Will for a mate (yes really!) who is a direct descendant of the deceased. (year of death was 2008)
I have looked on the Gov.uk website probate search and the death doesn't show up at all. I'm sure it must have gone to probate as lots of property and money involved, however my mate was told before his relative died that a property had been put into trust with him as the sole beneficiary and not sure if that will affect probate? Also the deceased's spouse is still alive and lives in the property which is supposed to be in trust, so perhaps if everything was left to the spouse then maybe that affects probate? I don't know.
Anyway, if anyone can shed any light on how one might go about tracing a Will or finding out if said property has been left in trust of some kind then please do let me know.
Unfortunately asking other surviving family members has not proved fruitful and is no longer an option for reasons I am not fully aware of.
I suspect the best advice would be to get solicitors involved, but I'm hoping there might be other options before going down that route.
I have looked on the Gov.uk website probate search and the death doesn't show up at all. I'm sure it must have gone to probate as lots of property and money involved, however my mate was told before his relative died that a property had been put into trust with him as the sole beneficiary and not sure if that will affect probate? Also the deceased's spouse is still alive and lives in the property which is supposed to be in trust, so perhaps if everything was left to the spouse then maybe that affects probate? I don't know.
Anyway, if anyone can shed any light on how one might go about tracing a Will or finding out if said property has been left in trust of some kind then please do let me know.
Unfortunately asking other surviving family members has not proved fruitful and is no longer an option for reasons I am not fully aware of.
I suspect the best advice would be to get solicitors involved, but I'm hoping there might be other options before going down that route.
If probate has been granted the will is a public document and a copy can be obtained from the probate office for a small sum, £10 I think.
Probate isn't needed for small estates but is required where property is involved , unless this is owned as 'joint tenants' in which case the surviving tenant/s automatically become the owners..
If no probate has been granted It is possible that the deceased disposed of all his properties( into trust or otherwise) before death or that he owned them as a joint tenant.
It is also possible that whoever was the executor has not, for whatever reason, applied for probate or settled the estate and has simply let sleeping dogs lie.
Probate isn't needed for small estates but is required where property is involved , unless this is owned as 'joint tenants' in which case the surviving tenant/s automatically become the owners..
If no probate has been granted It is possible that the deceased disposed of all his properties( into trust or otherwise) before death or that he owned them as a joint tenant.
It is also possible that whoever was the executor has not, for whatever reason, applied for probate or settled the estate and has simply let sleeping dogs lie.
konark said:
If probate has been granted the will is a public document and a copy can be obtained from the probate office for a small sum, £10 I think.
Yep, a tenner - https://www.gov.uk/search-will-probateIf the parents (or any one else) lived in the house, but gave it to the offspring (or others) on the condition that the parents could live there until they died or voluntarily left, then that condition would have been written into the land register for that property (if sold, then that condition would be removed). If said mate had known that, he would have had a copy, and would have to have signed a trust to that effect. As the house seems to have changed ownership, then the details in the land register would probably have been re-written. However, a search at the Land Registry would reveal details for a fee (used to be £3). That should be an initial start as well. At some stage a solicitor would most likely be needed
https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/land-r...
https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/land-r...
It is possible the spouse has been given a 'life interest' in the property which then passes to your friend on her (spouse's) death, this is dpne by a trust.
As Pica Pica has said the land registry records for the house in question would be a good starting point.
If they are in the spouse's name then it's game over.
If they detail the life interest, remainderman (your friend) and the trust then he will inherit the house, but it's strange how no-one has officially told him.
My money is on the 3rd option, they are still in the deceased's name and nothing has been done to settle the estate.
As Pica Pica has said the land registry records for the house in question would be a good starting point.
If they are in the spouse's name then it's game over.
If they detail the life interest, remainderman (your friend) and the trust then he will inherit the house, but it's strange how no-one has officially told him.
My money is on the 3rd option, they are still in the deceased's name and nothing has been done to settle the estate.
Thanks for all the replies so far.
As mentioned in the first post, I have already looked on the gov.uk probate site and nothing shows up to do with the death at all. Is there anywhere else that a death might be registered where a copy of the will could also be?
Following the land registry link above I have got a copy of the land registry for the 2 adjoining properties that the deceased owned (they were both supposedly in trust with each child set to inherit a house each after the death of both parents) and it lists the daughter in law and grandson as joint owners of both properties. Ownership was registered to them 4 years after the death. No mention on the land registry of any trust or anything - is there a seperate 'trust register' of some kind where I can do some searching?
Unfortunately the above news has proved devastating to my mate and his family as they are now convinced that they are being totally cut out of any inheritance. My view is that if they can somehow prove that the deceased's wish was for each of his children to inherit a house by finding the trust paperwork or getting a copy of his will - then it is worth talking to a solicitor regarding taking it further. Does that sound sensible?
Mate remembers seeing some kind of 'trust' paperwork soon after the death, but was never given a copy.
EDIT: Assuming the house was put into some kind of trust, how could the other child have changed the ownership of the property? surely they wouldn't be able to due to the trust?
As mentioned in the first post, I have already looked on the gov.uk probate site and nothing shows up to do with the death at all. Is there anywhere else that a death might be registered where a copy of the will could also be?
Following the land registry link above I have got a copy of the land registry for the 2 adjoining properties that the deceased owned (they were both supposedly in trust with each child set to inherit a house each after the death of both parents) and it lists the daughter in law and grandson as joint owners of both properties. Ownership was registered to them 4 years after the death. No mention on the land registry of any trust or anything - is there a seperate 'trust register' of some kind where I can do some searching?
Unfortunately the above news has proved devastating to my mate and his family as they are now convinced that they are being totally cut out of any inheritance. My view is that if they can somehow prove that the deceased's wish was for each of his children to inherit a house by finding the trust paperwork or getting a copy of his will - then it is worth talking to a solicitor regarding taking it further. Does that sound sensible?
Mate remembers seeing some kind of 'trust' paperwork soon after the death, but was never given a copy.
EDIT: Assuming the house was put into some kind of trust, how could the other child have changed the ownership of the property? surely they wouldn't be able to due to the trust?
Edited by Hi on Sunday 15th July 21:50
Any trust would probably have been lodged with a solicitor. So it may be worth asking solicitors local to the property. I am not sure what they are legally obliged to tell you.
I would start by going to a solicitor with a copy of your passport and getting them to sign that as being you. A driving licence and recent utility bill may be worth taking. Quite a few will do this for a nominal fee, I had it done for free (when selling my Mum’s house - that was a separate solicitor to the one doing the sale, so he had no interest or gain).
Then go asking at local solicitors to see if they have any trust.
Someone may have a better suggestion for this, but that may be a start.
I would start by going to a solicitor with a copy of your passport and getting them to sign that as being you. A driving licence and recent utility bill may be worth taking. Quite a few will do this for a nominal fee, I had it done for free (when selling my Mum’s house - that was a separate solicitor to the one doing the sale, so he had no interest or gain).
Then go asking at local solicitors to see if they have any trust.
Someone may have a better suggestion for this, but that may be a start.
Pica-Pica said:
Any trust would probably have been lodged with a solicitor. So it may be worth asking solicitors local to the property. I am not sure what they are legally obliged to tell you.
A solicitor's first duty is to his/her client. Confidentality is paramount.I can't see any way to obtain disclosure except by order of a court.
What grounds could the OP's mate cite?
If there is a trust, I'm pretty sure he isn't a trustee.
Hi said:
Following the land registry link above I have got a copy of the land registry for the 2 adjoining properties that the deceased owned (they were both supposedly in trust with each child set to inherit a house each after the death of both parents) and it lists the daughter in law and grandson as joint owners of both properties.
That's weird. How has the title devolved to a daughter-in-law and also skipped a generation?Even more so if the deceased's spouse is still alive!
I'm afraid your mate is going to struggle to get a copy of any will.
It remains a private document until it has been probated when it becomes a matter of public record.
researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN03194/SN03194.pdf
Was the deceased's spouse an administrator/executrix of his estate?
If so, only an appeal to her to find out the score might be successful.
Bear in mind that she doesn't have to tell you anything if she is not minded to.
Hi said:
Unfortunately asking other surviving family members has not proved fruitful and is no longer an option for reasons I am not fully aware of.
There are endless possibilities. One extreme might be because somebody has been up to no good.Litigating over an estate can be an expensive business. As anyone who has read Bleak House will appreciate.
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