Can/Should Trackers be Used to Prosecute Motorists?
Discussion
All the dash cam threads got me thinking about the fact that all our four wheeled vehicles have trackers and occasionally I like to drive briskly. The app for one of the trackers shows journey details including maximum and average speeds. Can plod use this data to prosecute, and if not, does anyone think they should or will in the future be allowed to?
In short, yes, if the proper process is followed.
I'm regularly receiving various court/police/HMRC/NCA requests to provide tracker information from the fleet that I manage, and it does end up getting used as evidence, albeit it tends to be linked more to organised crime than speeding.
I'm regularly receiving various court/police/HMRC/NCA requests to provide tracker information from the fleet that I manage, and it does end up getting used as evidence, albeit it tends to be linked more to organised crime than speeding.
You've got no real expectation of privacy if you're driving a vehicle supplied for you by work. It is after all their car. (Same goes for using their laptop, phone, and all that. You almost certainly signed something at some point to signal your acceptance of this.)
If you want to commit a criminal offence, safest to buy your own equipment
If you want to commit a criminal offence, safest to buy your own equipment
Baldchap said:
All the dash cam threads got me thinking about the fact that all our four wheeled vehicles have trackers and occasionally I like to drive briskly. The app for one of the trackers shows journey details including maximum and average speeds. Can plod use this data to prosecute, and if not, does anyone think they should or will in the future be allowed to?
They likely can use the evidence but I wouldn't want anymore personal information being given away. The world is already mad enough!to3m said:
You've got no real expectation of privacy if you're driving a vehicle supplied for you by work. It is after all their car. (Same goes for using their laptop, phone, and all that. You almost certainly signed something at some point to signal your acceptance of this.)
If you want to commit a criminal offence, safest to buy your own equipment
And if you're not driving a vehicle supplied for you by work? Should details of your movements be accessible by yet another loosely regulated group? Surely we have far too many of those organisations already? If you want to commit a criminal offence, safest to buy your own equipment
Not sure speeding is classed as a criminal offence.
Cold said:
And if you're not driving a vehicle supplied for you by work? Should details of your movements be accessible by yet another loosely regulated group? Surely we have far too many of those organisations already?
If it's your own car, I rather agree, though to be honest I'm a bit unsure how much privacy you can expect when driving your car in practice. Each one does after all have a unique registration plate that can be seen by anybody with one or more functioning eyes.This case however appears to be vehicles owned by one's employer (pool cars, company vans, etc.?), or in some kind of fleet arrangement (company car?). In my view, much more cut and dried. Not your vehicle, somebody else is paying for it, and the owner has a right to keep an eye on what you're doing with it. You might like to try to get them to stop, and they might agree, but I don't see they should feel any obligation.
Cold said:
Not sure speeding is classed as a criminal offence.
A good rule of thumb is that if the police can charge you for it at their discretion, it's a criminal offence...I don't think your company would jump straight to prosecution. Surely you are a valued employee and as such would be given a couple of warnings before being dismissed? Only if you ignore the warnings would there be further action. I doubt the company would want its employees in court as witnesses, so dismissal is a more likely course of action.
to3m said:
This case however appears to be vehicles owned by one's employer (pool cars, company vans, etc.?), or in some kind of fleet arrangement (company car?). In my view, much more cut and dried. Not your vehicle, somebody else is paying for it, and the owner has a right to keep an eye on what you're doing with it. You might like to try to get them to stop, and they might agree, but I don't see they should feel any obligation.
It's also worth remembering that every employer has a duty of care and this extends to members of the public. If one of the employees is driving in a manner that puts others at risk, then the company has an obligation to mitigate that. The tracker system we utilise will show detailed reports on driving styles, how many times limits have been exceeded, excessive braking etc. It's dressed up as an "eco-score", but many use it to identify higher risk drivers.
Most of the time it is the company putting more and more pressure on the individuals to meet and exceed targets. I very much doubt many companies would string up an employee for tracker type speeding infringements. I'd say duty of care is quite far down the list, with profit and loss somewhat more important, maybe I am wrong?. The world is getting more mental every day, to think that an employer would now b
k you for speeding, as well as the Police, and all the road warriors with dash cams, basically, the general public, and I fear a large percentage of people on PH, actually don't like driving very much!
k you for speeding, as well as the Police, and all the road warriors with dash cams, basically, the general public, and I fear a large percentage of people on PH, actually don't like driving very much! speedking31 said:
I don't think your company would jump straight to prosecution. Surely you are a valued employee and as such would be given a couple of warnings before being dismissed? Only if you ignore the warnings would there be further action. I doubt the company would want its employees in court as witnesses, so dismissal is a more likely course of action.
About 10 years ago the company i worked for at the time introduced trackers to the company vans / cars to monitor what the staff were actually doing during work hours, and also to discourage use of the company vehicle outside of their working hours too.In the first month of the trackers being fitted quite a few of them were pulled up for various speeding offences but nothing ever came of that other than a verbal warning. The trackers did however stop some of the reps / fitters from doing things like playing golf, going to the pub, etc, when they should have been working.
However the best ones were a rep from Norfolk who managed to get himself sacked for using the company car to visit a well known red light type area at least 3 nights a week (must have been interesting explaining that to HR in an exit interview
) and another rep who used to lend his 3 series company car to his son in the evenings / weekends - who ended up using it to deal drugs from Almost everything can be used in evidence including "Tracker" Data. It would need to meet best evidence rules and reliability and accuracy would need to be tested in any prosecution.
I think it would be highly unlikely to form the main evidence in a prosecution but could well be supporting evidence. That seems fair in some ways as if you were accused of doing ludicrous speed and Tracker data seemed to show otherwise you would want to use it. Its difficult to allow that but say it could never be used to support a prosecution. It's also empirical evidence which is usually less emotive.
Anyone can give police Data for a number of reasons, including the prevention or detection of crime, if they request it in the correct way without violating privacy. Their is no sanction if they do not but The Police and criminal evidence act reiterated that there is a common law obligation to assist the police.
The evidence could be obtained by compulsion but not readily for most run of the mill road traffic offences.
I think it would be highly unlikely to form the main evidence in a prosecution but could well be supporting evidence. That seems fair in some ways as if you were accused of doing ludicrous speed and Tracker data seemed to show otherwise you would want to use it. Its difficult to allow that but say it could never be used to support a prosecution. It's also empirical evidence which is usually less emotive.
Anyone can give police Data for a number of reasons, including the prevention or detection of crime, if they request it in the correct way without violating privacy. Their is no sanction if they do not but The Police and criminal evidence act reiterated that there is a common law obligation to assist the police.
The evidence could be obtained by compulsion but not readily for most run of the mill road traffic offences.
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