Sudden death practical advice needed

[4x4Tyke]

I need some practical advice, I just heard a couple of hours ago than my Uncle has suddenly died. My mother was notified by the Police and she is understandable devastated. So it falls on me as the second next of kin to take the stain. This is quite hard for me, my uncle was a very positive formative influence in my early life, he inspired me to go onto higher education and have a good life. However he had a lot of problems in later life with alcohol and others taking advantage of this to rip-off everything he had. I knew alcohol would kill him, so his death was sort of expected to family.

The big problem I'm facing is my first step, I gather his death is being considered sudden, but not really sure what that means. He did not have a GP (A long story that boils to alcohol induced paranoia) which seems to be a problem. We don't have a death certificate because of the circumstance and I have no idea how to get around this, everything hinges on registering the death which I seemingly cannot do without a death certificate. His body has been removed by a funeral director. What will happen next, will the corner be involved, will they provide a death certificate?

I'm not concerned about probate stuff, he had nothing of value left and I've some experience of dealing with small estates before but had death certificate readily available to start the process.

[TooMany2cvs]

If he hadn't seen a doctor fairly soon before the death, then - yes - there'll be a coroner involved to determine the cause of death.
You'll be given a green slip, and the doctor/coroner's prelim death cert, which you need to give to the registrar to register the death.

https://www.gov.uk/after-a-death/when-a-death-is-r...

[4x4Tyke]

TooMany2cvs said:

If he hadn't seen a doctor fairly soon before the death, then - yes - there'll be a coroner involved to determine the cause of death.
You'll be given a green slip, and the doctor/coroner's prelim death cert, which you need to give to the registrar to register the death.

https://www.gov.uk/after-a-death/when-a-death-is-r...

Thank you, I've read that. I guess my next step is to talk to the office of the coroner when they open tomorrow.

I was surprised that his body was taken away by a funeral director, rather than by an ambulance to the city mortuary. This was organised by the Police before I found out. Not sure if this was by mums request or by default. So will I need to organise the transfer of his body from the funeral director to the mortuary for an autopsy, or will that happen automatically through the system?

[SteveScooby]

Speak to the coroners officer tomorrow, in my area a funeral director will attend and remove the body to the mortuary at the hospital, not back to their building.

[Rushjob]

4x4Tyke said:

Thank you, I've read that. I guess my next step is to talk to the office of the coroner when they open tomorrow.

I was surprised that his body was taken away by a funeral director, rather than by an ambulance to the city mortuary. This was organised by the Police before I found out. Not sure if this was by mums request or by default. So will I need to organise the transfer of his body from the funeral director to the mortuary for an autopsy, or will that happen automatically through the system?

Firstly sorry to hear of your loss.
Theres nothing for you to do re organising where your uncle is, the procedure you refer to is the normal procedure when a person is deceased away from hospital so don't concern yourself there, your uncle will have been taken to the mortuary by the duty undertakers. As mentioned, coroners office is your point of contact, they are really helpful and will point you in the right direction re the registration and other steps to be taken over the next few days and weeks.

[4x4Tyke]

Thank you all for the advice & support, you've eased my anxiety a lot, not knowing what to do was just making my feeling of loss worse by causing me to dwell on that. I think I can work this through now and that will be a good distraction. Thank you.

[4x4Tyke]

I've found the local corners number, I'll be calling them after 9.

[Marcellus]

4x4 really sorry to hear of your loss, having been through it twice myself in recent years with close family members killed in separate accidents and then trying to pick up the pieces.

It really can be very simple for you depending on how involved you wish to be.

The easiest way is to ring the undertakers who collected the body and go make an appointment to go in to see them, in my experience this is their bread and butter and they are very good at guiding you through the process. They're on first name terms with everyone in the process (pathologist, coroner, coroner assistant, church/crematorium/grave yard) which makes everything easier.

As an outline of the process, take it as read that your Uncle will now be where he needs to be when he needs to be there;
- someone will need to positively identify your uncle (it doesn't have to be you just someone who knew him well)
- as the death was sudden there has to be an inquest.
- there will have to be a post mortem and the initial findings will be sent to the Coroner (this may take a while so for a gap to open in the schedule)
- once the coroner has this they will open an inquest, if there's a clear no question cause he may close it or if there are investigations needed may adjourn.
- regardless at this point he will release the body to the family and issue an interim death certificate (get several copies)
- you can then finalise the funeral arrangements and sort his estate out.
- if there is an inquest it's unlikely to be until February.

Hints n tips;
- Your mother will have the opportunity to see her brother later, she doesn't need to see him today or tomorrow if she's not up to it.
- if the DWP are involved contact them early.
- speak to his bank & landlord early
- don't throw any bits of paper away
- give your mother the funeral she wants for her brother
- don't forget to grieve yourself!

[ED209]

http://www.policerollofhonour.org.uk/about_us/supp...

[Hungry Pigeon]

4x4Tyke said:

I need some practical advice, I just heard a couple of hours ago than my Uncle has suddenly died. My mother was notified by the Police and she is understandable devastated. So it falls on me as the second next of kin to take the stain. This is quite hard for me, my uncle was a very positive formative influence in my early life, he inspired me to go onto higher education and have a good life. However he had a lot of problems in later life with alcohol and others taking advantage of this to rip-off everything he had. I knew alcohol would kill him, so his death was sort of expected to family.

The big problem I'm facing is my first step, I gather his death is being considered sudden, but not really sure what that means. He did not have a GP (A long story that boils to alcohol induced paranoia) which seems to be a problem. We don't have a death certificate because of the circumstance and I have no idea how to get around this, everything hinges on registering the death which I seemingly cannot do without a death certificate. His body has been removed by a funeral director. What will happen next, will the corner be involved, will they provide a death certificate?

I'm not concerned about probate stuff, he had nothing of value left and I've some experience of dealing with small estates before but had death certificate readily available to start the process.

Sorry to hear of your loss OP. I've just gone through something similar with my father, so I know what it must feel like. As others have said, try to remember the good times.

In my experience everyone involved with the process will try to make it as easy as possible for you and your mum. Don't panic!

One tip is to get lots of copies of the death certificate from the Registrar (we got a dozen as I recall), as they will be needed for his bank and all sorts of other things. It's easier, and I believe cheaper, to get them all at once than have to go back at a later date.

I hope it all goes as well as it can, and as others have said, don't forget to let yourself grieve at some point.

Best wishes

[TooMany2cvs]

Hungry Pigeon said:

One tip is to get lots of copies of the death certificate from the Registrar (we got a dozen as I recall), as they will be needed for his bank and all sorts of other things. It's easier, and I believe cheaper, to get them all at once than have to go back at a later date.

A lot cheaper. I got ten for my old man, and at one point the only one I had in my possession was the one I deliberately kept back. And he was relatively simple in terms of policies, accounts, pensions etc.

Surprisingly, not one went AWOL, unlike the in-laws.

[Toltec]

TooMany2cvs said:

Hungry Pigeon said:

One tip is to get lots of copies of the death certificate from the Registrar (we got a dozen as I recall), as they will be needed for his bank and all sorts of other things. It's easier, and I believe cheaper, to get them all at once than have to go back at a later date.

A lot cheaper. I got ten for my old man, and at one point the only one I had in my possession was the one I deliberately kept back. And he was relatively simple in terms of policies, accounts, pensions etc.

Surprisingly, not one went AWOL, unlike the in-laws.

This is a useful service too-

https://www.gov.uk/after-a-death/organisations-you...

[4x4Tyke]

Thanks guys, I spoke to the Coroner's office today and it's now all in hand, the lack of a GP means an autopsy is required but that may be a while because they have a backlog.

[JumboBeef]

4x4Tyke said:

I was surprised that his body was taken away by a funeral director, rather than by an ambulance to the city mortuary. This was organised by the Police before I found out. Not sure if this was by mums request or by default.

Ambulance don't transport bodies.

The only time ambulance will transport a body is if the person dies in a public place (and it is not suspicious) such as in the street.

I have attended many deaths, and only ever transported one in, a person who collapsed and died in a car, in a public car park.

[Byker28i]

Is this your choice of funeral director?
Are you having a burial or cremation? Whats the timeline like for cremations as we had to wait a month for the funeral as the crematorium is very busy.
Good hint for the multiple death certificate when you register the death, but that depends on circumstances. You'll need one for every bank, unless someone has power of attorney,
It's worth calling the tax office etc if he was getting benefits, a pension etc
You'll get a green form from the funeral director to take to the registrar. I found them very helpful, explained the whole process.
The registrar has a system now where she can notify everyone through a website, but I had most of it done before we got there

[4x4Tyke]

Byker28i said:

Is this your choice of funeral director?
Are you having a burial or cremation? Whats the timeline like for cremations as we had to wait a month for the funeral as the crematorium is very busy.
Good hint for the multiple death certificate when you register the death, but that depends on circumstances. You'll need one for every bank, unless someone has power of attorney,
It's worth calling the tax office etc if he was getting benefits, a pension etc
You'll get a green form from the funeral director to take to the registrar. I found them very helpful, explained the whole process.
The registrar has a system now where she can notify everyone through a website, but I had most of it done before we got there

I now know my mother broke down when the Police called and they selected a funeral director from the top of a duty list. My uncles body is now at the morgue and we are awaiting a decision as to if an autopsy is necessary, but given the circumstances this seems likely. I've also found out from the neighbour that checked for signs of life and called the Police that John had been suffering severe vomiting for about a day which seems likely to further complicate matters. I was told there is a backlog of autopsies at the morgue and this will not be resolved for several days at least.

I'm inclined to cremation and that is the choice he and my mum made for my grandmother, who was my earlier experience of probate. Ultimately I consider that my mothers choice, but think that is most likely. My uncle was an atheist and even jested since I was a kid that we should put me in the garden for all he cared. My grandfather's brothers requested his burial in the family plot in Ireland, so we did that. Though I was not directly responsible for that but did learn the ropes somewhat by shadowing my father. I also did the same when my paternal grandfather died, more for support than any real intent to learn the ropes.

I took the lead with my maternal grandmother and did follow that same advice from the registrar to get multiple copies. I already knew I needed several. I did get half a dozen and that wasn't enough so will up that this time, though some were returned quiet quickly in practice avoiding any issue. However she died in hospital, so full death certificate was immediately available.

I did learn about the tell us once process yesterday. The big issue was the question of how to get a death certificate, that I knew every org needed. I couldn't think past that and it was making my upset worse, making it even harder to think past it. I'm very grateful for the advice and reassurances I got here regard that. At the moment I binding my time and keeping my mind occupied.

[TooMany2cvs]

This has all come as a hell of a shock, Tyke. If you need more advice, or just to vent, you know where we all are.

[ED209]

4x4Tyke said:

I now know my mother broke down when the Police called and they selected a funeral director from the top of a duty list. My uncles body is now at the morgue and we are awaiting a decision as to if an autopsy is necessary, but given the circumstances this seems likely. I've also found out from the neighbour that checked for signs of life and called the Police that John had been suffering severe vomiting for about a day which seems likely to further complicate matters. I was told there is a backlog of autopsies at the morgue and this will not be resolved for several days at least.

I'm inclined to cremation and that is the choice he and my mum made for my grandmother, who was my earlier experience of probate. Ultimately I consider that my mothers choice, but think that is most likely. My uncle was an atheist and even jested since I was a kid that we should put me in the garden for all he cared. My grandfather's brothers requested his burial in the family plot in Ireland, so we did that. Though I was not directly responsible for that but did learn the ropes somewhat by shadowing my father. I also did the same when my paternal grandfather died, more for support than any real intent to learn the ropes.

I took the lead with my maternal grandmother and did follow that same advice from the registrar to get multiple copies. I already knew I needed several. I did get half a dozen and that wasn't enough so will up that this time, though some were returned quiet quickly in practice avoiding any issue. However she died in hospital, so full death certificate was immediately available.

I did learn about the tell us once process yesterday. The big issue was the question of how to get a death certificate, that I knew every org needed. I couldn't think past that and it was making my upset worse, making it even harder to think past it. I'm very grateful for the advice and reassurances I got here regard that. At the moment I binding my time and keeping my mind occupied.

Just because that firm took the body to the morgue there is noting at all to stop you using a firm of your choice from now. We always use the same firm to remove bodies to the morgue. It used to be a rolling list but now one firm seems to have the contract/job.

[MYOB]

Just to echo others, you can choose your own funeral firm. They will arrange everything for you.

[Pica-Pica]

Sorry for your loss. I got a dozen copies of the death certificates for my dad in 2012 and same again for my mum this January gone, so I concur getting that number.

The registrar, and your chosen funeral director will advise you of all the next steps. They are obviously used to all this, and don’t be afraid to keep asking them about things you don’t understand.