Minor RTA Whilst in Germany

[Rich_W]

Bit long winded. Apologies

During the summer (July) I asked my Dad (Early 70s) to drive my hire car 10Km down the road. As I wasn't going to be with him or the car. He was on his own. For reference he's not had an accident in decades. Is not what I would think of as a liability. He drives normally, (if maybe slower than Id drive, but not the 20mph everywhere type) can still parallel park. I didn't think this would be too hard*

From a car park (a field) to a town centre and park. He hasn't driven a manual for a few years. AFAIK hasn't driven LHD or on the continent for over 40 years! He said he'd be fine (ego talking) Declined my offers to practice in a car park beforehand. We'd scouted the route he would take, found the car park in the town. He was also told that if at any time he didn't feel comfortable to just leave the car where it was and get a cab.


This, as you can guess did not go well. During him leaving the car park he hit a 1metre wooden post with the right front. Which then fell and hit someone (I'm told not hard enough to cause injury) And had been demonstrating the worst clutch control in history. By chance there were some English speaking Polizei present. They came over had a chat. Checked out the other person. An ambulance arrived but they weren't needed so left. The Police told him to get the car recovered as the clutch was apparently stinking like mad. They called Avis, Avis sent a low loader which took the car away and gave him a lift to the town centre. The Police didn't ask him to fill anything in. The 3rd party was apparently more concerned for the now flapping elderly English man.

I met him 12 hours later in the town as planned to discover him almost in shock at the whole situation, he'd hardly eaten anything all day. And that my brand spanking new hire car was now 160K away! He later described it as the 2nd worst day of his life! (The first being when he was told he had Cancer!! )

At the airport he filled in the accident form, and handed it in. He admitted on the form it was his fault. I'd paid for the extra damage waiver so didn't expect any extra CC charges.


Few weeks later Avis UK sent me a copy of the final invoice, No extra charges. Bar obviously the full tank of fuel since I never got the chance to refill it myself. As far as I was concerned. That was the end of it.

* * *

Of course not. Couple of weeks back (October) I get a text from my Dad asking for a copy of the paperwork for the car. I called him back and the gist of it is that he's been prosecuted in absence for not reporting an accident, banned from driving in Germany for 8 months and fined 1 months salary (means testing) He had to sign for the report, but he hasn't received anything in the post prior. And nor have I.

Allegedly he hit another car before colliding with the post. Now he's being fairly cagey as he's clearly very embarrassed by this. But he seemingly hasn't got a clue if he did or not. Which I guess could be shock. I would have thought that a car screaming its clutch in a car park would have attracted attention by anyone nearby. So possibly would have seen him hit the other car and pointed it out. The Polizei didn't mention anything (they may not have seen it to be fair) He received nothing equivalent to a Notice of Intended Prosecution. There's no copy of the evidence photos they apparently used. no report of where he allegedly hit the hire car (left, right front back) It all smells a bit fishy to me, but maybe he did clip it. I wasn't there.

Avis Germany and Avis UK have failed to get back to him when he rung them. He has forbidden me from contacting either. The letter (which he wont show me) says they will contact him again with details on how much to pay and where to send it.

None of this really matters. He's not planning on visiting Germany in the next 8 months. And wont be driving anyway. The means testing will be interesting since he's retired. But even if they go with his final work wage. He can afford it.


So to come to a point. Anyone got any experience of German motoring law when it comes to this? Does this sound right or is there something else going on? Is it better to just cut his losses and pay the fine and forget about it? (I suspect so but I'm curious about it all anyway)



*As an aside, Around August I was with him and I noticed his driving was far worse than I remembered. We ended up driving down an active bus lane at one point, so there's a conversation to be had in future about general driving ability. Though of course that could be because his confidence has taken a large knock. I don't know if he got a fine for the bus lane. He isn't likely to tell me either way right now.

[Sebring440]

Rich_W said:

I asked my Dad (Early 70s) to drive my hire car 10Km down the road.

You're blaming your Dad when all this bo||ox is 100 percent your fault!

[spookly]

Might be worth making sure that the paperwork is genuine too. There have been quite a few scams that operate in a similar way. All they need is an insider in either the hire companies or insurer to give them details of 'marks' that have had a prang in another country. Not saying this is definitely a scam, but it fits a pattern.

[majordad]

You can’t just let someone else drive your hire car, likely they’d not be insured unless named.

[V8LM]

How did they know how and where to contact your father about an alleged accident involving a car that you had hired?

[TooMany2cvs]

V8LM said:

How did they know how and where to contact your father about an alleged accident involving a car that you had hired?

I'm going to take a wild guess that his name and address were on the police report...

[Cat]

TooMany2cvs said:

V8LM said:

How did they know how and where to contact your father about an alleged accident involving a car that you had hired?

I'm going to take a wild guess that his name and address were on the police report...

OP said:

At the airport he filled in the accident form, and handed it in. He admitted on the form it was his fault. I'd paid for the extra damage waiver so didn't expect any extra CC charges.

Cat

[V8LM]

Cat said:

TooMany2cvs said:

V8LM said:

How did they know how and where to contact your father about an alleged accident involving a car that you had hired?

I'm going to take a wild guess that his name and address were on the police report...

OP said:

At the airport he filled in the accident form, and handed it in. He admitted on the form it was his fault. I'd paid for the extra damage waiver so didn't expect any extra CC charges.

Cat

Thanks. I’m still surprised that the OP wasn’t contacted first.

[Rich_W]

Sebring440 said:

Rich_W said:

I asked my Dad (Early 70s) to drive my hire car 10Km down the road.

You're blaming your Dad when all this bo||ox is 100 percent your fault!

fk off. I'm not blaming anyone. He had an accident. He's not one to shirk his responsibility. But similarly he's more trusting than I am in cases like this. He was asked if he was happy to do it. He agreed. He was told he didn't have to if he didn't want to. It wouldn't have been an insurmountable problem if he'd left it where it was. And that there would be English speaking cabs about if he wasn't comfy.

But accidents happen. The extra CC waiver has mitigated any real loss. No one was injured so I just put it down to one of those things until we get this letter allegedly from a German court.

spookly said:

Might be worth making sure that the paperwork is genuine too. There have been quite a few scams that operate in a similar way. All they need is an insider in either the hire companies or insurer to give them details of 'marks' that have had a prang in another country. Not saying this is definitely a scam, but it fits a pattern.

This was my thoughts. Not sure how to check if this is legal. Silly question perhaps, would the German Embassy in London be able to help?

majordad said:

You can’t just let someone else drive your hire car, likely they’d not be insured unless named.

He was a named driver on the policy, his driving licence was shown when I collected the car and I had paid the extra for him to be included

V8LM said:

Cat said:

TooMany2cvs said:

V8LM said:

How did they know how and where to contact your father about an alleged accident involving a car that you had hired?

I'm going to take a wild guess that his name and address were on the police report...

OP said:

At the airport he filled in the accident form, and handed it in. He admitted on the form it was his fault. I'd paid for the extra damage waiver so didn't expect any extra CC charges.

Cat

Thanks. I’m still surprised that the OP wasn’t contacted first.

As am I. And kinda points to a scam based on the scammer only having partial information. And not the full Avis or even Police details. Assuming the Police filled in any paperwork. They appeared to be happy enough to not take anything further.

[paul.deitch]

Haven't seen the docs but my gut feel is that its unlikely to be a scam. Fahrerflucht, hit and run, is taken quite seriously in Germany in that if you have minor prang when the other driver is not there, it is not enough to leave a note of your details on the car you hit.

[Rich_W]

paul.deitch said:

Haven't seen the docs but my gut feel is that its unlikely to be a scam. Fahrerflucht, hit and run, is taken quite seriously in Germany in that if you have minor prang when the other driver is not there, it is not enough to leave a note of your details on the car you hit.

Thanks for the info.


As an aside. (and not relevant here) What should you do if you clip another car and the driver isn't around? Contact the Police? Inform your insurance company and let them sort it out?

[paul.deitch]

Yes here even if you have a small prang everyone calls the police. Saves hassle from fake plates, insurance scams, statement changes at a later date, and someone saying you drove off even if you both agreed you could.