West Mercia Scam Clowns part 2
Discussion
Following on from regmolehusband's thread noted a few things whilst out and about yesterday pm due to Mrs FiF's daily drive being in urgent need of an Italian tune-up 
1) More new perches appearing on the A449 south of Ombersley. At least one of these is just as reg-m-h describes on the left hand bend of a fast right / left combination.
To be objective the road situation is such that if one were going fast enough for lift-off oversteer to develop then one would be travelling at serious warp speed. On the other hand it is possible that if the leading driver in a convoy were to brake suddenly this could unsettle following vehicles particularly bikers. To my view the location has been picked quite cynically to maximise revenue but then I would say that wouldn't I.
Also don't expect any warning flashes from vehicles travelling the other way, the central reserve is so wide and vegetation so dense that the opposing traffic will not be aware there is a trap.
2) Further standing places appear to have been created further down in the approach to a sharper right / left, again no problem at NSL 70, site of a fatal where two lads did hit a tree after, 1) precipitating factor = loss of control 2) causation factor = excess speed over permitted limit coupled with driver inexperience.Ffair enough one might say, it is a place which does need watching imo.
Coupled with the potential enforcement the bends have also been resurfaced, accepted that this is nothing to do with WM SCP muppets, though the work was done at the same time in the same project.
Unfortunately the surface which has been used is stone mastic asphalt (SMA) and it is now well known, as covered in Radio 4 File on 4 and in emergency services, that this SMA road surface is seriously deficient in grip and has caught out class 1 plod drivers et al. So now they have had to put slippery road signs up.
So to summarise,
a) we have a section of road which is tricky,
b) has been the site of a KSI due to XS speed,
c) enforcement commences at the same time as the highways maintenance people make the site MORE dangerous.
You just couldn't make it up could you!
3) WM SCP has amongst its fleet a number of vehicles which park facing the traffic flow and film / scam through the windscreen. At two of the locations I cannot see how they can get the vehicle into that position without performing an illegal maneouvre, ie U turn in a dual carriageway and/or driving the wrong way.
Comments?
4) Following on from Deltafox's Essex Scamps thread and the situation noted in 3) above.
Took a closer look at an older site they use, which is almost always one of the front scanning vehicles, Vectra Estate. This scans the northbound carriageway of a dual carriageway and sits on the n/s verge facing the traffic. The way they approach the site is by driving up onto the verge from a side road, approach the main road at a slight angle, say about 20 degrees, then for the last 50m or so, drive southbound along the verge near the kerb parallel to the northbound carriageway.
To my mind the verge is part of the road, and afaik is the case legally. Effectively they are making a third southbound lane alongside northbound lane 1. Now I don't know if this manouevre is legal or not, but definitely questionable depending upon the actual traffic circumstances at the time.
Comments?
FiF
PS The Italian tune-up was very satisfactory and effective, thank you for wondering. That is apart from the utter muppet in the red BMW who insisted on monstering the rear bumper in 30s and 40s, yet got very small in the mirror when it came to NSLs. No doubt he is complaining about people who keep to limits, ignoring the fact he couldn't keep up with a 1.4 Fabia.
>> Edited by Flat in Fifth on Wednesday 11th May 10:20
1) More new perches appearing on the A449 south of Ombersley. At least one of these is just as reg-m-h describes on the left hand bend of a fast right / left combination.
To be objective the road situation is such that if one were going fast enough for lift-off oversteer to develop then one would be travelling at serious warp speed. On the other hand it is possible that if the leading driver in a convoy were to brake suddenly this could unsettle following vehicles particularly bikers. To my view the location has been picked quite cynically to maximise revenue but then I would say that wouldn't I.
Also don't expect any warning flashes from vehicles travelling the other way, the central reserve is so wide and vegetation so dense that the opposing traffic will not be aware there is a trap.
2) Further standing places appear to have been created further down in the approach to a sharper right / left, again no problem at NSL 70, site of a fatal where two lads did hit a tree after, 1) precipitating factor = loss of control 2) causation factor = excess speed over permitted limit coupled with driver inexperience.Ffair enough one might say, it is a place which does need watching imo.
Coupled with the potential enforcement the bends have also been resurfaced, accepted that this is nothing to do with WM SCP muppets, though the work was done at the same time in the same project.
Unfortunately the surface which has been used is stone mastic asphalt (SMA) and it is now well known, as covered in Radio 4 File on 4 and in emergency services, that this SMA road surface is seriously deficient in grip and has caught out class 1 plod drivers et al. So now they have had to put slippery road signs up.
So to summarise,
a) we have a section of road which is tricky,
b) has been the site of a KSI due to XS speed,
c) enforcement commences at the same time as the highways maintenance people make the site MORE dangerous.
You just couldn't make it up could you!
3) WM SCP has amongst its fleet a number of vehicles which park facing the traffic flow and film / scam through the windscreen. At two of the locations I cannot see how they can get the vehicle into that position without performing an illegal maneouvre, ie U turn in a dual carriageway and/or driving the wrong way.
Comments?
4) Following on from Deltafox's Essex Scamps thread and the situation noted in 3) above.
Took a closer look at an older site they use, which is almost always one of the front scanning vehicles, Vectra Estate. This scans the northbound carriageway of a dual carriageway and sits on the n/s verge facing the traffic. The way they approach the site is by driving up onto the verge from a side road, approach the main road at a slight angle, say about 20 degrees, then for the last 50m or so, drive southbound along the verge near the kerb parallel to the northbound carriageway.
To my mind the verge is part of the road, and afaik is the case legally. Effectively they are making a third southbound lane alongside northbound lane 1. Now I don't know if this manouevre is legal or not, but definitely questionable depending upon the actual traffic circumstances at the time.
Comments?
FiF
PS The Italian tune-up was very satisfactory and effective, thank you for wondering. That is apart from the utter muppet in the red BMW who insisted on monstering the rear bumper in 30s and 40s, yet got very small in the mirror when it came to NSLs. No doubt he is complaining about people who keep to limits, ignoring the fact he couldn't keep up with a 1.4 Fabia.
>> Edited by Flat in Fifth on Wednesday 11th May 10:20
Hmm interesting stuff FIF.
The response i got from these same dickheads regarding the whitel lines query was basically that theyre allowed to do it. They claim its legal, but i havent seen anything regarding the legality of such a manouvre by NON police officers, which is what theyre using.
Copy of emails on request if youre interested.
The response i got from these same dickheads regarding the whitel lines query was basically that theyre allowed to do it. They claim its legal, but i havent seen anything regarding the legality of such a manouvre by NON police officers, which is what theyre using.
Copy of emails on request if youre interested.
Peter Ward said:
Filming through the front windscreen? I thought they couldn't do this through any type of glass because of stray reflections? Is it now ok then to film through the side window of a police car sitting on a bridge? When did that change?
They use DS2 system so the measurement is done by the loops buried in the road and they are merely videoing through the screen. Don't know if this answers your question.
FiF
Flat in Fifth said:
They use DS2 system so the measurement is done by the loops buried in the road and they are merely videoing through the screen. Don't know if this answers your question.
FiF
Ok, off topic bit...
What if youre in a mostly non-ferrous car with an aluminium chassis/glassffibre bodywork, is there still enough steel/iron in things like the crank/gearbox etc to trigger this loops??? (I assume they're essentiall hall effect sensors not pressure sensors?)
Regards
Iain
chassis 33 said:
Ok, off topic bit...
What if youre in a mostly non-ferrous car with an aluminium chassis/glassffibre bodywork, is there still enough steel/iron in things like the crank/gearbox etc to trigger this loops??? (I assume they're essentiall hall effect sensors not pressure sensors?)
Regards
Iain
The DS2 uses piezo sensors AFAIK so they are indeed pressure triggered. If you had low rider style hydraulic suspension and timed it just right, perhaps you could "hop" over the sensors...
Might have spoken with slightly forked tongue earlier.
Having taken a trawl round their info find out they claim it is the DS3 in use, which is definitely a piezo-electric based system from TSS. The DS2 is pneumatic tubes and piezo electric. My memory was wrong there, thought it was the DS2 , apologies.
They are changing over to Lastec, presumably based on LTI20.20. Therefore able to have more flexibility regarding sites as this uses laser rather than the buried loops.
I also see the nice new highly conspic Transit Connect reg 03/54 vehicles. No mention of the black Vectra Estate only marked by propping a camera sign against the front bumper then.
Also taken a trawl through their declared enforcement sites. Please note. these are NOT the only places that enforcement takes place and it is usually under the "covert enforcement" get out rules acc guidelines.
Having taken a trawl round their info find out they claim it is the DS3 in use, which is definitely a piezo-electric based system from TSS. The DS2 is pneumatic tubes and piezo electric. My memory was wrong there, thought it was the DS2 , apologies.
They are changing over to Lastec, presumably based on LTI20.20. Therefore able to have more flexibility regarding sites as this uses laser rather than the buried loops.
I also see the nice new highly conspic Transit Connect reg 03/54 vehicles. No mention of the black Vectra Estate only marked by propping a camera sign against the front bumper then.
Also taken a trawl through their declared enforcement sites. Please note. these are NOT the only places that enforcement takes place and it is usually under the "covert enforcement" get out rules acc guidelines.
deltafox said:Shades of what my Grandmother used to say (C1920 she heard one of two ladies who were arguing say this): "One of us is wrong, and it isn't me!"
Hmm interesting stuff FIF.
The response i got from these same dickheads regarding the whitel lines query was basically that theyre allowed to do it. They claim its legal, but i havent seen anything regarding the legality of such a manouvre by NON police officers, which is what theyre using.
Copy of emails on request if youre interested.
Streaky
streaky said:
Hmm interesting stuff FIF.
The response i got from these same dickheads regarding the whitel lines query was basically that theyre allowed to do it. They claim its legal, but i havent seen anything regarding the legality of such a manouvre by NON police officers, which is what theyre using.
Copy of emails on request if youre interested.
Shades of what my Grandmother used to say (C1920 she heard one of two ladies who were arguing say this): "One of us is wrong, and it isn't me!"
Streaky
Lol.
deltafox said:
Hmm interesting stuff FIF.
The response i got from these same dickheads regarding the whitel lines query was basically that theyre allowed to do it. They claim its legal, but i havent seen anything regarding the legality of such a manouvre by NON police officers, which is what theyre using.
Copy of emails on request if youre interested.
Shades of what my Grandmother used to say (C1920 she heard one of two ladies who were arguing say this): "One of us is wrong, and it isn't me!"
Streaky
Lol.
Off topic but....
Those old lady conversations are ace. Remember one which to my very junior ears more or less went as follows.
Grandma: You know thingy?
Mum: You mean madam wossname.
Grandma: Yes, well did you know she has.
Mum: She hasn't?
Grandma: Oh yes, and whats more, him, he didn't know a thing!
Mum: No!
and so and so on for ages. What's more when interrogated they both knew exactly and accurately who had done what with whom and when.
Spooky!!
Flat in Fifth said:
Those old lady conversations are ace. Remember one which to my very junior ears more or less went as follows.
Grandma: You know thingy?
Mum: You mean madam wossname.
Grandma: Yes, well did you know she has.
Mum: She hasn't?
Grandma: Oh yes, and whats more, him, he didn't know a thing!
Mum: No!
and so and so on for ages. What's more when interrogated they both knew exactly and accurately who had done what with whom and when.
Spooky!!
Yes, Les Dawson and a chap whose name I cannot just now recall used to do sketches like that, but I've known in happen for real as well. Quite hilarious.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
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