Bus Lanes & Bus Gate enforcement time limit receiving PCN?
Discussion
I received an email of a scanned document from our accountants, which is where the company's registered office is yesterday.
The PCN dates back to last August (2nd) when it appears as though either my wife, or I, infringed a bus gate entry over a level crossing. The photo and video clip show my car. So far so good, or not, dependent on how you feel about the validity.
Anyway, I queried the length of time to receiving this and it turns out that VW leasing, who originally received the PCN, sent it to an old address. They neither wrote to me, as the registered keeper, nor sought to validate the currency of the address they had (all invoices come via email so they have a means of getting in contact).
The PCN appears to have lingered at the old address for some considerable time before being escalated by Essex County Council to a legal firm to seek enforcement to collect the outstanding amount.
Is there (ala Mr Beckham) a limit on receiving a fine time-wise, or given I was unaware of the fine (and possibly the offence, if it was my wife driving - neither of us can recall) and since the original charge has gone up to over £400, I would at least get it back down to the original fine amount.
Any thoughts,suggestions, hand wringing, stone throwing, fully accepted.
Many thanks
The PCN dates back to last August (2nd) when it appears as though either my wife, or I, infringed a bus gate entry over a level crossing. The photo and video clip show my car. So far so good, or not, dependent on how you feel about the validity.
Anyway, I queried the length of time to receiving this and it turns out that VW leasing, who originally received the PCN, sent it to an old address. They neither wrote to me, as the registered keeper, nor sought to validate the currency of the address they had (all invoices come via email so they have a means of getting in contact).
The PCN appears to have lingered at the old address for some considerable time before being escalated by Essex County Council to a legal firm to seek enforcement to collect the outstanding amount.
Is there (ala Mr Beckham) a limit on receiving a fine time-wise, or given I was unaware of the fine (and possibly the offence, if it was my wife driving - neither of us can recall) and since the original charge has gone up to over £400, I would at least get it back down to the original fine amount.
Any thoughts,suggestions, hand wringing, stone throwing, fully accepted.
Many thanks
2 initial observations...
Are you sure you are the registered keeper? Surely VW is if they received the PCN. Otherwise the notice would have been sent to you.
It's your responsibility to keep the registered keeper VW up to date with your address, in the same way as it would be your responsibility to keep the DVLA updated if you were the RK.
Are you sure you are the registered keeper? Surely VW is if they received the PCN. Otherwise the notice would have been sent to you.
It's your responsibility to keep the registered keeper VW up to date with your address, in the same way as it would be your responsibility to keep the DVLA updated if you were the RK.
We had a similar thing here with our friends who sold their house and are lodging temporarily with us - he got caught in a box junction by cameras, but although they changed addresses for their licences, they forgot to change address for RK.
Cut long story short, took 9 months for them to find out (redirects on post only 3 months) by which time it had reached £600 and passed to debt collectors who wanted to raid our house and seize to value. They applied to TFL, explaining what happened, who reverted to start fine minus early payment discount, and set aside the debt collectors (who must have been pissed off as they probably bought the debt at 10p in the £ plus their admin, and thought they’d get a nice payday).
Would be worth trying the same thing with the authority responsible for your fine, explaining everything to do with the lease is email and this was an admin oversight - what have you to lose?
Cut long story short, took 9 months for them to find out (redirects on post only 3 months) by which time it had reached £600 and passed to debt collectors who wanted to raid our house and seize to value. They applied to TFL, explaining what happened, who reverted to start fine minus early payment discount, and set aside the debt collectors (who must have been pissed off as they probably bought the debt at 10p in the £ plus their admin, and thought they’d get a nice payday).
Would be worth trying the same thing with the authority responsible for your fine, explaining everything to do with the lease is email and this was an admin oversight - what have you to lose?
OP,
Bus gate over a level crossing - was this in Colchester perhaps?
These bus gates have caused massive issues and there is certainly some debate about their lawfulness. If it is in Colchester then these two articles may be of assiistance :
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/non_complia...
https://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/17514867.hythe...
Bus gate over a level crossing - was this in Colchester perhaps?
These bus gates have caused massive issues and there is certainly some debate about their lawfulness. If it is in Colchester then these two articles may be of assiistance :
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/non_complia...
https://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/17514867.hythe...
AnotherGuy said:
OP,
Bus gate over a level crossing - was this in Colchester perhaps?
These bus gates have caused massive issues and there is certainly some debate about their lawfulness. If it is in Colchester then these two articles may be of assiistance :
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/non_complia...
https://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/17514867.hythe...
The second article was most relevant Bus gate over a level crossing - was this in Colchester perhaps?
These bus gates have caused massive issues and there is certainly some debate about their lawfulness. If it is in Colchester then these two articles may be of assiistance :
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/non_complia...
https://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/17514867.hythe...
Whilst I have 'fessed up (and asked for consideration given the documents went to the wrong address), I would not normally (either intentionally, or otherwise) break the law. However, since I cannot recall which of us was driving (my wife, or I), it is difficult to suggest I didn't see the signs.
I do avoid now intend to avoid the area though.
Many thanks for positing
Whilst it doesn't help the OP that "bus gate" and the signs on the road on other side of the level crossing prevent anybody driving to the station.
It's not my area so locals may know the answer.
As far as I can see if you want to get to the station or use the road you either have to go through the "bus gate" or the wrong side of the bollard.
There should be an alternative to using the "bus gate".
Here's one that I used to encounter - https://www.google.com/maps/@51.3690641,-0.296529,...
There is another lane for normal traffic.
It's not my area so locals may know the answer.
As far as I can see if you want to get to the station or use the road you either have to go through the "bus gate" or the wrong side of the bollard.
There should be an alternative to using the "bus gate".
Here's one that I used to encounter - https://www.google.com/maps/@51.3690641,-0.296529,...
There is another lane for normal traffic.
Since being notified of the impending PCN, I have had to wrack the grey cells (it was eight months ago), and in all likelihood it was me.
It does seem to create the opportunity to fine people st a place where previously you could just drive across. Of course I’m not suggesting anything by that, it is unfortunate though
It does seem to create the opportunity to fine people st a place where previously you could just drive across. Of course I’m not suggesting anything by that, it is unfortunate though
If it is a bus lane fine issued by the council, it is not endorsable on a licence so just the fine to pay, so no need to worry about who was driving, just who can pay.
As the fine was issued to a previous address by the leasing company, it should be eligible for reversal back to the original amount (although not discounted)
Complete a PE3 form and sign it in front of a solicitor or court clerk - on the grounds that you didn't receive the original PCN and a brief explanation. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-pe...
As it is out of time, you will also need to complete a PE2 form with the reason it is out of time - again, leasing company provided wrong details. - https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-pe...
Email both signed forms to tec@hmcts.gsi.gov.uk - with the PCN reference number as the subject, and this should reduce it from £400 and keep the bailiffs/enforcement officers away.
Job jobbed.
As the fine was issued to a previous address by the leasing company, it should be eligible for reversal back to the original amount (although not discounted)
Complete a PE3 form and sign it in front of a solicitor or court clerk - on the grounds that you didn't receive the original PCN and a brief explanation. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-pe...
As it is out of time, you will also need to complete a PE2 form with the reason it is out of time - again, leasing company provided wrong details. - https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-pe...
Email both signed forms to tec@hmcts.gsi.gov.uk - with the PCN reference number as the subject, and this should reduce it from £400 and keep the bailiffs/enforcement officers away.
Job jobbed.
S11Steve said:
If it is a bus lane fine issued by the council, it is not endorsable on a licence so just the fine to pay, so no need to worry about who was driving, just who can pay.
As the fine was issued to a previous address by the leasing company, it should be eligible for reversal back to the original amount (although not discounted)
Complete a PE3 form and sign it in front of a solicitor or court clerk - on the grounds that you didn't receive the original PCN and a brief explanation. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-pe...
As it is out of time, you will also need to complete a PE2 form with the reason it is out of time - again, leasing company provided wrong details. - https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-pe...
Email both signed forms to tec@hmcts.gsi.gov.uk - with the PCN reference number as the subject, and this should reduce it from £400 and keep the bailiffs/enforcement officers away.
Job jobbed.
This is a few beers owed.As the fine was issued to a previous address by the leasing company, it should be eligible for reversal back to the original amount (although not discounted)
Complete a PE3 form and sign it in front of a solicitor or court clerk - on the grounds that you didn't receive the original PCN and a brief explanation. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-pe...
As it is out of time, you will also need to complete a PE2 form with the reason it is out of time - again, leasing company provided wrong details. - https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-pe...
Email both signed forms to tec@hmcts.gsi.gov.uk - with the PCN reference number as the subject, and this should reduce it from £400 and keep the bailiffs/enforcement officers away.
Job jobbed.
Thank you
dukeboy749r said:
Any thoughts,suggestions, hand wringing, stone throwing, fully accepted.
Many thanks
Did you commit the alleged offence? Then pay up.Many thanks
As a secondary issue, you should make sure that your change of address/current address is notified to, and kept up to date with all people, or authorities that will need it. A continuing mail forwarding service with the Post Office is a good idea.
No problem.
Glad to be of service.
Unbusy said:
I read mad monk as a bit tongue in cheek. I don't think he was being serious.
Well, not totally serious.However, is it bad advice to make sure that all correspondence forwarding mechanisms are in place, functioning properly properly and kept up to date?
How many have we heard on here "it went to my old address"?
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