Main dealer pulling a fast one?
Discussion
Recently i bought a 2nd hard car. I won't mentioned the make and model or where i bought it from, in the event i have to instruct a solicitor.
However, i would rather like to obtain the views of others to hopefully either put my mind at ease or otherwise.
I'm happy with the car for now, it's taken a while to find one that ticked most of the boxes, but a question was raised over the service history.
Naturally i assumed that there should be a service every year, since new, and that was necessary, even if it was to just change the oil and filter.
However with this car it was missing service intervals (when checking the online system).
It was mentioned by the sales team, prior to purchase, that the previous main dealer garages, that carried out the service, may not have uploaded them to the "online service system", but dealer that i bought from said that this wasn't an issue and that they can request the servicing garage to upload.
The car was bought on the premise that it has a FSH. Although it was missing two previous service intervals from new, prior to the latest one carried out on month 36. There was only a pre-inspection service before then.
It's been a little while since I've bought the car and there is still no upload, and I've now raised this with the main dealer and the Head office.
The main dealer, where i bought the car, informed me that the car would have had a FSH, otherwise it couldn't have been sold through said main dealer, and in addition to that i couldn't have been sold a main dealer warranty. So they no longer mentioned that the previous dealer may not have uploaded it.
But something still doesn't sit right with me, and if i wanted to sell it later on down the line, people are going to ask if it has a FSH, which i cannot prove.
Looking at the service intervals, it would seem that it needs service once a year or every 16k miles, which ever is soonest. From the record, it has covered 3k more, before it was serviced at 19k.
So, is there grounds that i can give this car back (minus) any reasonable costs to me, for distance travelled (i've done about 1k miles since i've had it). As it was sold to me on the premise on a FSH, but doesn't have one.
Also does it ever happen that a main dealer has sold a car with a FSH, yet cannot prove this, and then state that it "must" have a FSH, otherwise it was not possible that a warranty could be given, or for the car to be sold through this channel?
However, i would rather like to obtain the views of others to hopefully either put my mind at ease or otherwise.
I'm happy with the car for now, it's taken a while to find one that ticked most of the boxes, but a question was raised over the service history.
Naturally i assumed that there should be a service every year, since new, and that was necessary, even if it was to just change the oil and filter.
However with this car it was missing service intervals (when checking the online system).
It was mentioned by the sales team, prior to purchase, that the previous main dealer garages, that carried out the service, may not have uploaded them to the "online service system", but dealer that i bought from said that this wasn't an issue and that they can request the servicing garage to upload.
The car was bought on the premise that it has a FSH. Although it was missing two previous service intervals from new, prior to the latest one carried out on month 36. There was only a pre-inspection service before then.
It's been a little while since I've bought the car and there is still no upload, and I've now raised this with the main dealer and the Head office.
The main dealer, where i bought the car, informed me that the car would have had a FSH, otherwise it couldn't have been sold through said main dealer, and in addition to that i couldn't have been sold a main dealer warranty. So they no longer mentioned that the previous dealer may not have uploaded it.
But something still doesn't sit right with me, and if i wanted to sell it later on down the line, people are going to ask if it has a FSH, which i cannot prove.
Looking at the service intervals, it would seem that it needs service once a year or every 16k miles, which ever is soonest. From the record, it has covered 3k more, before it was serviced at 19k.
So, is there grounds that i can give this car back (minus) any reasonable costs to me, for distance travelled (i've done about 1k miles since i've had it). As it was sold to me on the premise on a FSH, but doesn't have one.
Also does it ever happen that a main dealer has sold a car with a FSH, yet cannot prove this, and then state that it "must" have a FSH, otherwise it was not possible that a warranty could be given, or for the car to be sold through this channel?
You have grounds for a full refund if you really want to go down that route. Its mis sold. If it was sold and advertised as FSH and it isn't then its a breach of advertising.
For what its worth and if I were in your shoes I would try and get them to offer a longer warranty and servicing and say you will keep the car.
Theres every chance it has been serviced they just don't have evidence as such so use it in your favour.
I sold a car, told the guy it had full history, it didn't as it had missed one. Offered him a refund. When you sell enough cars you are bound to make the odd mistake just do the right thing.
( Independent car dealer).
For what its worth and if I were in your shoes I would try and get them to offer a longer warranty and servicing and say you will keep the car.
Theres every chance it has been serviced they just don't have evidence as such so use it in your favour.
I sold a car, told the guy it had full history, it didn't as it had missed one. Offered him a refund. When you sell enough cars you are bound to make the odd mistake just do the right thing.
( Independent car dealer).
Main dealers fudge service histories all the time, i've even known them to fudge a dealership FSH onto a car that's never been dealer serviced, by stamping up a brand new log book, i'm only surprised they missed this one. It's very common these days for low mileage drivers to skip a service or two, because of how they choose to interpret the "every 12 months or 12'000 miles".
Besides, having seen what goes on in dealership service departments, I don't put much value in dealership servicing. It's so much the technicians fault, it's the fact they're managed by salesmen.
Besides, having seen what goes on in dealership service departments, I don't put much value in dealership servicing. It's so much the technicians fault, it's the fact they're managed by salesmen.
Edited by lyonspride on Sunday 13th October 11:11
This boils my pee.
Dealers advertising/selling cars with FSH without actually checking they have it. Arrogance, laziness, fraudulent, you choose.
Don't let them get away with it OP.
Demand they find it, or you want a reduction in price that you paid for the car, or a full refund.
You've been miss sold, and that isn't limited to 30 days for recourse.
Dealers advertising/selling cars with FSH without actually checking they have it. Arrogance, laziness, fraudulent, you choose.
Don't let them get away with it OP.
Demand they find it, or you want a reduction in price that you paid for the car, or a full refund.
You've been miss sold, and that isn't limited to 30 days for recourse.
Edited by Trevor555 on Monday 14th October 12:23
lyonspride said:
Main dealers fudge service histories all the time, i've even known them to fudge a dealership FSH onto a car that's never been dealer serviced, by stamping up a brand new log book, i'm only surprised they missed this one. It's very common these days for low mileage drivers to skip a service or two, because of how they choose to interpret the "every 12 months or 12'000 miles".
Besides, having seen what goes on in dealership service departments, I don't put much value in dealership servicing. It's so much the technicians fault, it's the fact they're managed by salesmen.
I don't put much stock in dealer servicing history either. My last two cars were both ex lease cars with high mileage at 3 years old and full dealer history and the amount of clips and screws that were broken or missing etc show that dealer mechanics have the same or lower standards any other garage.Besides, having seen what goes on in dealership service departments, I don't put much value in dealership servicing. It's so much the technicians fault, it's the fact they're managed by salesmen.
Edited by lyonspride on Sunday 13th October 11:11
Having an engine under tray fall off on one sidedriving out of the dealers garage after a servicing doesn't instill confidence in the system
eccles said:
lyonspride said:
Main dealers fudge service histories all the time, i've even known them to fudge a dealership FSH onto a car that's never been dealer serviced, by stamping up a brand new log book, i'm only surprised they missed this one. It's very common these days for low mileage drivers to skip a service or two, because of how they choose to interpret the "every 12 months or 12'000 miles".
Besides, having seen what goes on in dealership service departments, I don't put much value in dealership servicing. It's so much the technicians fault, it's the fact they're managed by salesmen.
I don't put much stock in dealer servicing history either. My last two cars were both ex lease cars with high mileage at 3 years old and full dealer history and the amount of clips and screws that were broken or missing etc show that dealer mechanics have the same or lower standards any other garage.Besides, having seen what goes on in dealership service departments, I don't put much value in dealership servicing. It's so much the technicians fault, it's the fact they're managed by salesmen.
Edited by lyonspride on Sunday 13th October 11:11
Having an engine under tray fall off on one sidedriving out of the dealers garage after a servicing doesn't instill confidence in the system
Jag_NE said:
eccles said:
lyonspride said:
Main dealers fudge service histories all the time, i've even known them to fudge a dealership FSH onto a car that's never been dealer serviced, by stamping up a brand new log book, i'm only surprised they missed this one. It's very common these days for low mileage drivers to skip a service or two, because of how they choose to interpret the "every 12 months or 12'000 miles".
Besides, having seen what goes on in dealership service departments, I don't put much value in dealership servicing. It's so much the technicians fault, it's the fact they're managed by salesmen.
I don't put much stock in dealer servicing history either. My last two cars were both ex lease cars with high mileage at 3 years old and full dealer history and the amount of clips and screws that were broken or missing etc show that dealer mechanics have the same or lower standards any other garage.Besides, having seen what goes on in dealership service departments, I don't put much value in dealership servicing. It's so much the technicians fault, it's the fact they're managed by salesmen.
Edited by lyonspride on Sunday 13th October 11:11
Having an engine under tray fall off on one sidedriving out of the dealers garage after a servicing doesn't instill confidence in the system
It's not uncommon for customers to pick up their "serviced" car from exactly the same parking spot they left it in.
Thank you for the feedback so far.
I'm a member of Which?, and so will call the legal department first thing tomorrow, but i will be looking at a full refund.
As mentioned, what if i want to sell it later on and i'm asked if it has a FSH. I can't confirm that it has this, due to the lack of evidence now.
Not that this is my main concern, it's more to do with the fact that i've been mis-sold a car.
In terms of reasonable costs, the car has been used by me, and i've travelled circa 1k miles since it's been in my possession.
What should i accept, in terms of "reasonable costs", if they will offer a refund but want to make a deduction.
I won't be pushing for full invoice price as a refund, as i expect to make a contribution towards the cars use. Or do i need not bother?
I'm a member of Which?, and so will call the legal department first thing tomorrow, but i will be looking at a full refund.
As mentioned, what if i want to sell it later on and i'm asked if it has a FSH. I can't confirm that it has this, due to the lack of evidence now.
Not that this is my main concern, it's more to do with the fact that i've been mis-sold a car.
In terms of reasonable costs, the car has been used by me, and i've travelled circa 1k miles since it's been in my possession.
What should i accept, in terms of "reasonable costs", if they will offer a refund but want to make a deduction.
I won't be pushing for full invoice price as a refund, as i expect to make a contribution towards the cars use. Or do i need not bother?
Trevor555 said:
This boils my pee.
Dealers advertising cars with FSH without actually checking they have it. Arrogance, laziness, fraudulent, you choose.
Yes, I decided to walk away from a used car after the dealer said it wasn't lying to say a car last serviced 2.5 years ago had a FSH. Dealers advertising cars with FSH without actually checking they have it. Arrogance, laziness, fraudulent, you choose.
LeoSayer said:
Yes, I decided to walk away from a used car after the dealer said it wasn't lying to say a car last serviced 2.5 years ago had a FSH.
A fair few years ago I looked at a car that a 'trader' was selling with FSH. Car in question was around 6-8 years old from memory, but had only covered around 30k. It had had 2 services since new (in 8 years) and his explanation was that it wasn't due the 32k (or whatever it was) service yet, completely choosing to ignore the "or every 12 months" aspect of the history.
Walked away, but still remember the look on his face was like explaining the quadratic equation to an infant.
Trevor555 said:
eccles said:
I don't put much stock in dealer servicing history either.
Me neither, but this thread is more about the OP having bought a car advertised with a FSH.I have no idea, from the limited information we have.
I was just highlighting that the OP didn't say it had been advertised with a full service history, you did and extrapolated from there.
INAL but I suspect any 'win' would not be sufficient to justify legal action, but it's not my time or money.
I was just highlighting that the OP didn't say it had been advertised with a full service history, you did and extrapolated from there.
INAL but I suspect any 'win' would not be sufficient to justify legal action, but it's not my time or money.
C Lee Farquar said:
I have no idea, from the limited information we have.
I was just highlighting that the OP didn't say it had been advertised with a full service history, you did and extrapolated from there.
INAL but I suspect any 'win' would not be sufficient to justify legal action, but it's not my time or money.
Yup, fair enough.I was just highlighting that the OP didn't say it had been advertised with a full service history, you did and extrapolated from there.
INAL but I suspect any 'win' would not be sufficient to justify legal action, but it's not my time or money.
I'l change my post to say he was promised the car had a FSH at the point of sale.
[quote=XFRFred]
[...]
However with this car it was missing service intervals (when checking the online system).
It was mentioned by the sales team, prior to purchase, that the previous main dealer garages, that carried out the service, may not have uploaded them to the "online service system", but dealer that i bought from said that this wasn't an issue and that they can request the servicing garage to upload.
[...]
Nearly all the manufacturer online service historys that I deal with don't allow uploads more than a couple of weeks after the event. If it's not done at the time then it's never going to have a full online history.
[...]
However with this car it was missing service intervals (when checking the online system).
It was mentioned by the sales team, prior to purchase, that the previous main dealer garages, that carried out the service, may not have uploaded them to the "online service system", but dealer that i bought from said that this wasn't an issue and that they can request the servicing garage to upload.
[...]
Nearly all the manufacturer online service historys that I deal with don't allow uploads more than a couple of weeks after the event. If it's not done at the time then it's never going to have a full online history.
XFRFred said:
Recently i bought a 2nd hard car. I won't mentioned the make and model or where i bought it from, in the event i have to instruct a solicitor.
However, i would rather like to obtain the views of others to hopefully either put my mind at ease or otherwise.
I'm happy with the car for now, it's taken a while to find one that ticked most of the boxes, but a question was raised over the service history.
Naturally i assumed that there should be a service every year, since new, and that was necessary, even if it was to just change the oil and filter.
However with this car it was missing service intervals (when checking the online system).
It was mentioned by the sales team, prior to purchase, that the previous main dealer garages, that carried out the service, may not have uploaded them to the "online service system", but dealer that i bought from said that this wasn't an issue and that they can request the servicing garage to upload.
The car was bought on the premise that it has a FSH. Although it was missing two previous service intervals from new, prior to the latest one carried out on month 36. There was only a pre-inspection service before then.
It's been a little while since I've bought the car and there is still no upload, and I've now raised this with the main dealer and the Head office.
The main dealer, where i bought the car, informed me that the car would have had a FSH, otherwise it couldn't have been sold through said main dealer, and in addition to that i couldn't have been sold a main dealer warranty. So they no longer mentioned that the previous dealer may not have uploaded it.
But something still doesn't sit right with me, and if i wanted to sell it later on down the line, people are going to ask if it has a FSH, which i cannot prove.
Looking at the service intervals, it would seem that it needs service once a year or every 16k miles, which ever is soonest. From the record, it has covered 3k more, before it was serviced at 19k.
So, is there grounds that i can give this car back (minus) any reasonable costs to me, for distance travelled (i've done about 1k miles since i've had it). As it was sold to me on the premise on a FSH, but doesn't have one.
Also does it ever happen that a main dealer has sold a car with a FSH, yet cannot prove this, and then state that it "must" have a FSH, otherwise it was not possible that a warranty could be given, or for the car to be sold through this channel?
Possibly an ex lease car?However, i would rather like to obtain the views of others to hopefully either put my mind at ease or otherwise.
I'm happy with the car for now, it's taken a while to find one that ticked most of the boxes, but a question was raised over the service history.
Naturally i assumed that there should be a service every year, since new, and that was necessary, even if it was to just change the oil and filter.
However with this car it was missing service intervals (when checking the online system).
It was mentioned by the sales team, prior to purchase, that the previous main dealer garages, that carried out the service, may not have uploaded them to the "online service system", but dealer that i bought from said that this wasn't an issue and that they can request the servicing garage to upload.
The car was bought on the premise that it has a FSH. Although it was missing two previous service intervals from new, prior to the latest one carried out on month 36. There was only a pre-inspection service before then.
It's been a little while since I've bought the car and there is still no upload, and I've now raised this with the main dealer and the Head office.
The main dealer, where i bought the car, informed me that the car would have had a FSH, otherwise it couldn't have been sold through said main dealer, and in addition to that i couldn't have been sold a main dealer warranty. So they no longer mentioned that the previous dealer may not have uploaded it.
But something still doesn't sit right with me, and if i wanted to sell it later on down the line, people are going to ask if it has a FSH, which i cannot prove.
Looking at the service intervals, it would seem that it needs service once a year or every 16k miles, which ever is soonest. From the record, it has covered 3k more, before it was serviced at 19k.
So, is there grounds that i can give this car back (minus) any reasonable costs to me, for distance travelled (i've done about 1k miles since i've had it). As it was sold to me on the premise on a FSH, but doesn't have one.
Also does it ever happen that a main dealer has sold a car with a FSH, yet cannot prove this, and then state that it "must" have a FSH, otherwise it was not possible that a warranty could be given, or for the car to be sold through this channel?
Some of these gave “creative” servicing histories.
Personally, I wouldn’t purchase a used car without seeing the history myself but everyone is different.
Trevor555 said:
Anything a sales person says, promises, implies, at the point of sale, or up to it, is legally binding.
Even if it's verbal.
More tricky to prove if it's verbal, but who do you think the judge would believe?
This is not true. Even if it's verbal.
More tricky to prove if it's verbal, but who do you think the judge would believe?
Plenty of statements will be considered sales puffs, or merely statements which are neither intended nor considered to have contractual effect.
Moreover, such things as a salesman says which are either pre-contract representations or form part of the contract beg the (often much harder question); what do they really mean?
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff