Does the Hamilton Defence work?

[ugly]

Sorry if this has been discussed before - can't find it.

Doing 61 in 50m limit on M4 (50 because of pay booths, not roadworks)

No idea whether me or wife driving - asked for a photo. Cannot see driver at all on photos.

What next please?

[leosayer]

It worked for the Hamiltons!

I can't see why it wouldn't, provided you're both in the car at the time and you're both insured and able to drive.

Remember if you lie and get found out, the penalties can be severe.

[princeperch]

if you do go ahead with it you must stick to your guns and both be singing from the same song sheet if it all goes pete tong....

[ugly]

We weren't both in the car so far as we can tell from the photos; problem is, it was on a road we both use a lot but not on Sundays - the day in question.

We are both insured and we both use the car.

[BlackStuff]

It's a perfectly valid defence, and one that is specifically allowed for in the framing of s172.

If you are genuinely unable to identify who was driving, despite having exercised all due diligence in attempting to do so, then no offence is committed.

The only stumbling block is whether you can convince the Magistrate that you have satisfied the requirement for diligence, and that you are not trying it on. You need to explore every possible avenue that might help you to identify the driver, and document this so that you can demonstrate to the court what lengths you have gone to to discharge your obligations.

[ugly]

Thanks for this.

We've checked our diaries - both blank for that day.

I guess the next step is to check bank statements and credit card statements to see if either of us spent money or used a service till that day and time, and where we were.

[GKP]

Hmm, I've been reading this topic and looked carefully at a transcript of the Hamilton case.

It sounds like your wife was driving!

[slightlymiffed]

Send a PACE statement with both your names and let them work it out!

www.pepipoo.com will be helpful in your quest...

[BlackStuff]

slightlymiffed said:

Send a PACE statement with both your names and let them work it out!

I think you need to read up a bit more on the theory behind the PACE defence, which would only ever be used in a situation where you knew for certain that the driver was the recipient of the s172 notice. By definition it can't be combined with the "Hamilton defence".

[Boosted LS1]

You need to ask the CPS lots of questions, like where exactly was the camera, what did it look like, the time of day, could they see what sex the driver was or if he was bald or a coloured chap? Then look for your shopping receipts, look at a streetmap to see if you know the road well. Were you there? Just ask them lots of questions to help you provide the information required. The more they can't answer the better it is for you. You will be seen to have tried to provide driver details.

You will both have to go to court if cps don't drop it. Really make the bar stewards write lots of letters and do loads of work answering questions but don't look cocky, just ask for loads of info

Boosted.

[ugly]

Thanks for all the comments - I've now found my way on to PePiPoo and taken out membership, so here's to the fight!