Dreadful insurance repairs, getting it fixed.
Discussion
Hi, I wonder if anyone can offer a bit of advice on my current situation; if only to confirm I'm doing the right thing.
To avoid a TLDR in brief:
- 31st October 2019 someone went up the back of me
- Damage was moderate / minor (dent to bootlid and bumper, bits of trim broken etc etc). No glass broken etc car remained driveable
- Third party admitted fault immediately
- I reported it to my insurer same day
- They put me onto their tame claims management people as it was a non fault etc (my first mistake in hindsight)
- Claims management people point me to a local bodyshop who look decent
- Take it to the bodyshop who give it a once over and take the list of things I'd noticed myself
- Car goes in a week later to get fixed
- I have a hire car as a replacement. It wasn't really a like for like but was acceptable for a week or so I thought
- Didn't get my car back until 4 weeks later
- During the 4 weeks it seemed to be only me who was capable of speaking to the bodyshop and chasing things, claims people only ever tried to get me to return the hire car on dates the bodyshop said it'd be ready but wasn't
- Got the car back and quickly started to note a massive list of problems with the repair (paint issues, loads of broken trim bits not replaced, crap reassembly, poor alignment of parts etc etc).
- Told the bodyshop and the claims people. Offered to fix stuff as a "goodwill" despite some aspects being things they "wouldn't have looked at" but would have been obvious things to check on something that had been rear ended (boot floor stuff).
- I found yet more wrong so complained formally and in detail on 21st December 2019 to claims people and copied bodyshop in
- Bodyshop are apologetic and ask me to take it back in after christmas. I'm not thrill;ed but they seem to get it and contract states I have to give them one chance to sort it
- Take it in on the 6th January with my list of issues. They agree it's woeful quality and agree to fix it. Say they'll order parts and get them in then book it in. Approx one week to 10 days estimate.
- They call again on the 10th Jan to say they're ordering the bits and will be back in touch soon.
- I hear nothing more
- Get a letter from the claims people early Jan saying they're sorry not to have responded yet but in accordance with their policy they'll respond within 8 weeks of my complaint.
- Car got serviced by the main dealer on 3rd Feb so they gave it a once over at my request and confirm the quality of the job is appalling. Say they'll put it in writing if needs be.
- Today is the last day of that 8 weeks so if nothing arrives today the claims people have failed too.
- By chance today is also the car's 3rd birthday so it had an MOT yesterday and the MOT chaps also confirm it's a crap job. They had a decent poke as far as they could up on the ramp without any dismantling and couldn't see any more horrors.
All I want is my car fixed and now also to be given confidence there's nothing else wrong that's hidden from my view.
Claims people's complaint policy allows me to escalate to an external mediation organisation as the next step.
So, I intend to do that while also getting hold of my insurers with whom I have legal cover to start something there to recover my losses (damaged car, loss of value etc - I'm not sure on the aspect of the amount of my time that's been wasted, several trips back and forth to the bodyshop etc).
Can anyone think of anything else sensible as my next step?
To avoid a TLDR in brief:
- 31st October 2019 someone went up the back of me
- Damage was moderate / minor (dent to bootlid and bumper, bits of trim broken etc etc). No glass broken etc car remained driveable
- Third party admitted fault immediately
- I reported it to my insurer same day
- They put me onto their tame claims management people as it was a non fault etc (my first mistake in hindsight)
- Claims management people point me to a local bodyshop who look decent
- Take it to the bodyshop who give it a once over and take the list of things I'd noticed myself
- Car goes in a week later to get fixed
- I have a hire car as a replacement. It wasn't really a like for like but was acceptable for a week or so I thought
- Didn't get my car back until 4 weeks later
- During the 4 weeks it seemed to be only me who was capable of speaking to the bodyshop and chasing things, claims people only ever tried to get me to return the hire car on dates the bodyshop said it'd be ready but wasn't
- Got the car back and quickly started to note a massive list of problems with the repair (paint issues, loads of broken trim bits not replaced, crap reassembly, poor alignment of parts etc etc).
- Told the bodyshop and the claims people. Offered to fix stuff as a "goodwill" despite some aspects being things they "wouldn't have looked at" but would have been obvious things to check on something that had been rear ended (boot floor stuff).
- I found yet more wrong so complained formally and in detail on 21st December 2019 to claims people and copied bodyshop in
- Bodyshop are apologetic and ask me to take it back in after christmas. I'm not thrill;ed but they seem to get it and contract states I have to give them one chance to sort it
- Take it in on the 6th January with my list of issues. They agree it's woeful quality and agree to fix it. Say they'll order parts and get them in then book it in. Approx one week to 10 days estimate.
- They call again on the 10th Jan to say they're ordering the bits and will be back in touch soon.
- I hear nothing more
- Get a letter from the claims people early Jan saying they're sorry not to have responded yet but in accordance with their policy they'll respond within 8 weeks of my complaint.
- Car got serviced by the main dealer on 3rd Feb so they gave it a once over at my request and confirm the quality of the job is appalling. Say they'll put it in writing if needs be.
- Today is the last day of that 8 weeks so if nothing arrives today the claims people have failed too.
- By chance today is also the car's 3rd birthday so it had an MOT yesterday and the MOT chaps also confirm it's a crap job. They had a decent poke as far as they could up on the ramp without any dismantling and couldn't see any more horrors.
All I want is my car fixed and now also to be given confidence there's nothing else wrong that's hidden from my view.
Claims people's complaint policy allows me to escalate to an external mediation organisation as the next step.
So, I intend to do that while also getting hold of my insurers with whom I have legal cover to start something there to recover my losses (damaged car, loss of value etc - I'm not sure on the aspect of the amount of my time that's been wasted, several trips back and forth to the bodyshop etc).
Can anyone think of anything else sensible as my next step?
Your next step should be to the people whose own 8 week deadline has now passed. Give them chapter and verse of your complaint (yes, I know, again) and give them seven days to respond to your request - whatever that might be. I wouldn't speak to the repair shop again, your 'contract' is not with them, but the claims handlers.
After seven days have elapsed, take it to the next step.
After seven days have elapsed, take it to the next step.
Ta, bloody good point on who I have a contract with and who to push on. The 7 day time limit thing sounds a good idea. Also a point I'll make in that chapter and verse is that the "one chance to fix it" clause has now effectively been passed as I gave them a chance and in doing bugger all they've used up that chance.
Yes, but ultimately you want your car repaired properly and without loss to yourself. It was after all, not your fault. All parties, presumably accept this?
So, whilst they have used up their 'one chance', in reality if it was offered that it went to a main dealer repair facility to be put right, you'd have a hard time refusing. Because regardless of fault you have a duty to mitigate your losses. In other words, you can't demand a brand new car now.
Best of luck, I'd also be warming up any legal cover you have, because I think you are going to need it.
So, whilst they have used up their 'one chance', in reality if it was offered that it went to a main dealer repair facility to be put right, you'd have a hard time refusing. Because regardless of fault you have a duty to mitigate your losses. In other words, you can't demand a brand new car now.
Best of luck, I'd also be warming up any legal cover you have, because I think you are going to need it.
Sadly this is happening more and more
It's the chase to the bottom , they old days of insurance company approved repairers being the best in the area has been replaced by whoever is prepared to do the work for the pittance the insurance companies offer .
Go through their procedure and when it fails insist that it is repaired at your preferred repairer or one that has been personally recommended to you .
It's the chase to the bottom , they old days of insurance company approved repairers being the best in the area has been replaced by whoever is prepared to do the work for the pittance the insurance companies offer .
Go through their procedure and when it fails insist that it is repaired at your preferred repairer or one that has been personally recommended to you .
Yeah, that's right. All I want is for it to be repaired to as it was immediately before the accident. Sadly I've now lost the love for the car due to all this so will likely change it but that's my choice. Sad as the car itself is great. I definitely don't expect them to get me a new one.
Yes, the parties at fault have coughed for it totally.
The "one chance" bit refers to the bodyshop that have screwed it up, not the claims people, yep they definitely need to fix it and perhaps the most annoying aspect of all of this is that it really isn't anything difficult in bodyshop terms so entirely reasonable to fix it and the even with adding on doing the job again it should still be well within "write off" limits. I need to check but basically the policy now allows me to choose somewhere else, assuming they've agreed that the "one chance" has been used up. They'll then pay and I'd assume the claims people would then look to recover their costs for doing it again from the first bodyshop.
Yep, the legal cover I have with my insurers is definitely on my list to do as part of my next steps.
Yes, the parties at fault have coughed for it totally.
The "one chance" bit refers to the bodyshop that have screwed it up, not the claims people, yep they definitely need to fix it and perhaps the most annoying aspect of all of this is that it really isn't anything difficult in bodyshop terms so entirely reasonable to fix it and the even with adding on doing the job again it should still be well within "write off" limits. I need to check but basically the policy now allows me to choose somewhere else, assuming they've agreed that the "one chance" has been used up. They'll then pay and I'd assume the claims people would then look to recover their costs for doing it again from the first bodyshop.
Yep, the legal cover I have with my insurers is definitely on my list to do as part of my next steps.
grumpy52 said:
Sadly this is happening more and more
It's the chase to the bottom , they old days of insurance company approved repairers being the best in the area has been replaced by whoever is prepared to do the work for the pittance the insurance companies offer .
Go through their procedure and when it fails insist that it is repaired at your preferred repairer or one that has been personally recommended to you .
Yep, I have a really good place I used to use but it's about 100 miles away since we moved. He stopped doing insurance jobs as he didn't feel he could do work properly for the money he'd get. That's partly the annoyance with the bodyshop used this time as they have some really fancy metal in their workshop, it's definitely not a crappy backstreet place where I would have expected a poor job. It's the chase to the bottom , they old days of insurance company approved repairers being the best in the area has been replaced by whoever is prepared to do the work for the pittance the insurance companies offer .
Go through their procedure and when it fails insist that it is repaired at your preferred repairer or one that has been personally recommended to you .
Alucidnation said:
Any bodywork that needs doing to any of ours, including the vans, always goes to the main dealer bodyshop, and not some s
tty back street workshop my insurance company insist on, that they have screwed on price.
Unfortunately they are becoming a rarity these days, Ford have hardly any dealer bodyshops now and just recommend their favoured local repairerstty back street workshop my insurance company insist on, that they have screwed on price.I had similar issues, the bodyshop had my car for 6 months, I kept rejecting it.
The first rejection was a simple one, drivers door sagged when I opened it, it hadn't before the accident, did a quick check round, checked the lights, indicators and hazards didn't work. So I got back in the courtesy car and drove off, called them and told them to give it a check over and contact me when it was sorted.
This started 6 months of fking me about.
The insurers weren't impressed when I produced a pre and post repair MOT, were it failed the MOT on lights etc not working after the repair and so the garage had returned my car in an unroadworthy condition.
I ended up having to take a wiring diagram in and then after explaining that Id worked out were the wiring problem was I had to then fix it myself as the mechanic wouldn't touch it. this was after they had claimed the loom was burnt and needed an auto electrician to fix it. I ended up finding a multi plug disconnected, connected it and all the electronics woes were fixed..
Its just an incompetent industry.
The last accident I had, I was passed on and on to different management companies, I just refused to speak to them, Id simply ask them for the claim reference number and they would hang up, dodgy as fk.
The whole car industry is a mess, last week I had contact with a service manager who didn't give a fk and just wanted me to pay for my car service, returned my car nearly 3 hours late. Muppet soon changed his tune after I contacted head office.
The first rejection was a simple one, drivers door sagged when I opened it, it hadn't before the accident, did a quick check round, checked the lights, indicators and hazards didn't work. So I got back in the courtesy car and drove off, called them and told them to give it a check over and contact me when it was sorted.
This started 6 months of f
king me about. The insurers weren't impressed when I produced a pre and post repair MOT, were it failed the MOT on lights etc not working after the repair and so the garage had returned my car in an unroadworthy condition.
I ended up having to take a wiring diagram in and then after explaining that Id worked out were the wiring problem was I had to then fix it myself as the mechanic wouldn't touch it. this was after they had claimed the loom was burnt and needed an auto electrician to fix it. I ended up finding a multi plug disconnected, connected it and all the electronics woes were fixed..
Its just an incompetent industry.
The last accident I had, I was passed on and on to different management companies, I just refused to speak to them, Id simply ask them for the claim reference number and they would hang up, dodgy as f
k.The whole car industry is a mess, last week I had contact with a service manager who didn't give a f
k and just wanted me to pay for my car service, returned my car nearly 3 hours late. Muppet soon changed his tune after I contacted head office. Edited by Foliage on Friday 14th February 13:30
Well, nothing has arrived in the post and as that has been their preferred method of communication up to now I have taken that to mean they haven't responded to me by today and therefore are "out of time".
So, letter sent to them (pdf via email) pointing all this out. Also sent that letter plus the original complaint letter and some further details to the external mediation company that is their next step in escalating a complaint.
I'll get hold of my insurers at the weekend to start the ball rolling with the legal cover.
So, letter sent to them (pdf via email) pointing all this out. Also sent that letter plus the original complaint letter and some further details to the external mediation company that is their next step in escalating a complaint.
I'll get hold of my insurers at the weekend to start the ball rolling with the legal cover.
Tyre Smoke said:
Your next step should be to the people whose own 8 week deadline has now passed. Give them chapter and verse of your complaint (yes, I know, again) and give them seven days to respond to your request - whatever that might be. I wouldn't speak to the repair shop again, your 'contract' is not with them, but the claims handlers.
After seven days have elapsed, take it to the next step.
Not quite the next steps, the 8 week deadline is set out by the FCA, firms have 8 weeks to investigate the complaint before the FOS are allowed start their enquiries.After seven days have elapsed, take it to the next step.
At the end of the 8 weeks if they have not concluded their investigation and issued you their Final Decision they should write to you to explain why they need more time however after this point you can go to the FOS without a Final Decision from the company.
OP next step is to open a complaint with the FOS.
ZOLLAR said:
Not quite the next steps, the 8 week deadline is set out by the FCA, firms have 8 weeks to investigate the complaint before the FOS are allowed start their enquiries.
At the end of the 8 weeks if they have not concluded their investigation and issued you their Final Decision they should write to you to explain why they need more time however after this point you can go to the FOS without a Final Decision from the company.
OP next step is to open a complaint with the FOS.
Interesting. Is it genuinely an FOS issue though? Obviously it was a credit hire etc but no fault etc. The key issue is with how crap the repairs were. At the end of the 8 weeks if they have not concluded their investigation and issued you their Final Decision they should write to you to explain why they need more time however after this point you can go to the FOS without a Final Decision from the company.
OP next step is to open a complaint with the FOS.
jeff666 said:
I run a small body shop,
I have been turning Insurance work away for years now and people are amazed when I say thanks but no thanks, as mentioned a race to the bottom price wise driven by the Insurance companies.
Motor traders also get told no thanks but that's for another thread.
I owned a bodyshop for numerous years before I sold it.I have been turning Insurance work away for years now and people are amazed when I say thanks but no thanks, as mentioned a race to the bottom price wise driven by the Insurance companies.
Motor traders also get told no thanks but that's for another thread.
We turned insurance work away as well. It has indeed just become a race to the bottom and insurance companies will just use whoever is cheapest. Last I heard was that insurance rates were down as far as £24 per hour.
Most insurance work is now done by real “Bodge it ‘n’ Scarper” type bodyshops operating out of huge dilapidated sheds and running a large scale production line of shoddy repairs, even buying secondhand parts and panels were possible.
Motor traders were most welcome though. When you have 12 of them each spending around £2500 with you every month without ever having to produce quotes, estimates, or deal with the public, it’s a sweet deal.
Interesting on the FOS aspect definitely; I'll follow that up. In the meantime nothing received today in the post so we're now very definitely outside the 8 week window now.
Last night I heard back from the external mediation company who is recommended as the "next step". I've now sent them all the details, correspondence, photos, detailed timeline and what my expectations are. Chap has responded to me saying its really detailed and will be a big help. He hasn't heard back from the claims management people. He contacted them after my initial contact with him early afternoon yesterday. As such, not too surprising as it was a Friday afternoon.
Last night I heard back from the external mediation company who is recommended as the "next step". I've now sent them all the details, correspondence, photos, detailed timeline and what my expectations are. Chap has responded to me saying its really detailed and will be a big help. He hasn't heard back from the claims management people. He contacted them after my initial contact with him early afternoon yesterday. As such, not too surprising as it was a Friday afternoon.
Tiny bit more on this this morning. Claims management people have responded.
Minor annoyance in that they're saying the "within 8 weeks" is not until a week today as they didn't log the complaint until 30/12/19, I sent it on the 21st so it took them 9 days. Christmas aside that's crap but they seem to be saying "fair enough" and have agreed the situation is "unacceptable".
They've provided a quote from the bodyshop when they chased them on 04/02/20. Excuse was they were waiting for parts but didn't want to pester me. I've told the claims management co I simply don't believe this. Parts delay was allegedly the issue during the first repairs. I've also checked with the manufacturer via contact and there are no parts delays on the stuff expected to be needed. Most is available next day. Notwithstanding all that a key aspect of my complaint was the awful to non-existent communications so a further 5 weeks on from their last contact with me the "we don't want to pester him" argument falls flat.
I've told the claims people that's my take on things and they seem to be agreeing so far.
Minor annoyance in that they're saying the "within 8 weeks" is not until a week today as they didn't log the complaint until 30/12/19, I sent it on the 21st so it took them 9 days. Christmas aside that's crap but they seem to be saying "fair enough" and have agreed the situation is "unacceptable".
They've provided a quote from the bodyshop when they chased them on 04/02/20. Excuse was they were waiting for parts but didn't want to pester me. I've told the claims management co I simply don't believe this. Parts delay was allegedly the issue during the first repairs. I've also checked with the manufacturer via contact and there are no parts delays on the stuff expected to be needed. Most is available next day. Notwithstanding all that a key aspect of my complaint was the awful to non-existent communications so a further 5 weeks on from their last contact with me the "we don't want to pester him" argument falls flat.
I've told the claims people that's my take on things and they seem to be agreeing so far.
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