Can I find out when someone got out of jail?

[Wildcat45]

My wife is doing a bit of research into her family history and has uncovered a rather unpleasant family secret involving a distant relative who murdered someone.

They were jailed “at her majesty’s pleasure” in 1956.

I’m surprised they weren’t sent to the gallows but I am guessing they were declared insane as the record shows unfit to plead.

Also. “Closed or retained document open description. Access open description. Access conditions. Closed for 75 years. Access conditions Closure criterion not used at this date. Lord Chancellors instrument LCI 41-Series containing both closure an accelerated opening instruments. LCI sign date 1975 June 01. Record opening date Jan 1 2032.”

Is the1975 date when this guy was released?

Why would the documents not be available until 2032?

It is clearly a very sensitive issue. My mother in law knows there was some terrible scandal but nothing more. There are family members still alive who were devastated by what happened. Hence their silence. The case attracted publicity at the time but I would prefer not to go into the precise details .

If anyone can shed light on this, I’d be grateful.

Edited by Wildcat45 on Tuesday 14th December 10:42

[anonymous-user]

Probably be able to google that, murders aren’t that common in the UK especially in the mid 50s.

[Wildcat45]

[quote=Newarch]Probably be able to google that, murders aren’t that common in the UK especially in the mid 50s.[/quote

We have and since I posted I have discovered the reason for the file being kept secret.

“Sensitive personal information which would distress or endanger descendants.”

So I’m now looking to find out when he was released.

[Sgt Bilko]

That signing date and opening date were applied to a number of records of similar ilk during that time. I think I found the same chap, and there’s another website giving some circumstances but I won’t repeat that here as it sounds like you know that already. The LCI was ability to extend the release of records which were in the public interest or to protect victims or offenders. I would hazard a guess and say that in the records, there’s personal medical information about the convicted which led to the unfit to stand trial decision. You can apply through FOI for them to review the decision, and I suspect it would be the Ministry of Justice who would decide.

Edit. You beat me to it whilst typing. Perhaps an FOI to the MOJ might elicit that information as part of your research?

Edited by Sgt Bilko on Monday 13th December 21:15

[Wildcat45]

Sgt Bilko said:

That signing date and opening date were applied to a number of records of similar ilk during that time. I think I found the same chap, and there’s another website giving some circumstances but I won’t repeat that here as it sounds like you know that already. The LCI was ability to extend the release of records which were in the public interest or to protect victims or offenders. I would hazard a guess and say that in the records, there’s personal medical information about the convicted which led to the unfit to stand trial decision. You can apply through FOI for them to review the decision, and I suspect it would be the Ministry of Justice who would decide.

Edit. You beat me to it whilst typing. Perhaps an FOI to the MOJ might elicit that information as part of your research?

Edited by Sgt Bilko on Monday 13th December 21:15

That’s really great. Thanks for that. And thanks for the sensitivity. His brother is 90 odd years old. A really great old chap who obviously has had to carry the knowledge of this for decades.

FOI request submitted just now.

Ironically, my wife found the info when googling the surname and place of birth to try and find old photos so she could make him an album of his old home town. She only knew what her mum had said about a scandal and has dropped down this fascinating but disturbing rabbit hole.

We are also assuming the offender is dead. This may not be the case.

[anonymous-user]

It’s a very interesting piece of family history. One problem a lot of people have is that their ancestors are often lionised or put up on a pedestal whereas quite a few people even in our recent past are liable to have been fairly unpleasant characters.

The thing to remember in situations like this is that you are you and not your immediate family or relatives. So there is no guilt or shame attached to an accident of birth relating you to a murderer or a slave trader or them being Welsh or something.

Also heroes and significant figures often tend to have some pretty undesirable traits, especially if judged by modern standards.

[Wildcat45]

Newarch said:

It’s a very interesting piece of family history. One problem a lot of people have is that their ancestors are often lionised or put up on a pedestal whereas quite a few people even in our recent past are liable to have been fairly unpleasant characters.

The thing to remember in situations like this is that you are you and not your immediate family or relatives. So there is no guilt or shame attached to an accident of birth relating you to a murderer or a slave trader or them being Welsh or something.

Also heroes and significant figures often tend to have some pretty undesirable traits, especially if judged by modern standards.

My wife - who is the distant relative - is fascinated but equally horrified. It’s more the offender’s brother who I guess at the time was hit hard. It would have been a massive deal in the home town.

We have no intention of revealing what we have discovered, even though it’s all there via Google until the living relative has died. It would devastate him if he thought this was all in the past, suppressed and forgotten.

Family secrets can be trivial things, like a divorce or a kid born out of wedlock. Big deals back when standards were different.

In my own family, the secret life of my bigamous great grandfather ended up in a book.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Love-Dangerous-Men-Histor...

[Wildcat45]

So if I email HM Prison Service, will they give me a release date?

We can’t find any evidence this guy is dead. In theory is it possible that he could be shut away somewhere in Broadmoor or somewhere?

[sospan]

Is the relative still alive? Would next of kin be informed of death? I would think so as a legal requirement. Even if released then he would likely be on very stringent terms of release ( licensing, probationary contact etc).

[Willhire89]

Wildcat45 said:

So if I email HM Prison Service, will they give me a release date?

We can’t find any evidence this guy is dead. In theory is it possible that he could be shut away somewhere in Broadmoor or somewhere?

If is the person I think it is would they not be 104 years old now?

That name produced no results on 192 address check which would go back 20 years maybe but that disregards they had a new name

[JoPo1]

Found the person you’re speaking about (not many murders in ‘56 with those terms imposed on information).

From a bit more digging there’s a website claiming they’re still alive but under the care of the National Health Service (NHS).

Also, that is some fked up crime to commit. Not surprised they weren’t fit to plea.

[Wildcat45]

JoPo1 said:

Found the person you’re speaking about (not many murders in ‘56 with those terms imposed on information).

From a bit more digging there’s a website claiming they’re still alive but under the care of the National Health Service (NHS).

Also, that is some fked up crime to commit. Not surprised they weren’t fit to plea.

It is truly horrible isn’t it. The victim sounded like an outstanding individual


Would you mind messaging the link to the page where it says they are alive please.

[vaud]

JoPo1 said:

Found the person you’re speaking about (not many murders in ‘56 with those terms imposed on information).

Yikes - I found it too and its very local to me.

[Greendubber]

Interesting stuff.