S172 - Registration mark fails to conform.

[Blanchimont]

SP&L collective.

I had a S172 come through yesterday for a "registration mark fails to conform with regulations".

I've got short plates, but are marked accordingly, and are spaced correctly. (Whilst they may be a crime against taste for some, but from what I've found, not illegal)

From memory, it was a police bike parked up looking for speeders. As my plates are legal, is it worth appealing?

[carreauchompeur]

There’s no ‘appeal’ as such. You can either take the conditional offer or enter a request for Court hearing.

I’d suspect your plates actually don’t conform, so the easier option might be to change them. Get caught again and it’ll also be referred to DVLA.

[carreauchompeur]

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/governmen...

[Blanchimont]

carreauchompeur said:

There’s no ‘appeal’ as such. You can either take the conditional offer or enter a request for Court hearing.

I’d suspect your plates actually don’t conform, so the easier option might be to change them. Get caught again and it’ll also be referred to DVLA.

What happens with the court process?
They're short plates, but X11 XXX. They BSAU145D codes, and the suppliers postcode on them, and the place I bought them from are accredited with the DVLA. So I presumed they were ok?

[blueg33]

carreauchompeur said:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/governmen...

If your plate meets the dimensions and spacing shown in the doc above, I would fight it. Maybe get an MOT tester to measure it and do a written statement?

[SS2.]

Blanchimont said:

I had a S172 come through yesterday for a "registration mark fails to conform with regulations".

I've got short plates, but are marked accordingly, and are spaced correctly. (Whilst they may be a crime against taste for some, but from what I've found, not illegal)

Have you changed the plates in the past few months ?

Blanchimont in July 2021 said:

I've got a 6 digit reg, and it's on a short plate.

However, It's legal font, and not spaced like a knob (It's got no central space after the numbers, granted).

I'd rather not st myself every time I see a police car drive past. It's possible I'll get pulled, yeah. But it's a damn sure less likely than a blatantly mis-spaced, tinted, 4D plate.

[No ideas for a name]

From the document above it implies longer plates wouldn't comply!
It states;
the margins at the top, bottom and side of the plate must be 11mm
Since the spacing between groups and digits is specified, then if you have less characters then it must be shorter

More seriously how would this work in practice? I assume you were not stopped and plates measured, just 'observed'.
If you were to go to court and take your physical plates with you, would they just say those were not the plates that were observed?

[omniflow]

Blanchimont said:

SP&L collective.

I had a S172 come through yesterday for a "registration mark fails to conform with regulations".

I've got short plates, but are marked accordingly, and are spaced correctly. (Whilst they may be a crime against taste for some, but from what I've found, not illegal)

From memory, it was a police bike parked up looking for speeders. As my plates are legal, is it worth appealing?

I have short plates on my car. I bought them from Four Dot. They are completely legal and they come with a plastic card to keep in the glovebox stating the regulations and listing each and every attribute in those regulations and the way in which these plates meet them. They are spaced correctly, and there is an appropriate space between the letters and the numbers.

If your plates are actually spaced correctly, then I'd take my chances in court. However, if there's no space between the letters and numbers then they're not actually spaced correctly, so you'll lose.

[Blanchimont]

SS2. said:

Blanchimont said:

I had a S172 come through yesterday for a "registration mark fails to conform with regulations".

I've got short plates, but are marked accordingly, and are spaced correctly. (Whilst they may be a crime against taste for some, but from what I've found, not illegal)

Have you changed the plates in the past few months ?

Blanchimont in July 2021 said:

I've got a 6 digit reg, and it's on a short plate.

However, It's legal font, and not spaced like a knob (It's got no central space after the numbers, granted).

I'd rather not st myself every time I see a police car drive past. It's possible I'll get pulled, yeah. But it's a damn sure less likely than a blatantly mis-spaced, tinted, 4D plate.

I did, changed car since then and bought new plates and spaced them properly

[Blanchimont]

No ideas for a name said:

From the document above it implies longer plates wouldn't comply!
It states;
the margins at the top, bottom and side of the plate must be 11mm
Since the spacing between groups and digits is specified, then if you have less characters then it must be shorter

More seriously how would this work in practice? I assume you were not stopped and plates measured, just 'observed'.
If you were to go to court and take your physical plates with you, would they just say those were not the plates that were observed?

I wasn't stopped or anything, just observed from a mobile speed camera.
This is exactly what I'm wondering, I haven't had a copy of any of the photos of anything

[SS2.]

Blanchimont said:

SS2. said:

Blanchimont said:

I had a S172 come through yesterday for a "registration mark fails to conform with regulations".

I've got short plates, but are marked accordingly, and are spaced correctly. (Whilst they may be a crime against taste for some, but from what I've found, not illegal)

Have you changed the plates in the past few months ?

Blanchimont in July 2021 said:

I've got a 6 digit reg, and it's on a short plate.

However, It's legal font, and not spaced like a knob (It's got no central space after the numbers, granted).

I'd rather not st myself every time I see a police car drive past. It's possible I'll get pulled, yeah. But it's a damn sure less likely than a blatantly mis-spaced, tinted, 4D plate.

I did, changed car since then and bought new plates and spaced them properly

In that case, and if I was certain the plates are legal, then I wouldn't be paying any fine.

You could consider writing to the issuing office and pointing out why you think the plates are legal. This would give them the opportunity to review the details and, if they see fit, to quietly drop the matter.

Note you must ensure you reply to the s.172 notice, fully and within time.

If they ignore your claim that the plate is legal, and you ignore any resulting FPN, you should expect court proceedings to be commenced at some point within the next few months.

If, on closer inspection, you do find the plates to be non-conforming, then you might save yourself more grief and greater cost by simply paying the FPN.

Blanchimont said:

I haven't had a copy of any of the photos of anything

At this stage, they are not required to provide you with any.

Edited by SS2. on Wednesday 9th February 10:50

[Nigel Worc's]

Blanchimont said:

I wasn't stopped or anything, just observed from a mobile speed camera.
This is exactly what I'm wondering, I haven't had a copy of any of the photos of anything

You'll know if your plate conforms though, for example I know the ones on my work van don't despite the fact they look legal and everything is correct they don't have the correct type number on them as I couldn't be arsed to take whatever I need to Halfords or whoever.

I'm never going to get pulled for them, but I do know they aren't quite correct in legal terms.

[Dogwatch]

Blanchimont said:

They're short plates, but X11 XXX.

Only one less character than a full set then?

[Derek Smith]

In my years as a police officer I have been known to be a bit petty. Mostly it was because of circumstances. My lowest was a cabbie whom I reported for leaving his vehicle in specified cab parking rank when second in the queue and for not wearing his badge in a prominant position. He learned the lesson of it being inadvisable to deliberately irritate a PC when commiting cab offences.

I got a reputation after that. I might have considered booking a frog that wasn't hopping, but I have never, ever, been tempted to report the owner of a vehicle with defective plates if they are not intended, not likely to obscure.

[blueg33]

Dogwatch said:

Blanchimont said:

They're short plates, but X11 XXX.

Only one less character than a full set then?

The 1's are allowed to be narrower than other characters, so that makes the plate shorter. I have X11 OCH, so the plate is shorter but meets the spacing regs.

[Ardennes92]

Just a question but without a photo, how do you know it is your vehicle and not a cloned version?

[DodgyGeezer]

Another thing to bear in mind is that the police don't always know the full rules/regs when it comes to number plates. Be 101% sure of your legality and if you are have your day (so to speak)

[Blanchimont]

Ardennes92 said:

Just a question but without a photo, how do you know it is your vehicle and not a cloned version?

It says the date/time of offense. I was there.

[Blanchimont]

I have also just checked, and the NIP was issued 13 days after the offense, but arrived 15 days after it. Presumably it's the issue date the 14 day rule applies?

ETA:
Offense date: 23/1/22, Notice Issue date: 05/2/22, received 8/2/22.

Edited by Blanchimont on Wednesday 9th February 11:51

[PorkInsider]

Blanchimont said:

I have also just checked, and the NIP was issued 13 days after the offense, but arrived 15 days after it. Presumably it's the issue date the 14 day rule applies?

ETA:
Offense date: 23/1/22, Notice Issue date: 05/2/22, received 8/2/22.

Edited by Blanchimont on Wednesday 9th February 11:51

No idea if the rule is 14 days in the US, to be honest. ( sorry)

But yes, I believe you're correct. The NIP is supposed to be posted out so that it would arrive in 14 days. It was never going to arrive in 14 days of the offence when they posted it on a Saturday and it needed to arrive on the Sunday.