Yet another private parking appeal question
Discussion
Okay less of a question, more of a desire to get opinions of others seeing as I've appealed this already and awaiting a decision.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5119022,-0.03324...
I parked here for probably no more than 45mins, and returned to find a ticket on the windscreen. I was unaware that it was a private parking area and, upon scanning around, could only find one lonely parking sign affixed high up on an adjacent wall. I've since driven back through there and there are no other signs or markings to indicate it's an enforced or private area other than the one sign. Above Maps link shows a yellow (possibly disabled) bay next to my car but there are no lines on the ground there now, and the reason being that I was 'Parked in an area where no parking is allowed'
Basis of my appeal was the lack of sufficient signage coupled with the fact the printed ticket it barely legible, with not a single piece of information printed in the correct box (Date: 'Red', Issue time: 'Ford', Reg: E14 7HS etc.)
It rather gets me thinking about the adopted roles by these private parking firms as the judge, jury and executioner.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5119022,-0.03324...
I parked here for probably no more than 45mins, and returned to find a ticket on the windscreen. I was unaware that it was a private parking area and, upon scanning around, could only find one lonely parking sign affixed high up on an adjacent wall. I've since driven back through there and there are no other signs or markings to indicate it's an enforced or private area other than the one sign. Above Maps link shows a yellow (possibly disabled) bay next to my car but there are no lines on the ground there now, and the reason being that I was 'Parked in an area where no parking is allowed'
Basis of my appeal was the lack of sufficient signage coupled with the fact the printed ticket it barely legible, with not a single piece of information printed in the correct box (Date: 'Red', Issue time: 'Ford', Reg: E14 7HS etc.)
It rather gets me thinking about the adopted roles by these private parking firms as the judge, jury and executioner.
What information is on the sign?
FWIW, https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedu... is the law covering this sort of stuff they have to comply with. Most appeals seem to be successful where the parking company has not followed the letter of the law (which seems fairly frequent!). Pepipoo is a good source of letter templates, etc, and people will give you tailored advice if you post up the redacted letter.
Chris
FWIW, https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedu... is the law covering this sort of stuff they have to comply with. Most appeals seem to be successful where the parking company has not followed the letter of the law (which seems fairly frequent!). Pepipoo is a good source of letter templates, etc, and people will give you tailored advice if you post up the redacted letter.
Chris
ScoobyChris said:
What information is on the sign?
FWIW, https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedu... is the law covering this sort of stuff they have to comply with. Most appeals seem to be successful where the parking company has not followed the letter of the law (which seems fairly frequent!). Pepipoo is a good source of letter templates, etc, and people will give you tailored advice if you post up the redacted letter.
Chris
FWIW, https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedu... is the law covering this sort of stuff they have to comply with. Most appeals seem to be successful where the parking company has not followed the letter of the law (which seems fairly frequent!). Pepipoo is a good source of letter templates, etc, and people will give you tailored advice if you post up the redacted letter.
Chris
I don't wish to be "that guy" but personally I wouldn't expect to find unrestricted/free parking anywhere in central London, especially a stone's throw away from Canary Wharf. Not trying to be a dick, but the sign is not exactly hidden away and makes it fairly clear.
I guess the barely legible ticket is another story, Pepipoo seems to be the place to go for help. Good luck
I guess the barely legible ticket is another story, Pepipoo seems to be the place to go for help. Good luck
Koyaanisqatsi said:
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5119022,-0.03324...
I parked here for probably no more than 45mins, and returned to find a ticket on the windscreen. I was unaware that it was a private parking area and, upon scanning around, could only find one lonely parking sign affixed high up on an adjacent wall. I've since driven back through there and there are no other signs or markings to indicate it's an enforced or private area other than the one sign. Above Maps link shows a yellow (possibly disabled) bay next to my car but there are no lines on the ground there now, and the reason being that I was 'Parked in an area where no parking is allowed'
Basis of my appeal was the lack of sufficient signage coupled with the fact the printed ticket it barely legible, with not a single piece of information printed in the correct box (Date: 'Red', Issue time: 'Ford', Reg: E14 7HS etc.)
Looking on Street View there are signs for no parking, parking company signs, resident's access only signs, and allocated spaces all around where you linked. I think it is obvious it is a private parking area. I parked here for probably no more than 45mins, and returned to find a ticket on the windscreen. I was unaware that it was a private parking area and, upon scanning around, could only find one lonely parking sign affixed high up on an adjacent wall. I've since driven back through there and there are no other signs or markings to indicate it's an enforced or private area other than the one sign. Above Maps link shows a yellow (possibly disabled) bay next to my car but there are no lines on the ground there now, and the reason being that I was 'Parked in an area where no parking is allowed'
Basis of my appeal was the lack of sufficient signage coupled with the fact the printed ticket it barely legible, with not a single piece of information printed in the correct box (Date: 'Red', Issue time: 'Ford', Reg: E14 7HS etc.)
There is also keep clear signs around the entry both your cars are overlapping.
I also think that parking sign on the wall is clear to see.
Edited by Driver101 on Tuesday 25th October 12:29
Driver101 said:
Looking on Street View there are signs for no parking, parking company signs, resident's access only signs, and allocated spaces all around where you linked. I think it is obvious it is a private parking area.
There is also keep clear signs around the entry both your cars are overlapping.
I also think that parking sign on the wall is clear to see.
My car is the Kuga. If you mean the single faded red 'Keep Clear' sign behind the white 5-series then that's the only sign there, and me parking there for 45 minutes is not inhibiting any access emergency or otherwise. All other signs you can see scattered around relate to 'pedestrian access this way', 'keep gate locked' etc.There is also keep clear signs around the entry both your cars are overlapping.
I also think that parking sign on the wall is clear to see.
The most recent Streetview images are from 2016 which indeed shows a yellow hatched section next to that space, but 6+ years later that has faded and disappeared it would seem, so those Streetview images are as good as useless. The only single UKPC parking-related sign there now is the one seen in the photos I took.
Koyaanisqatsi said:
Driver101 said:
Looking on Street View there are signs for no parking, parking company signs, resident's access only signs, and allocated spaces all around where you linked. I think it is obvious it is a private parking area.
There is also keep clear signs around the entry both your cars are overlapping.
I also think that parking sign on the wall is clear to see.
My car is the Kuga. If you mean the single faded red 'Keep Clear' sign behind the white 5-series then that's the only sign there, and me parking there for 45 minutes is not inhibiting any access emergency or otherwise. All other signs you can see scattered around relate to 'pedestrian access this way', 'keep gate locked' etc.There is also keep clear signs around the entry both your cars are overlapping.
I also think that parking sign on the wall is clear to see.
The most recent Streetview images are from 2016 which indeed shows a yellow hatched section next to that space, but 6+ years later that has faded and disappeared it would seem, so those Streetview images are as good as useless. The only single UKPC parking-related sign there now is the one seen in the photos I took.
There are three keep clear signs where you both are parked. One directly behind the cars and more on the gates. Your own photos are too blurry. They might be a bit faded, but you knew what it said just like that sign on the wall isn't too high.
You don't feel you're causing an obstruction, but it is very tight and it is clear they need access and someway of turning.
I can't see where you are coming from on this one. There is only enough signs you can put up and you have to expect some common sense and decency from drivers.
The sign, as are many on private land, is not worth the metal its printed on.
As well appealing on lack of signage you should have pointed out its a forbidding sign so cannot form a contract.
Your only liability would be for damages under trespass.
As well appealing on lack of signage you should have pointed out its a forbidding sign so cannot form a contract.
Your only liability would be for damages under trespass.
Edited by Mrr T on Tuesday 25th October 14:36
I've recently copped a parking charge notice from Parking Control Management who are clearly targeting a school my son's football team uses for training in the evening. It's a new 'private' estate where the roads are narrow and the lighting isn't great. You can't even see the no entry signs on one of the roads and yes, there are parking enforcement notices here and there but you cannot see them as they're not bright and not placed in clearly visible positions.
I couldn't get in the car park as cars were leaving the school so I sat (with my engine running/lights on) and waited for the tide to fall. PCM pounced and issued a ticket. From the images it looks like they have an unmarked car taking pictures ofvictims AHEM, offenders.
Yes, I'm rejecting the 'charge' and from what I can see it's not enforceable as such (only a few end up in court). There a few forums with plenty of examples: pepipoo.com and MSE. It can be quite a headache as every case is different.
Have you tried Googling the estate with UKPC in the search?
I couldn't get in the car park as cars were leaving the school so I sat (with my engine running/lights on) and waited for the tide to fall. PCM pounced and issued a ticket. From the images it looks like they have an unmarked car taking pictures of
Yes, I'm rejecting the 'charge' and from what I can see it's not enforceable as such (only a few end up in court). There a few forums with plenty of examples: pepipoo.com and MSE. It can be quite a headache as every case is different.
Have you tried Googling the estate with UKPC in the search?
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