NIP dated outside 14 days
Discussion
I've recently received a NIP (37 in a 30) The event took place on 28.12.22 and the NIP is dated 16.01.23. I received the letter on the 18.01.23.
The car is correctly registered in my name and at the correct address. I was driving.
The NIP was prepared more than 14 days after the event which, as far as I can ascertain, makes it likely to be invalid.
I've been advised by an online solicitor to complete the "Identity of the driver" section but not to give the driving license details and to enclose a covering letter stating that I'm not accepting the NIP due to it being issued outside the 14 day period. The solicitor also said there was no guarantee that the police would drop the case, which I found strange.
I can't see why I have to admit to being the driver and would prefer to just return the form with a covering letter.
Has anyone else had experience of dealing with a similar case i.e. where the documented dates show that 14 days was exceeded, and if so how did you proceed ?
Thanks
The car is correctly registered in my name and at the correct address. I was driving.
The NIP was prepared more than 14 days after the event which, as far as I can ascertain, makes it likely to be invalid.
I've been advised by an online solicitor to complete the "Identity of the driver" section but not to give the driving license details and to enclose a covering letter stating that I'm not accepting the NIP due to it being issued outside the 14 day period. The solicitor also said there was no guarantee that the police would drop the case, which I found strange.
I can't see why I have to admit to being the driver and would prefer to just return the form with a covering letter.
Has anyone else had experience of dealing with a similar case i.e. where the documented dates show that 14 days was exceeded, and if so how did you proceed ?
Thanks
If you don't name the driver you commit a separate offence which will get you 6 points and an income related fine plus costs (generally totaling about £700) plus an MS90 endorsement which insurance comapnies don't like, so you need to answer this. I suspect that not including your driving licence (not license) details is also not a good idea and could also leave you open to a "failing to furnish" charge.
Are you absolutely sure that you are the registered keeper? Is the car on any kind of finance where the registered keeper might be a finance company? Have you recently bought the car or moved house which might mean that although you are the registered keeper this doesn't show up on the DVLA records? It is very rare that a first NIP is sent after 14 days (being delivered later than 14 days is a different matter and more likely at the moment due to postal strikes).
You have nothing to lose by naming yourself and including a covering letter pointing out that the letter was sent outside the 14 days allowed. However you might get a reply stating that the first NIP (the only one that has a time limit) went to "someone else" - such as the finance company that are actually the registered keeper.
Are you absolutely sure that you are the registered keeper? Is the car on any kind of finance where the registered keeper might be a finance company? Have you recently bought the car or moved house which might mean that although you are the registered keeper this doesn't show up on the DVLA records? It is very rare that a first NIP is sent after 14 days (being delivered later than 14 days is a different matter and more likely at the moment due to postal strikes).
You have nothing to lose by naming yourself and including a covering letter pointing out that the letter was sent outside the 14 days allowed. However you might get a reply stating that the first NIP (the only one that has a time limit) went to "someone else" - such as the finance company that are actually the registered keeper.
Edited by douglasb on Saturday 28th January 10:03
douglasb said:
If you don't name the driver you commit a separate offence which will get you 6 points and an income related fine plus costs (generally totaling about £700) plus an MS90 endorsement which insurance comapnies don't like, so you need to answer this. I suspect that not including your driving licence (not license) details is also not a good idea and could also leave you open to a "failing to furnish" charge.
Are you absolutely sure that you are the registered keeper? Is the car on any kind of finance where the registered keeper might be a finance company? Have you recently bought the car or moved house which might mean that although you are the registered keeper this doesn't show up on the DVLA records? It is very rare that a first NIP is sent after 14 days (being delivered later than 14 days is a different matter and more likely at the moment due to postal strikes).
You have nothing to lose by naming yourself and including a covering letter pointing out that the letter was sent outside the 14 days allowed. However you might get a reply stating that the first NIP (the only one that has a time limit) went to "someone else" - such as the finance company that are actually the registered keeper.
Good advice here. Read and take note op.Are you absolutely sure that you are the registered keeper? Is the car on any kind of finance where the registered keeper might be a finance company? Have you recently bought the car or moved house which might mean that although you are the registered keeper this doesn't show up on the DVLA records? It is very rare that a first NIP is sent after 14 days (being delivered later than 14 days is a different matter and more likely at the moment due to postal strikes).
You have nothing to lose by naming yourself and including a covering letter pointing out that the letter was sent outside the 14 days allowed. However you might get a reply stating that the first NIP (the only one that has a time limit) went to "someone else" - such as the finance company that are actually the registered keeper.
Edited by douglasb on Saturday 28th January 10:03
douglasb said:
If you don't name the driver you commit a separate offence which will get you 6 points and an income related fine plus costs (generally totaling about £700) plus an MS90 endorsement which insurance comapnies don't like, so you need to answer this. I suspect that not including your driving licence (not license) details is also not a good idea and could also leave you open to a "failing to furnish" charge.
Are you absolutely sure that you are the registered keeper? Is the car on any kind of finance where the registered keeper might be a finance company? Have you recently bought the car or moved house which might mean that although you are the registered keeper this doesn't show up on the DVLA records? It is very rare that a first NIP is sent after 14 days (being delivered later than 14 days is a different matter and more likely at the moment due to postal strikes).
You have nothing to lose by naming yourself and including a covering letter pointing out that the letter was sent outside the 14 days allowed. However you might get a reply stating that the first NIP (the only one that has a time limit) went to "someone else" - such as the finance company that are actually the registered keeper.
I'm the registered keeper. The car isn't on finance. I have the V5C in my possession which includes all the correct details. I intend to name myself and include a covering letter but I'm not so keen on giving my driving license details. Can anyone confirm or otherwise that I have to do so ?Are you absolutely sure that you are the registered keeper? Is the car on any kind of finance where the registered keeper might be a finance company? Have you recently bought the car or moved house which might mean that although you are the registered keeper this doesn't show up on the DVLA records? It is very rare that a first NIP is sent after 14 days (being delivered later than 14 days is a different matter and more likely at the moment due to postal strikes).
You have nothing to lose by naming yourself and including a covering letter pointing out that the letter was sent outside the 14 days allowed. However you might get a reply stating that the first NIP (the only one that has a time limit) went to "someone else" - such as the finance company that are actually the registered keeper.
Edited by douglasb on Saturday 28th January 10:03
If I include all the details what's to stop the police just fining me and putting points on the license, irrespective of my letter ? I'd then be in the position of having to fight the case.
mph said:
I've been advised by an online solicitor to complete the "Identity of the driver" section but not to give the driving license details and to enclose a covering letter stating that I'm not accepting the NIP due to it being issued outside the 14 day period..
Why aren’t you just following the advice you state you have been given and apparently want to do?The part about what is to stop the police just adding points is pure tin foil hat level nonsense.
Dingu said:
Why aren’t you just following the advice you state you have been given and apparently want to do?
The part about what is to stop the police just adding points is pure tin foil hat level nonsense.
I only ask because I'm not sure how the allocation of points/fine works and whether giving all my details on the form removes me from the loop. The solicitor did say that it's not black and white and while I may hear nothing further, other forces will just continue to issue the NIP.The part about what is to stop the police just adding points is pure tin foil hat level nonsense.
I was hoping to hear from others who have been through a similar process.
mph said:
Dingu said:
Why aren’t you just following the advice you state you have been given and apparently want to do?
The part about what is to stop the police just adding points is pure tin foil hat level nonsense.
I only ask because I'm not sure how the allocation of points/fine works and whether giving all my details on the form removes me from the loop. The solicitor did say that it's not black and white and while I may hear nothing further, other forces will just continue to issue the NIP.The part about what is to stop the police just adding points is pure tin foil hat level nonsense.
I was hoping to hear from others who have been through a similar process.
Unless I’m missing something.
mph said:
I've been advised by an online solicitor to complete the "Identity of the driver" section but not to give the driving license details and to enclose a covering letter stating that I'm not accepting the NIP due to it being issued outside the 14 day period. The solicitor also said there was no guarantee that the police would drop the case, which I found strange.
What is an “online solicitor?”I still think that not giving your driving licence number isn't a good idea as it potentially leaves you open to a "failing to furnish" charge.
If you complete the form and add a covering letter then, as you have the V5C with your correct details and you have had this since before the alleged speeding, you should get a letter saying "Our mistake. No further action". If that doesn't happen then here is how things will go -
Assuming that this happened in England or Wales and that you haven't done a speed awareness coure in the last 3 years, you wil get an offer of a course. This takes about 3 to 4 hours, costs about £90 and is done on Zoom. You don't need to tell your insurer about this (Admiral used to ask but don't any more). If you ignore this, your case will proceed to a Single Justice Procedure and you will be asked to plead guilty or not guilty. If you plead guilty, a magistrate will make a decision on the penalty - which will be 3 points, an SP30 endorsement and an income related fine and costs (expect about £300 at this point).
Rather than ignoring the course offer, you can ask for a court hearing where you would point out that the first NIP was dated more than 14 days after the speeding so is out of time. This should see the case against you dropped. However, if the police produce evidence that an earlier NIP was produced because for some reason they couldn't ascertain the registered keeper details (which as you have the V5C in your name shouldn't happen) you go back to 3 points, an SP30 and a fine. .
If you complete the form and add a covering letter then, as you have the V5C with your correct details and you have had this since before the alleged speeding, you should get a letter saying "Our mistake. No further action". If that doesn't happen then here is how things will go -
Assuming that this happened in England or Wales and that you haven't done a speed awareness coure in the last 3 years, you wil get an offer of a course. This takes about 3 to 4 hours, costs about £90 and is done on Zoom. You don't need to tell your insurer about this (Admiral used to ask but don't any more). If you ignore this, your case will proceed to a Single Justice Procedure and you will be asked to plead guilty or not guilty. If you plead guilty, a magistrate will make a decision on the penalty - which will be 3 points, an SP30 endorsement and an income related fine and costs (expect about £300 at this point).
Rather than ignoring the course offer, you can ask for a court hearing where you would point out that the first NIP was dated more than 14 days after the speeding so is out of time. This should see the case against you dropped. However, if the police produce evidence that an earlier NIP was produced because for some reason they couldn't ascertain the registered keeper details (which as you have the V5C in your name shouldn't happen) you go back to 3 points, an SP30 and a fine. .
douglasb said:
If you complete the form and add a covering letter then, as you have the V5C with your correct details and you have had this since before the alleged speeding, you should get a letter saying "Our mistake. No further action". If that doesn't happen then here is how things will go -
. .
More likely, a letter with an explanation setting out why s. 2 RTOA 1988 applies.. .
NFA is possible, but the system wouldn’t allow a ‘late’ Notice to be generated automatically. This case has been reviewed and an actual person has authorised the ‘late’ notice to be issued. Why?
agtlaw said:
NFA is possible, but the system wouldn’t allow a ‘late’ Notice to be generated automatically. This case has been reviewed and an actual person has authorised the ‘late’ notice to be issued. Why?
Thank you. I believed that this was the case but wasn't certain so didn't post that.
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