Dart Charge PCN - Failed Auto Top-up?

[CacheMonet]

Today I received the first of what I assume will be 2 PCNs for the dart charge having made a round trip southbound and northbound.

I have proof of the vehicle (which has bene in my care for only a month or so) being added to my account which is set to automatically top up directly from my bank on the day of the journey. The account does not have any record of a crossing paid or otherwise for the vehicle (I didn't check on the day as it historically "just works").

Do I have a leg to stand on if I appeal/make a representation? Mainly on the grounds of procedural impropriety for what appears to be a fault with their systems?

Like most people I could very much do without £70 worth of fines.

[kiethton]

CacheMonet said:

Today I received the first of what I assume will be 2 PCNs for the dart charge having made a round trip southbound and northbound.

I have proof of the vehicle (which has bene in my care for only a month or so) being added to my account which is set to automatically top up directly from my bank on the day of the journey. The account does not have any record of a crossing paid or otherwise for the vehicle (I didn't check on the day as it historically "just works").

Do I have a leg to stand on if I appeal/make a representation? Mainly on the grounds of procedural impropriety for what appears to be a fault with their systems?

Like most people I could very much do without £70 worth of fines.

The system (for me anyway) leases £5/£10 in the account as credit which is used as crossings happen, its then topped back up again a few days later.

I would likely be pro-active and call them, have always found them to be very helpful historically

[CacheMonet]

kiethton said:

The system (for me anyway) leases £5/£10 in the account as credit which is used as crossings happen, its then topped back up again a few days later.

I would likely be pro-active and call them, have always found them to be very helpful historically

I have always had a balance of zero, with payments being taken automatically ad-hoc. This however is besides the point as no crossing has been recorded, let alone paid.

[ellroy]

I had this problem, card ran out & I didn’t update- as no one had told me.

I called them up and it was explained you get the first one for free.

Give them a ring. Might not avoid both, but should get one removed.

[Pedro25]

Call them, probably the only PCN producer who actually want to help customers, my daughter got one and a letter stating she owed £70, phoned them and they just stated pay the toll fee within 2 working days and disregard the letter. Genuine mistakes they are at least human.

[OutInTheShed]

CacheMonet said:

I have always had a balance of zero, with payments being taken automatically ad-hoc. This however is besides the point as no crossing has been recorded, let alone paid.

Obviously they've recorded the crossing, and generated a charge.
So, there must be a disconnect between the vehicle and your account.
I guess they must have got the reg right to send you a charge.

So either you've put the reg in wrong on your account or there was a delay in updating your account or .....???

[CacheMonet]

ellroy said:

I had this problem, card ran out & I didn’t update- as no one had told me.

I called them up and it was explained you get the first one for free.

Give them a ring. Might not avoid both, but should get one removed.

I just called them, to paraphrase their response: "You can either pay or make a representation, if you make a representation you should hear back within 30 days" Sounded like the guy was reading a script with a gun to his head, and wasn't interested in hearing about the circumstances whatsoever.

To your point above, this is not quite the same problem. The vehicle was correctly registered to the account, as well as having the correct payment details. For some reason, they never requested payments or even added the crossings to the account.

The journey was a day trip to Dorset, travelling from Essex - so I assume there will be another PCN on the way shortly.

I have gone ahead and made representation on their website, stating that this is an admin or procedural error. Their own T's&C's state:

"If you choose auto pay as you go, we will automatically deduct the charges from your credit or debit card using your card details for each crossing you make using the vehicle you have registered to that card."

Surely this means that the responsibility then rests with them to take the payment providing vehicle and payment are in order - I effectively enter a contract where I have pre authorised them to take the payments?

The real sting was after hitting submit, a big green box appears stating: "To avoid receiving penalty charges in the future, sign up for a pre-pay Account or our Pay as you Go service."

[thecrow]

We had this happen, they claimed the card had expired but there was evidence on their own system that demonstrated that a new card had been added. Got the first one removed but decided life was too short to argue over the second and just paid it. It seems they’re far less understanding or able to apply logic than they used to be unfortunately.

[Paulsd]

We have an account but have forgotten to update it several times when changing cars or plates over the years.

Every time, I’ve gone online to pay the fine after it has come in the post and it has always only ever asked for just the crossing fee (£2.50).

They seem to let you off the first offence. Have you tried to pay it online?

Most recent time for us was in November 22.

Edited by Paulsd on Friday 24th February 23:04

[CacheMonet]

Paulsd said:

We have an account but have forgotten to update it several times when changing cars or plates over the years.

Every time, I’ve gone online to pay the fine after it has come in the post and it has always only ever asked for just the crossing fee (£2.50).

They seem to let you off the first offence. Have you tried to pay it online?

Most recent time for us was in November 22.

Edited by Paulsd on Friday 24th February 23:04

I have since paid it manually for both crossings however this was after receiving the first PCN

Thanks to all these replies I at least have a little bit of hope, as a lot of the scenarios being talked about are very much user error (expired cards, car not updated, etc). I know I should have checked afterwards, but since all was present and correct I had no reason to suspect they wouldn't register the journey and charge me.

Ball is in their court now I suppose. I have paid for the crossing, albeit late, called their customer service line, and made a representation on the first PCN. I guess I will need to go through the same process again this week after another visit from the postman.