Hire car maintenance - who's responsible
Discussion
Basic situation was that my wife had to go on a long journey for business and her employer's policy for distances like this is that they must take a company organised hire car and collect it from the office.
She brought the car home before going on the journey and looking out of the window I could see one of the tyres was low on pressure, so checked it and found it was at 13psi (should have been 35) and then checked the other 3 tyres and all were 10-15psi under-inflated.
I was a bit annoyed with this given the dangers in such severely under-inflated tyres and motorway speeds. She complained to her company's "health and safety" dept (aka cover yer arse dept) and they said it was the employees responsibility to check that the hire car is roadworthy.
I disagree. Given she doesn't have the facilities at work to verify the tyre pressures and a pressure gauge and inflator is a bit of a pain to carry around, I think the company's attitude stinks.
Should it not be the responsibility of the hire company to ensure their vehicles are safe before hiring them?
She brought the car home before going on the journey and looking out of the window I could see one of the tyres was low on pressure, so checked it and found it was at 13psi (should have been 35) and then checked the other 3 tyres and all were 10-15psi under-inflated.
I was a bit annoyed with this given the dangers in such severely under-inflated tyres and motorway speeds. She complained to her company's "health and safety" dept (aka cover yer arse dept) and they said it was the employees responsibility to check that the hire car is roadworthy.
I disagree. Given she doesn't have the facilities at work to verify the tyre pressures and a pressure gauge and inflator is a bit of a pain to carry around, I think the company's attitude stinks.
Should it not be the responsibility of the hire company to ensure their vehicles are safe before hiring them?
The hire car company definitely has a primary responsibility to provide a vehicle in a road worthy condition. The driver also has a defined responsibility to ensure that the car is road worthy.
The main problem is the D**KH**D in the Health and Safety Department. As the car was required for work, and it was hired under company policy, then the company is also responsible under the Health and Safety at Work Act (1974) for employee safety. They should have discussed this issue with the Hire Car company. Any problems, they should select another Hire Car Company. However, they should give the company a chance first.
Your misses should not be put in danger (although there is shared responsibility). If the H&S guys at work don't understand this, tell 'em to come on here, and we can explain it to them in words of one syllable. We'll keep it simple, 'cos they are obviously numpties.
They told her that it was all her responsibility, because otherwise they may have to do some work. Lazy B*ST*RDS.
The main problem is the D**KH**D in the Health and Safety Department. As the car was required for work, and it was hired under company policy, then the company is also responsible under the Health and Safety at Work Act (1974) for employee safety. They should have discussed this issue with the Hire Car company. Any problems, they should select another Hire Car Company. However, they should give the company a chance first.
Your misses should not be put in danger (although there is shared responsibility). If the H&S guys at work don't understand this, tell 'em to come on here, and we can explain it to them in words of one syllable. We'll keep it simple, 'cos they are obviously numpties.
They told her that it was all her responsibility, because otherwise they may have to do some work. Lazy B*ST*RDS.
Hire car's are notorious for having under inflated tyres and low fluid levels, as well as spare wheels missing and in my case only last week, I had reason to hire a car for 1 day only and the passenger side door did not open. This despite the fact that I was assured the car had been sufficiently prepped and checked prior to its allocation to me. Sh'yeah right. It was an '05 plate Pug 307. 
I've used this company a few times previously and will continue to use them despite this as normally I have nothing to complain about.
For the record of course it's the drivers responsibility to ensure that tyre pressures are correct (for your own safety), but I for one would be disgusted with the hire company if such a simple thing had been overlooked. Obviously the car hasn't been prepped, just a quick vac and a clean probably.
Simple solution is pump the tyres up, and don't hire from them again. Oh and check the levels.
I've used this company a few times previously and will continue to use them despite this as normally I have nothing to complain about.
For the record of course it's the drivers responsibility to ensure that tyre pressures are correct (for your own safety), but I for one would be disgusted with the hire company if such a simple thing had been overlooked. Obviously the car hasn't been prepped, just a quick vac and a clean probably.
Simple solution is pump the tyres up, and don't hire from them again. Oh and check the levels.
I have the same issue as my company organises hire cars for me on a regular basis. On a defensive driving course a few years back, the instructor asked me what checks I should do on a hire car - I said none as I believed strongly that it was the responsibility of the hire car company to provide a car that was fit for purpose. The instructor told me differently. The company now provides guidance that we should check tyres, lights, oil, blah blah blah before driving the hire car. I don't agree with this at all, but that's how it is.
Julian
Julian
This thread just about sums up what's gone wrong with this country.
Everybody is so used to the govt. wiping their arse for them that nobody wants to take the responsiblity for anything.
Try changing the title the title to:
"Mcdonalds coffee temperature- who's responsible?"
Flame away!
Everybody is so used to the govt. wiping their arse for them that nobody wants to take the responsiblity for anything.
Try changing the title the title to:
"Mcdonalds coffee temperature- who's responsible?"
Flame away!
blueyes said:
This thread just about sums up what's gone wrong with this country.
Everybody is so used to the govt. wiping their arse for them that nobody wants to take the responsiblity for anything.
Try changing the title the title to:
"Mcdonalds coffee temperature- who's responsible?"
I don't think this is a valid comparision. Most people wo buy a coffee expect it to be hot, and therefore wouldn;t blame MacDonalds if it was. However most people would also expect a car to be delivered by a hire company in a roadworthy condition.
Personally I would ask the companies Health and Safety department to supply a tyre pressure guage, and ask them to call the hire company to reinflate the tyres as necessary. Otherwise no one will take any action to ensure this doesn't happen again.
>> Edited by chrisgr31 on Friday 26th August 14:03
julianc said:
The company now provides guidance that we should check tyres, lights, oil, blah blah blah before driving the hire car.
Julian
..and have they trained you how to do it, and checked that you're doing it properly? And provided you with the equipment (regularly calibrated, with records kept, of course) to do it?
Anyone reading this forum will laugh, but we all know someone who doesn’t even know how to open a car bonnet – can people like that be expected to carry out safety critical checks, especially when they might be driving with other employees in the car?
The Duty of Care thing is a nightmare waiting to happen. Many companies have got rid of company cars and rely on paying people business mileage and/or providing hire cars. They think because they don’t own the cars it absolves them of their Duty of Care responsibilities, but it doesn’t. In fact it makes it harder to provide the records that would be required in the event of an accident during work time – especially for employee owned cars. Accidents where a car is being used for business purposes are started to be investigated just like accidents at work now and I understand that the Police and HSE are looking for a high profile case (that means a big accident) where they can go after a company director to prove the Duty of Care point.
At the end of the day, legal responsibility has to be different to making sure you are safe.
While you probably COULD sue for an accident caused by underinflated tyres, you should be countersued for being a billy F*&kwit for not doing a swift visual check of the car. You will be driving it, why not make sure its safe to drive. Fluid levels and spare tyre fitness are, IMHO, slightly different, as it would require a modicum of effort to check these, and if it grinds to a smoking halt on the motorway, then we just ring the company, tell em its buggred, and can we have a new one please
At the end of the day, it was delivered by a human, and they also should have checked it over before delivery...
While you probably COULD sue for an accident caused by underinflated tyres, you should be countersued for being a billy F*&kwit for not doing a swift visual check of the car. You will be driving it, why not make sure its safe to drive. Fluid levels and spare tyre fitness are, IMHO, slightly different, as it would require a modicum of effort to check these, and if it grinds to a smoking halt on the motorway, then we just ring the company, tell em its buggred, and can we have a new one please
At the end of the day, it was delivered by a human, and they also should have checked it over before delivery...
DaGinge said:Fair point, but I'll tell you one thing - next time I hire a car I'll be checking the tyres before driving it anywhere.
I'm surprised by some of the replies and would ask, those who maintain it is the drivers responsibility - did you take a pressure gauge with you and check the tyre pressures when you last hired a car?
DaGinge said:
I'm surprised by some of the replies and would ask, those who maintain it is the drivers responsibility - did you take a pressure gauge with you and check the tyre pressures when you last hired a car?
Have a look here www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg382.pdf
page 14 relates to the condition of the vehicle. Your wife might like to refer her H&S dept to it.
Of course, in practice, the vast majority of employees and employers don't bother with any of this stuff - but it'll bite someone's a**e in the not too distant future.
JonRB said:
I'm surprised by some of the replies and would ask, those who maintain it is the drivers responsibility - did you take a pressure gauge with you and check the tyre pressures when you last hired a car?
Fair point, but I'll tell you one thing - next time I hire a car I'll be checking the tyres before driving it anywhere.
Visual check of tyres
Oil check - not a chance. If it blows up its not my problem...
chrisgr31 said:
This thread just about sums up what's gone wrong with this country.
Everybody is so used to the govt. wiping their arse for them that nobody wants to take the responsiblity for anything.
Try changing the title the title to:
"Mcdonalds coffee temperature- who's responsible?"
I don't think this is a valid comparision. Most people wo buy a coffee expect it to be hot, and therefore wouldn;t blame MacDonalds if it was.
Wrong.
There was a case where a woman sued McD because the coffee she spilt on herself was too hot and it scalded her.
What I was trying to say was, things in this world SHOULD be done properly but most of the time they aren't so- instead of relying on the rules, the compensation culture, and somebody else- why not take charge of your life and check things yourself.
back when I was in the military it was drummed into us every time we took a vehicle out we were to do visual checks on lights/fluids/tyres etc before moving off and to test brakes before leaving the holding area..
If you ever got spotted jumping in and driving off without checking a severe bollocking was comming your way....
I always check hire cars as they are always crap.
If you have a hire car and crash it due to somthing not correctly maintained. you will get fined as the driver and so will the hire company as the owner.
If you ever got spotted jumping in and driving off without checking a severe bollocking was comming your way....
I always check hire cars as they are always crap.
If you have a hire car and crash it due to somthing not correctly maintained. you will get fined as the driver and so will the hire company as the owner.
ol' blueyes is right, take responsibility for your own actions. Thats why the good lady is definitely responsible for checking the tyres.
BUT, I still think the numpties who call themselves H&S in her company ought to get off their fat lazy @rses and do something. The hire company has shared responsibility to do it right. They are supposed to be providing a service. So the H&S could do something, should do something, and if they knew their job, would do something. There's nothing better than taking business elsewhere.
BUT, I still think the numpties who call themselves H&S in her company ought to get off their fat lazy @rses and do something. The hire company has shared responsibility to do it right. They are supposed to be providing a service. So the H&S could do something, should do something, and if they knew their job, would do something. There's nothing better than taking business elsewhere.
blueyes said:
Wrong.
There was a case where a woman sued McD because the coffee she spilt on herself was too hot and it scalded her.
I know about that casw which is why I said "most" people. I still maintain that most people would not sue MacDonalds for selling hot coffee, but would expect a hire car to be supplied in a safe state.
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