Enforcement of closed lanes on smart motorways
Discussion
Do the gantries on smart motorways all have enforcement cameras on then, and are they generally active?
I’ve seen quite a bit of this recently but yesterday was the worst yet. M25 around M3 junction, signs indicate outer two lanes to merge and then eventually are closed. About 90% of drivers comply and are slowed down to 10-15mph in lanes 1 & 2.
The other 10% fly through the closed lane signs, some doing significant speeds (guessing 50mph). Guess what, there’s a car stationary in lane 3 having been involved in a rear end shunt and lost its liquids. Drivers flying up behind it in the closed lane have to take last minute evasive action.
I’d really hope that all those idiots ignoring the lane closures get automatic tickets, but is this the case?
I’ve seen quite a bit of this recently but yesterday was the worst yet. M25 around M3 junction, signs indicate outer two lanes to merge and then eventually are closed. About 90% of drivers comply and are slowed down to 10-15mph in lanes 1 & 2.
The other 10% fly through the closed lane signs, some doing significant speeds (guessing 50mph). Guess what, there’s a car stationary in lane 3 having been involved in a rear end shunt and lost its liquids. Drivers flying up behind it in the closed lane have to take last minute evasive action.
I’d really hope that all those idiots ignoring the lane closures get automatic tickets, but is this the case?
It's what happens when you rely on automated enforcement - ie very few Police officers on the road
Would it make sense if you knew the plates were false or the cars weren't correctly registered to the owner ?
They used to run car checks in Alum Rock - maybe they still do but after an hour or two they'd have to stop as they couldn't process all the dodgy cars / drivers
Would it make sense if you knew the plates were false or the cars weren't correctly registered to the owner ?
They used to run car checks in Alum Rock - maybe they still do but after an hour or two they'd have to stop as they couldn't process all the dodgy cars / drivers
E-bmw said:
Typically every third (ish) one has them.
Nowhere near that. As a regular speeder, I'd guess more like about 1 in 20. There's only a couple either direction near the M3 junction on M25 anyway. The fact that the action by these drivers was "last minute", plus the fact they were driving at 50mph (around the "dumb dumb" speed) also suggests they haven't a fecking clue and probably hadn't even noticed the signs. Stupidity rather than malevolence. There's loads of visibility and time to react around there. So a decent chance they've been caught in that sense.
Somewhatfoolish said:
E-bmw said:
Typically every third (ish) one has them.
Nowhere near that. As a regular speeder, I'd guess more like about 1 in 20. There's only a couple either direction near the M3 junction on M25 anyway. The fact that the action by these drivers was "last minute", plus the fact they were driving at 50mph (around the "dumb dumb" speed) also suggests they haven't a fecking clue and probably hadn't even noticed the signs. Stupidity rather than malevolence. There's loads of visibility and time to react around there. So a decent chance they've been caught in that sense.
Somewhatfoolish said:
The fact that the action by these drivers was "last minute", plus the fact they were driving at 50mph (around the "dumb dumb" speed) also suggests they haven't a fecking clue and probably hadn't even noticed the signs. Stupidity rather than malevolence. There's loads of visibility and time to react around there. So a decent chance they've been caught in that sense.
It was the outer 2 lanes (of 4) that were closed so these people were the usual denizens of those lanes and had just chosen to wilfully ignore the signs.It’s a fact that the lanes showing the merge arrow flow far better than the “mergee” lanes so the optimum strategy is to stay in those lanes until the merge in point, when the signs change to closed. Because the merge point is signed not coned these people just see the road opening up ahead of them and wilfully decide to ignore the sign and continue. They reduce their speed by a token amount down in “consideration”.
The problem came when they were streaming down in lane 3 then coming across the stranded vehicle.
I totally do not subscribe to the notion they didn’t see the signs, this was deliberate. Also there’s no way that number of them are cloned plates. Probably just road warriors who maybe know where the enforcement cameras were and decided that their next meeting was too important. Those photocopiers won’t sell themselves you know.
The reason I asked was I didn’t know but it struck me that without automatic enforcement of all smart motorway signs then given modern attitudes there is always a percentage of people who will decide to ignore them. This was a genuine safety issue and yet some people are stupid enough to decide to roll the dice with other people’s lives. The car was empty but at some point the occupants would have had to have got out and crossed 2 live lanes to get to the side of the road.
Maybe it’s me but I think I see more entitled and downright selfish and dangerous actions on the roads these days.
PhilboSE said:
It was the outer 2 lanes (of 4) that were closed so these people were the usual denizens of those lanes and had just chosen to wilfully ignore the signs.
It’s a fact that the lanes showing the merge arrow flow far better than the “mergee” lanes so the optimum strategy is to stay in those lanes until the merge in point, when the signs change to closed. Because the merge point is signed not coned these people just see the road opening up ahead of them and wilfully decide to ignore the sign and continue. They reduce their speed by a token amount down in “consideration”.
The problem came when they were streaming down in lane 3 then coming across the stranded vehicle.
I totally do not subscribe to the notion they didn’t see the signs, this was deliberate. Also there’s no way that number of them are cloned plates. Probably just road warriors who maybe know where the enforcement cameras were and decided that their next meeting was too important. Those photocopiers won’t sell themselves you know.
The reason I asked was I didn’t know but it struck me that without automatic enforcement of all smart motorway signs then given modern attitudes there is always a percentage of people who will decide to ignore them. This was a genuine safety issue and yet some people are stupid enough to decide to roll the dice with other people’s lives. The car was empty but at some point the occupants would have had to have got out and crossed 2 live lanes to get to the side of the road.
Maybe it’s me but I think I see more entitled and downright selfish and dangerous actions on the roads these days.
Another point of view would be that the idiot who abandoned their car in a live lane is the one who endangered livesIt’s a fact that the lanes showing the merge arrow flow far better than the “mergee” lanes so the optimum strategy is to stay in those lanes until the merge in point, when the signs change to closed. Because the merge point is signed not coned these people just see the road opening up ahead of them and wilfully decide to ignore the sign and continue. They reduce their speed by a token amount down in “consideration”.
The problem came when they were streaming down in lane 3 then coming across the stranded vehicle.
I totally do not subscribe to the notion they didn’t see the signs, this was deliberate. Also there’s no way that number of them are cloned plates. Probably just road warriors who maybe know where the enforcement cameras were and decided that their next meeting was too important. Those photocopiers won’t sell themselves you know.
The reason I asked was I didn’t know but it struck me that without automatic enforcement of all smart motorway signs then given modern attitudes there is always a percentage of people who will decide to ignore them. This was a genuine safety issue and yet some people are stupid enough to decide to roll the dice with other people’s lives. The car was empty but at some point the occupants would have had to have got out and crossed 2 live lanes to get to the side of the road.
Maybe it’s me but I think I see more entitled and downright selfish and dangerous actions on the roads these days.
Having been a car dealer for 30 plus years I've had my share of breakdowns, I've always managed get over to the hard shoulder
The only excuse is if you were in queuing traffic and had a catastrophic failure but I suspect that accounts for less than 0.1% of these situations
Same as the idiots who stop in the middle of a live motorway because they've had a minor accident
I'd give them a 12-month ban at the least
KTMsm said:
Another point of view would be that the idiot who abandoned their car in a live lane is the one who endangered lives
Having been a car dealer for 30 plus years I've had my share of breakdowns, I've always managed get over to the hard shoulder
The only excuse is if you were in queuing traffic and had a catastrophic failure but I suspect that accounts for less than 0.1% of these situations
Same as the idiots who stop in the middle of a live motorway because they've had a minor accident
I'd give them a 12-month ban at the least
So by your own admission you’re a very experienced driver with experience of multiple breakdowns?Having been a car dealer for 30 plus years I've had my share of breakdowns, I've always managed get over to the hard shoulder
The only excuse is if you were in queuing traffic and had a catastrophic failure but I suspect that accounts for less than 0.1% of these situations
Same as the idiots who stop in the middle of a live motorway because they've had a minor accident
I'd give them a 12-month ban at the least
Suppose an inexperienced or less capable driver breaks down on a motorway for the first time, perhaps with a dashboard full of STOP lights - imagine it was your elderly aunt? Still happy to berate and ban them?
KTMsm said:
PhilboSE said:
It was the outer 2 lanes (of 4) that were closed so these people were the usual denizens of those lanes and had just chosen to wilfully ignore the signs.
It’s a fact that the lanes showing the merge arrow flow far better than the “mergee” lanes so the optimum strategy is to stay in those lanes until the merge in point, when the signs change to closed. Because the merge point is signed not coned these people just see the road opening up ahead of them and wilfully decide to ignore the sign and continue. They reduce their speed by a token amount down in “consideration”.
The problem came when they were streaming down in lane 3 then coming across the stranded vehicle.
I totally do not subscribe to the notion they didn’t see the signs, this was deliberate. Also there’s no way that number of them are cloned plates. Probably just road warriors who maybe know where the enforcement cameras were and decided that their next meeting was too important. Those photocopiers won’t sell themselves you know.
The reason I asked was I didn’t know but it struck me that without automatic enforcement of all smart motorway signs then given modern attitudes there is always a percentage of people who will decide to ignore them. This was a genuine safety issue and yet some people are stupid enough to decide to roll the dice with other people’s lives. The car was empty but at some point the occupants would have had to have got out and crossed 2 live lanes to get to the side of the road.
Maybe it’s me but I think I see more entitled and downright selfish and dangerous actions on the roads these days.
Another point of view would be that the idiot who abandoned their car in a live lane is the one who endangered livesIt’s a fact that the lanes showing the merge arrow flow far better than the “mergee” lanes so the optimum strategy is to stay in those lanes until the merge in point, when the signs change to closed. Because the merge point is signed not coned these people just see the road opening up ahead of them and wilfully decide to ignore the sign and continue. They reduce their speed by a token amount down in “consideration”.
The problem came when they were streaming down in lane 3 then coming across the stranded vehicle.
I totally do not subscribe to the notion they didn’t see the signs, this was deliberate. Also there’s no way that number of them are cloned plates. Probably just road warriors who maybe know where the enforcement cameras were and decided that their next meeting was too important. Those photocopiers won’t sell themselves you know.
The reason I asked was I didn’t know but it struck me that without automatic enforcement of all smart motorway signs then given modern attitudes there is always a percentage of people who will decide to ignore them. This was a genuine safety issue and yet some people are stupid enough to decide to roll the dice with other people’s lives. The car was empty but at some point the occupants would have had to have got out and crossed 2 live lanes to get to the side of the road.
Maybe it’s me but I think I see more entitled and downright selfish and dangerous actions on the roads these days.
Having been a car dealer for 30 plus years I've had my share of breakdowns, I've always managed get over to the hard shoulder
The only excuse is if you were in queuing traffic and had a catastrophic failure but I suspect that accounts for less than 0.1% of these situations
Same as the idiots who stop in the middle of a live motorway because they've had a minor accident
I'd give them a 12-month ban at the least
Like I said it was the car behind in a rear end shunt and had dumped its fluids. I don’t know how driveable it was. The other car was off to the side.
Regardless, even if the driver was a chump to abandon a car in lane 3, that doesn’t excuse literally 100s if not 1000s of people being utter idiots.
Regardless, even if the driver was a chump to abandon a car in lane 3, that doesn’t excuse literally 100s if not 1000s of people being utter idiots.
oyster said:
So by your own admission you’re a very experienced driver with experience of multiple breakdowns?
Suppose an inexperienced or less capable driver breaks down on a motorway for the first time, perhaps with a dashboard full of STOP lights - imagine it was your elderly aunt? Still happy to berate and ban them?
Yes - I didn't cause a problem on the first occasion Suppose an inexperienced or less capable driver breaks down on a motorway for the first time, perhaps with a dashboard full of STOP lights - imagine it was your elderly aunt? Still happy to berate and ban them?
Something is either dangerous, or it's not, if you're not capable of dealing with situations which happen on the road then stay off them
I was the one saying that my Granny should give up driving when she became unsafe
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff