None fault accident, listed 'at fault'
Discussion
In May this year my wife was on the receiving end of a vicious unprovoked road rage attack. The long and the short is that her then car was written off. He deliberately stuck her car 3x, before chasing her 'off' at speed. This was as none fault as possibly could be.
The other car was uninsured, we were paid out for our car being a total loss.
Our current insurer is AXA.
We are looking for a new policy (not pleased with the renewal from AXA) and are now coming back with quotes of £1000+. The last insurer we got a quote from stated that the 'accident' my wife was involved with is logged on the insurance database as at fault.
Do we need to protest to AXA? What can we use to argue in our case? (we have a crime reference number) If AXA refuse to play ball can we escalate the matter to the Insurance Ombudsman?
For reference, we were this year paying just over £400, so renewals/ quotes are coming out at circa 150% extra, because of an accident which wasn't her fault whatsoever. Oh, and our NCB was protected, what ever the f
k that means, as it's meant fk all come renewal!
I hate the insurance industry, I REALLY do.
Any thoughts or advice welcome.
The other car was uninsured, we were paid out for our car being a total loss.
Our current insurer is AXA.
We are looking for a new policy (not pleased with the renewal from AXA) and are now coming back with quotes of £1000+. The last insurer we got a quote from stated that the 'accident' my wife was involved with is logged on the insurance database as at fault.
Do we need to protest to AXA? What can we use to argue in our case? (we have a crime reference number) If AXA refuse to play ball can we escalate the matter to the Insurance Ombudsman?
For reference, we were this year paying just over £400, so renewals/ quotes are coming out at circa 150% extra, because of an accident which wasn't her fault whatsoever. Oh, and our NCB was protected, what ever the f
k that means, as it's meant fk all come renewal!I hate the insurance industry, I REALLY do.
Any thoughts or advice welcome.
I have a feeling that due to the other driver being uninsured, insurance class it as fault as there is no other possible "at fault" person as they are untraced.
My car was damaged whilst legally parked (so even more "not at fault")....and I seem to remember this came up at that time as to what constitutes Fault in the eyes of the insurers.
Someone with more knowledge than me will be along in a minute I'm sure to clarify the details !!
Here's an Insurers terminology > https://www.aviva.co.uk/faq/answer/motor/3031/
My car was damaged whilst legally parked (so even more "not at fault")....and I seem to remember this came up at that time as to what constitutes Fault in the eyes of the insurers.
Someone with more knowledge than me will be along in a minute I'm sure to clarify the details !!
Here's an Insurers terminology > https://www.aviva.co.uk/faq/answer/motor/3031/
Edited by Steve Campbell on Wednesday 15th November 16:27
ok, so I was hit from the rear - by a insured but foreign lorry driver - that was down as Fault fo about 2 years until it was all settled with foreign insurance company.
The reason I was told was that if they put it as Non Fault and I have another crash, technically I wouldn't be insured if for whatever reason the Non Fault became a Fault later.
So, to protect me from that eventuality it had to stay as a Fault claim until settled.
You may find it's something similar to that?
My insurance premiums did go up in that period, and when it was rectified I had no claim on the delta costs.
The reason I was told was that if they put it as Non Fault and I have another crash, technically I wouldn't be insured if for whatever reason the Non Fault became a Fault later.
So, to protect me from that eventuality it had to stay as a Fault claim until settled.
You may find it's something similar to that?
My insurance premiums did go up in that period, and when it was rectified I had no claim on the delta costs.
Steve Campbell said:
I have a feeling that due to the other driver being uninsured, insurance class it as fault as there is no other possible "at fault" person as they are untraced.
That's not what I was hoping to hear. That said, there is a crime reference number. The Police are satisfied having seen CCTV and speaking to witnesses that my wife is 100% not at fault for the accident. Plus, the protected NCB is farcical if it doesn't cover none fault/ other party uninsured. Steve Campbell said:
I have a feeling that due to the other driver being uninsured, insurance class it as fault as there is no other possible "at fault" person as they are untraced.
My car was damaged whilst legally parked (so even more "not at fault")....and I seem to remember this came up at that time as to what constitutes Fault in the eyes of the insurers.
Someone with more knowledge than me will be along in a minute I'm sure to clarify the details !!
Yeah, this is my understanding of the situation. 'At fault' just means that your insurance company paid out, not who was to blame. Seems to me it's just a wording issue. My car was damaged whilst legally parked (so even more "not at fault")....and I seem to remember this came up at that time as to what constitutes Fault in the eyes of the insurers.
Someone with more knowledge than me will be along in a minute I'm sure to clarify the details !!
For what it's worth, losing the NCB if not protected might have made it a whole lot worse, unless they have an 'un-insured driver promise' in place.
Edited by MikeM6 on Wednesday 15th November 16:51
I think basically if your insurer is unable recover their costs from a third party it goes down as an at fault claim.
Same as when my car was stolen earlier this year - no negligence on my part but it goes down as an at fault claim as there was nobody to claim the costs back from.
My insurance renewal quote almost doubled (despite also having NCD protection) because having made a claim I'm now viewed as a higher risk which will remain the case for 5 years, regardless of the NCD. After ringing around though I got it down to a 25% increase over the previous year. The car was recovered, written off by the insurance co, and bought back with a Cat N on it which may also have been a factor in the renewal price but it's hard to know!
Same as when my car was stolen earlier this year - no negligence on my part but it goes down as an at fault claim as there was nobody to claim the costs back from.
My insurance renewal quote almost doubled (despite also having NCD protection) because having made a claim I'm now viewed as a higher risk which will remain the case for 5 years, regardless of the NCD. After ringing around though I got it down to a 25% increase over the previous year. The car was recovered, written off by the insurance co, and bought back with a Cat N on it which may also have been a factor in the renewal price but it's hard to know!
Seems we're fked then. All because a doasyoulikey (I know who he is, where he lives, and yes he is one) decided to get off his tits on steroids (Police retrieved cannisters from where he was parked) then crash in to my wifes car and chase her around the village.
Yes, I still hate the insurance industry, utter crooks.
Looks like I need to do some ringing around.
ked then. All because a doasyoulikey (I know who he is, where he lives, and yes he is one) decided to get off his tits on steroids (Police retrieved cannisters from where he was parked) then crash in to my wifes car and chase her around the village.Yes, I still hate the insurance industry, utter crooks.
Looks like I need to do some ringing around.
Fermit said:
Seems we're fked then. All because a doasyoulikey (I know who he is, where he lives, and yes he is one) decided to get off his tits on steroids (Police retrieved cannisters from where he was parked) then crash in to my wifes car and chase her around the village.
Yes, I still hate the insurance industry, utter crooks.
Looks like I need to do some ringing around.
Yes defo ring around - the ways are strange. I was insured by LV via a broker, but the broker's hiked up renewal premium wasn't with LV - I then ended up insured by LV again by going to them direct! ked then. All because a doasyoulikey (I know who he is, where he lives, and yes he is one) decided to get off his tits on steroids (Police retrieved cannisters from where he was parked) then crash in to my wifes car and chase her around the village.Yes, I still hate the insurance industry, utter crooks.
Looks like I need to do some ringing around.
kerplunk said:
I think basically if your insurer is unable recover their costs from a third party it goes down as an at fault claim.
Correct.Fault = insurers paid out and couldn't recover their entire outlay.
Non fault = insurers didn't pay out or recovered 100% of what they did pay out.
If you run someone over whilst driving on the pavement, and for whatever reason they decide not to claim for their injuries, that's a non fault claim.
Just noted, AXA have an 'uninsured driver promise'
What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
Fermit said:
Just noted, AXA have an 'uninsured driver promise'
What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
That just means your NCD is retained, not that the incident isn't taken into account when calculating the premium the NCD is applied to. Yes, sneaky, but standard. "You still have your NCD, but your base premium has doubled".What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
Sometimes insurance companies can be desperately slow at sorting these things out. Possibly a deliberate delaying ploy for reasons known only to them, possibly just incompetence.
My daughter's little Peugeot was written off when an old boy in a Renault hit it and four other parked cars some eleven months ago. Pretty much as clear cut as your issue.
She's still trying to recover her excess and have the claim logged as being not at fault.
My daughter's little Peugeot was written off when an old boy in a Renault hit it and four other parked cars some eleven months ago. Pretty much as clear cut as your issue.
She's still trying to recover her excess and have the claim logged as being not at fault.
otolith said:
Fermit said:
Just noted, AXA have an 'uninsured driver promise'
What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
That just means your NCD is retained, not that the incident isn't taken into account when calculating the premium the NCD is applied to. Yes, sneaky, but standard. "You still have your NCD, but your base premium has doubled".What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
Fermit said:
Just noted, AXA have an 'uninsured driver promise'
What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
Did you get back your excess & keep your NCD?What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
Mandat said:
Fermit said:
Just noted, AXA have an 'uninsured driver promise'
What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
Did you get back your excess & keep your NCD?What is the uninsured driver promise? We know that accidents happen and that sometimes they are unavoidable. With AXA comprehensive car insurance, you’ll get back your no claims discount and excess if an uninsured driver damages your car as long as you aren’t at fault. Just provide us with the details of your claim and we’ll do the rest. What happens if an uninsured driver hits me? If an uninsured driver hits you, and the accident wasn’t your fault, we’ve got you covered. You’ll need to provide us with the make, model and registration number of the car driven by the uninsured driver. Once you have these details, just get in contact with our claims team, who’ll help you through the process of your claim.
We provided them with the above in bold. Accordingly we need to fight this, IMO
Fermit said:
And this is why I and many others around think the insurance industry is crooked. It's an opinion, for many reasons of experience, that I have held for more than 20 years.
How much has this crooked industry charged you, over those 20 years. I'm 61, and for the last 20 years, in reality, I've paid the square root of bugger all in premiums. Ridiculously cheap, for year after year. Even with the recent hikes, it's been a big percentage increase on a stupidly low premium, so it's still cheap. Most people I know think the same. I often wonder what I've / we've done to be exempt from being ripped off by these crooks.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
How much has this crooked industry charged you, over those 20 years. I'm 61, and for the last 20 years, in reality, I've paid the square root of bugger all in premiums. Ridiculously cheap, for year after year. Even with the recent hikes, it's been a big percentage increase on a stupidly low premium, so it's still cheap.
Most people I know think the same. I often wonder what I've / we've done to be exempt from being ripped off by these crooks.
How much have you claimed though? I’m the same age as you and I estimate that in today’s values, 45 years of my premiums for motorcycles/cars/houses/life etc. will have amounted to well over £40K in that time. Most people I know think the same. I often wonder what I've / we've done to be exempt from being ripped off by these crooks.
Own claims? One - about 30 years ago, Car (Ford Granada) stolen and then recovered the next day with some minor cosmetic work needed.
Current annual premiums (House+Car+Bicycles) over £1000.
Unless I’m some sort of exception it still seems that insurers should be doing fairly well….
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