Backdating a rent increase
Discussion
Quick question - I've never ever rented so excuse me if my terminology is incorrect.
Number 1 daughter lives in a rented flat in London, she's been there for at least 6 years and was living there with her partner.
The existing rental contract expired Sept 2024 but was not renewed by the agency.
Partner left just before Xmas as they broke up, they were both named on the original rental contract.
She continued to live there and paid the rent herself.
Ex contacted the agency to tell them he'd moved out and as a result the agency forced her to go through re-referencing.
They have now sent her a new contract with an expected increase, however, the increase has been backdated to the end of the last contract and they are now wanting the excess for several months paying too.
Can this be legal, to me as a layman it seems bizarre??
Think she's going to need a solicitor here, any thoughts?
Number 1 daughter lives in a rented flat in London, she's been there for at least 6 years and was living there with her partner.
The existing rental contract expired Sept 2024 but was not renewed by the agency.
Partner left just before Xmas as they broke up, they were both named on the original rental contract.
She continued to live there and paid the rent herself.
Ex contacted the agency to tell them he'd moved out and as a result the agency forced her to go through re-referencing.
They have now sent her a new contract with an expected increase, however, the increase has been backdated to the end of the last contract and they are now wanting the excess for several months paying too.
Can this be legal, to me as a layman it seems bizarre??
Think she's going to need a solicitor here, any thoughts?
Rushjob said:
Quick question - I've never ever rented so excuse me if my terminology is incorrect.
Number 1 daughter lives in a rented flat in London, she's been there for at least 6 years and was living there with her partner.
The existing rental contract expired Sept 2024 but was not renewed by the agency.
Partner left just before Xmas as they broke up, they were both named on the original rental contract.
She continued to live there and paid the rent herself.
Ex contacted the agency to tell them he'd moved out and as a result the agency forced her to go through re-referencing.
They have now sent her a new contract with an expected increase, however, the increase has been backdated to the end of the last contract and they are now wanting the excess for several months paying too.
Can this be legal, to me as a layman it seems bizarre??
Think she's going to need a solicitor here, any thoughts?
How much is the increase per month?Number 1 daughter lives in a rented flat in London, she's been there for at least 6 years and was living there with her partner.
The existing rental contract expired Sept 2024 but was not renewed by the agency.
Partner left just before Xmas as they broke up, they were both named on the original rental contract.
She continued to live there and paid the rent herself.
Ex contacted the agency to tell them he'd moved out and as a result the agency forced her to go through re-referencing.
They have now sent her a new contract with an expected increase, however, the increase has been backdated to the end of the last contract and they are now wanting the excess for several months paying too.
Can this be legal, to me as a layman it seems bizarre??
Think she's going to need a solicitor here, any thoughts?
You say she owes the backdate of 6-7 months, and if it's an increase of £100 a month, you are looking at £600-700 to pay. Which would probably be less than the amount you will have to pay a solicitor to argue it out for you.
It would seem better to just pay it?
(Assuming the increase isn't £500 a month or something?)
The rental contract should have a clause that sets out how rent increases will be communicated and any one I've ever seen would require a minimum of 30 days notice.
However, some contracts may build in specific terms that at renewal there will be an increase so she may need liable as technically she's underpaid. These terms would probably need to be obvious though and not buried on page 97.
I think that a landlord can only backdate an increase by four weeks so if they've failed to take the increase for months I think the landlord/agent are onto plums. Plus her contract expired in September so they'll struggle to enforce anything.
What does her previous contract say? Has she had her deposit returned?
However, some contracts may build in specific terms that at renewal there will be an increase so she may need liable as technically she's underpaid. These terms would probably need to be obvious though and not buried on page 97.
I think that a landlord can only backdate an increase by four weeks so if they've failed to take the increase for months I think the landlord/agent are onto plums. Plus her contract expired in September so they'll struggle to enforce anything.
What does her previous contract say? Has she had her deposit returned?
Edited by skyebear on Thursday 10th April 13:05
Edited by skyebear on Thursday 10th April 13:10
Mont Blanc said:
How much is the increase per month?
You say she owes the backdate of 6-7 months, and if it's an increase of £100 a month, you are looking at £600-700 to pay. Which would probably be less than the amount you will have to pay a solicitor to argue it out for you.
It would seem better to just pay it?
(Assuming the increase isn't £500 a month or something?)
On the converse if it’s £700 then it’s free to tell them to forget it and then they can weigh up whether to bother with it, since they are the ones trying to backdate an increase. Which is taking the piss tbh. You say she owes the backdate of 6-7 months, and if it's an increase of £100 a month, you are looking at £600-700 to pay. Which would probably be less than the amount you will have to pay a solicitor to argue it out for you.
It would seem better to just pay it?
(Assuming the increase isn't £500 a month or something?)
InitialDave said:
I'd tell them it's tough s
t, they should've sorted it out in September.
Smells to me like a disorganised agent didn't keep on top of things and is now trying to avoid the landlord being upset with them by clawing the money back.
If one of the tenants moved out and didn't tell them until now, how do you expect them to know? It's pretty common for tenancies to move to a rolling contract when they "end".t, they should've sorted it out in September.Smells to me like a disorganised agent didn't keep on top of things and is now trying to avoid the landlord being upset with them by clawing the money back.
I'm not convinced they are allowed to backdate - but I suppose their argument would be that she / her partner breached the tenancy by not telling them at the time that he'd moved out - and if they had, the rent would have increased then anyway so she still would have paid it.
davek_964 said:
If one of the tenants moved out and didn't tell them until now, how do you expect them to know? It's pretty common for tenancies to move to a rolling contract when they "end".
I'm not convinced they are allowed to backdate - but I suppose their argument would be that she / her partner breached the tenancy by not telling them at the time that he'd moved out - and if they had, the rent would have increased then anyway so she still would have paid it.
Two separate things, though.I'm not convinced they are allowed to backdate - but I suppose their argument would be that she / her partner breached the tenancy by not telling them at the time that he'd moved out - and if they had, the rent would have increased then anyway so she still would have paid it.
Tenancy ended in September, so it moved to rolling monthly.
The partner now telling them he's moved out triggered what is effectively a reapplication of her as a lone tenant from now, and so the rent increase.
Basically being forced to wake up and look at things due to the partner leaving has caused the agent to go "oops, forgot to issue the new terms last year"
Tell her not to sign anything until she has spoken to CAB or Shelter.
Don't bother with a solicitor, they cost £300 ph
Whether they can backdate the increase depends entirely upon the wording in the original tenancy, I can't see that from here so it needs to be read carefully.
In september 2024 your daughter entered a periodic tenancy, only she or a judge can end that tenancy
Don't bother with a solicitor, they cost £300 ph
Whether they can backdate the increase depends entirely upon the wording in the original tenancy, I can't see that from here so it needs to be read carefully.
In september 2024 your daughter entered a periodic tenancy, only she or a judge can end that tenancy
Sir Bagalot said:
In september 2024 your daughter entered a periodic tenancy, only she or a judge can end that tenancy
Pretty sure you've said that before, and it's so misleading.The landlord is entirely in their rights to ask a tenant to leave with appropriate notice. The fact that a tenant can refuse to leave and end up in court doesn't mean they have some magical right to stay there.
When her existing term ended, she will have moved to a rolling contract on original terms.
Her new agreement should commence from when they re-referenced her for the solo occupancy. Any new rent as part of that agreement would be from the new commencement date.
They are trying it on by backdating - what's the alternative? Your daughter doesn't sign the new agreement, continues to occupy based on the old tenancy and they have to request a rent increase via normal notice period (min 2 months) with opportunity to appeal. Alternatively, they serve her notice (S.21?) with 2 months notice, but your daughter could just ignore and they would have to apply to the courts to take over the tenancy.
I don't often recommend Facebook for anything, but well worth joining a Group called "Renting - Advice for Landlords and Tenants in England". It's non-discussion and run by actual experts, just post the issue and one of their professionals will respond with what to do.
Her new agreement should commence from when they re-referenced her for the solo occupancy. Any new rent as part of that agreement would be from the new commencement date.
They are trying it on by backdating - what's the alternative? Your daughter doesn't sign the new agreement, continues to occupy based on the old tenancy and they have to request a rent increase via normal notice period (min 2 months) with opportunity to appeal. Alternatively, they serve her notice (S.21?) with 2 months notice, but your daughter could just ignore and they would have to apply to the courts to take over the tenancy.
I don't often recommend Facebook for anything, but well worth joining a Group called "Renting - Advice for Landlords and Tenants in England". It's non-discussion and run by actual experts, just post the issue and one of their professionals will respond with what to do.
davek_964 said:
Pretty sure you've said that before, and it's so misleading.
The landlord is entirely in their rights to ask a tenant to leave with appropriate notice. The fact that a tenant can refuse to leave and end up in court doesn't mean they have some magical right to stay there.
But this is the truth - and the reason this phrase gets referenced as it's your legal right when you rent. You can serve notice, send letters, etc. But only a judge (or the tenant) can remove the right to occupy. In fact, if you phone your local council for assistance in such matters, their advice will be not to leave the property until the courts force you to - or they will provide you will no assistance or housing as they will have considered you to have made yourself homeless. The landlord is entirely in their rights to ask a tenant to leave with appropriate notice. The fact that a tenant can refuse to leave and end up in court doesn't mean they have some magical right to stay there.
guitarcarfanatic said:
davek_964 said:
Pretty sure you've said that before, and it's so misleading.
The landlord is entirely in their rights to ask a tenant to leave with appropriate notice. The fact that a tenant can refuse to leave and end up in court doesn't mean they have some magical right to stay there.
But this is the truth - and the reason this phrase gets referenced as it's your legal right when you rent. You can serve notice, send letters, etc. But only a judge (or the tenant) can remove the right to occupy. In fact, if you phone your local council for assistance in such matters, their advice will be not to leave the property until the courts force you to - or they will provide you will no assistance or housing as they will have considered you to have made yourself homeless. The landlord is entirely in their rights to ask a tenant to leave with appropriate notice. The fact that a tenant can refuse to leave and end up in court doesn't mean they have some magical right to stay there.
The fact that the landlord can't drag them out by their hair doesn't make it a "legal right" - it makes them a pain in the arse tenant.
The departing tenant would be required to serve to the landlord/agent one month notice, the same bringing the joint tenancy agreement to an end. The landlord/agent could then either seek new tenant/s, or issue a new tenancy agreement to the remaining tenant, the same both back dated and could involve an increase in rent. Better the rental property one knows, together with inconvenience and costs with removal, one's best advice to the OP's daughter, is accept the new tenancy agreement, the increase in rent and move on with her life.
Wings said:
The departing tenant would be required to serve to the landlord/agent one month notice, the same bringing the joint tenancy agreement to an end. The landlord/agent could then either seek new tenant/s, or issue a new tenancy agreement to the remaining tenant, the same both back dated and could involve an increase in rent. Better the rental property one knows, together with inconvenience and costs with removal, one's best advice to the OP's daughter, is accept the new tenancy agreement, the increase in rent and move on with her life.
I agree the OP's daughter should accept the new tenancy agreement with the increase, just not the backdating thereof.The letting agent should have started the ball rolling on the increase to coincide with the contract ending in September. It seems they did not, and were only triggered to do so when the notification of the change of tenants landed in front of them.
They have what seems to be a good sitting tenant. Leaving aside that what they're playing at is definitely not how you conduct yourself, taking the rent increase as being from now and keeping said tenant is probably the best option all round.
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