Campervan insurance invalidated - parked away from home
Discussion
A friend is staying at a relative's address for two weeks. They drove their campervan because they were intending to make a trip from said address for a few days during this trip.
After a week of parking at that address (without using the van) their campervan was stolen (in broad daylight.. London...)
Since reporting the theft their insurer asked their broker if they had been notified of the change of storage location. They had not notified them. The question feels like the opener to use this clause to refuse payout from the second to last bullet in the obligations section.
"You must tell us of the change of storage location if your vehicle is left for more than 48 hours at a different location"
Does anyone have experience on this situation? This would be a fairly disastrous result if they refuse to payout and are left completely out of pocket.
Suffice to say they hadn't read/ recalled that clause and so hadn't notified their insurer or broker.
After a week of parking at that address (without using the van) their campervan was stolen (in broad daylight.. London...)
Since reporting the theft their insurer asked their broker if they had been notified of the change of storage location. They had not notified them. The question feels like the opener to use this clause to refuse payout from the second to last bullet in the obligations section.
"You must tell us of the change of storage location if your vehicle is left for more than 48 hours at a different location"
Does anyone have experience on this situation? This would be a fairly disastrous result if they refuse to payout and are left completely out of pocket.
Suffice to say they hadn't read/ recalled that clause and so hadn't notified their insurer or broker.
Clearly the Insurer is focusing on the storage condition.
If the van is normally kept at their address and then they travel it would be insured at all subsequent addresses or locations unless there is a specific clause within the t and c that limits each stay by days ( unlikely ).
Whilst it might be considered slightly grey if they were staying elsewhere for a couple of weeks with the van not moving I doubt that in itself would be sufficient grounds to deny any claim.
If that were the case then before complaints dept are involved ( you cannot go to the Ombudsman until a ruling from the Insurers complaints dept has been received ) your friends should simply suggest back politely that they were already travelling with the van, it was not being stored at the other location for any length of time as was part of their holiday travel etc.
If the van is normally kept at their address and then they travel it would be insured at all subsequent addresses or locations unless there is a specific clause within the t and c that limits each stay by days ( unlikely ).
Whilst it might be considered slightly grey if they were staying elsewhere for a couple of weeks with the van not moving I doubt that in itself would be sufficient grounds to deny any claim.
If that were the case then before complaints dept are involved ( you cannot go to the Ombudsman until a ruling from the Insurers complaints dept has been received ) your friends should simply suggest back politely that they were already travelling with the van, it was not being stored at the other location for any length of time as was part of their holiday travel etc.
I remember this clause being a thing when we were insuring our campervan (from reading around the camper forum) and I specifically asked our insurer if it applied to our policy, which they said it did not. I think it's quite common with this type of vehicle.
As above whether that stands up on appeal I don't know.
ETA: Most of the chat was around parking it e.g. at an airport car park while away, which definitely would be unattended, but it's hard to see how being parked at a friends house while you are there would count as 'storage', otherwise that would presumably also include parking it at a campsite for a week or more.
As above whether that stands up on appeal I don't know.
ETA: Most of the chat was around parking it e.g. at an airport car park while away, which definitely would be unattended, but it's hard to see how being parked at a friends house while you are there would count as 'storage', otherwise that would presumably also include parking it at a campsite for a week or more.
Edited by JagYouAre on Thursday 2nd April 10:07
JagYouAre said:
I remember this clause being a thing when we were insuring our campervan (from reading around the camper forum) and I specifically asked our insurer if it applied to our policy, which they said it did not. I think it's quite common with this type of vehicle.
As above whether that stands up on appeal I don't know.
ETA: Most of the chat was around parking it e.g. at an airport car park while away, which definitely would be unattended, but it's hard to see how being parked at a friends house while you are there would count as 'storage', otherwise that would presumably also include parking it at a campsite for a week or more.
The storage question is part of normal underwriting considerations especially if normally kept away from your address at someone's yard say.As above whether that stands up on appeal I don't know.
ETA: Most of the chat was around parking it e.g. at an airport car park while away, which definitely would be unattended, but it's hard to see how being parked at a friends house while you are there would count as 'storage', otherwise that would presumably also include parking it at a campsite for a week or more.
Edited by JagYouAre on Thursday 2nd April 10:07
Its not about being unattended per se which is something else specifically.
Presumably it was the only vehicle they had available to use while staying with their friends? If so I would definitely argue that it was in use as a vehicle, not in storage. Even if it wasn't I'd still argue it wasn't in storage, but being their sole transport makes an easier to comprehend argument.
Disco You said:
A friend is staying at a relative's address for two weeks.
Since reporting the theft their insurer asked their broker if they had been notified of the change of storage location..
I am making the obvious assumption here.Since reporting the theft their insurer asked their broker if they had been notified of the change of storage location..
I see your friends schoolboy error & am not sure how they will get out of it.
He should have worded it that they were staying in it and it was stolen while they were out for the day.
Aside of that whether the clause would "stand up in court" figuratively speaking I don't know.
If they have legal cover it may be a question for them.
It's not a "storage location" is it though, it's a friend's driveway.
If the insurer were to go literal on this it would mean that everyone using their camper/motorhome away from home for more than 48hrs would need to notify their insurers of where they were "storing" it.
Let's hope they apply the "man on the Clapham omnibus" approach to common sense application of the rules here.
If the insurer were to go literal on this it would mean that everyone using their camper/motorhome away from home for more than 48hrs would need to notify their insurers of where they were "storing" it.
Let's hope they apply the "man on the Clapham omnibus" approach to common sense application of the rules here.
how is visiting somebody for 2 weeks a change of storage location? to my uneducated mind that seems completely ridiculous. They started a trip from home, their first stop was visiting friends in London and then they were going to continue their trip (or go home again, same thing to my mind).
Edit: I don't notify my insurer whenever I go on an extended holiday trip. mmmhh
Edit: I don't notify my insurer whenever I go on an extended holiday trip. mmmhh
Disco You said:
A friend is staying at a relative's address for two weeks.
Maybe the relative's address could be deemed to be a temporary 'storage location' if you friend left his van there while he returned to his own home address. Otherwise, by the insurance company's logic, your friend would've had to inform them if he stayed on a campsite for two weeks.Does his insurance policy document define the term 'storage location'?
Shooter McGavin said:
If the insurer were to go literal on this it would mean that everyone using their camper/motorhome away from home for more than 48hrs would need to notify their insurers of where they were "storing" it.
C69 said:
Otherwise, by the insurance company's logic, your friend would've had to inform them if he stayed on a campsite for two weeks.
I don't think that would be the case. If someone is using their campervan then they aren't storing it.The exclusion in the policy is to prevent someone from storing their campervan somewhere that could be materially more risky than the location they have declared.
I agree with the general consensus here, it's not clear what your friend declared but it sounds like they told the insurers "the van was parked at a friends house", rather than "they were visiting their friend" when the theft happened.
I'm sure I have the same clause in my camper policy, and similar on the bike policies where it is stated where the bike is kept overnight, but this doesn't mean it can't be somewhere else overnight if I'm on a trip with it.
I'm sure I have the same clause in my camper policy, and similar on the bike policies where it is stated where the bike is kept overnight, but this doesn't mean it can't be somewhere else overnight if I'm on a trip with it.
My MH is covered for up to 21 days away from the storage location listed in the schedule. It can only be outside my home address for up to 48 hrs at at time to load and unload etc.
He hasn't changed the storage location it's just been taken whilst in use surely? I often park mine outside my sons house in South London. I'd expect it to be covered if it was taken.
He hasn't changed the storage location it's just been taken whilst in use surely? I often park mine outside my sons house in South London. I'd expect it to be covered if it was taken.
E-bmw said:
Disco You said:
A friend is staying at a relative's address for two weeks.
Since reporting the theft their insurer asked their broker if they had been notified of the change of storage location..
I am making the obvious assumption here.Since reporting the theft their insurer asked their broker if they had been notified of the change of storage location..
I see your friends schoolboy error & am not sure how they will get out of it.
He should have worded it that they were staying in it and it was stolen while they were out for the day.
Aside of that whether the clause would "stand up in court" figuratively speaking I don't know.
If they have legal cover it may be a question for them.
The victim wasn’t aware of the clause or she could have painted it in a light less likely to be seen as “stored”, but she simply gave an account of her situation before learning of the clause.
I believe they regard storing it as parking it for more than 48 hours without sleeping in it. Which they weren’t - as comfortable as it is, it was parked outside a perfectly good house.
This is the point also where I complain that the police “case” was closed immediately, despite the journey having started within 100 metres of an ANPR camera, and within one of the most heavily surveilled cities on the planet.
I think the problem you'll face is that there are certain characteristics which might define/refine what "storage" is, as distinct from "parking" or "using but not driving" (which might include periods when its left unattended, for example using it on a campsite but going to the local woods or beach).
Those elements aren't necessarily defined by time alone. I think whether its on-road or off-road; whether left unattended; whether in a recognised parking space; whether at a recognised "storage" location etc all play into it. If it were left unattended at a friend's house and everyone had gone away for a week, for example, there's definitely elements of "storage" there. Of course, I am assuming it was unattended, what with it being stolen.
Having said all that, I think the insurers are taking the ***** and looking for a get-out here - definitely worth a strong complaint and retribution.
Those elements aren't necessarily defined by time alone. I think whether its on-road or off-road; whether left unattended; whether in a recognised parking space; whether at a recognised "storage" location etc all play into it. If it were left unattended at a friend's house and everyone had gone away for a week, for example, there's definitely elements of "storage" there. Of course, I am assuming it was unattended, what with it being stolen.
Having said all that, I think the insurers are taking the ***** and looking for a get-out here - definitely worth a strong complaint and retribution.
SydneyBridge said:
Was the friend sleeping in the campervan or friends house?
Doesn't matter. Camper van owners often spend nights in hotels or friends' houses as well as in their van. As others have said, the van wasn't being stored, it was being used, as a camper van, to travel around visiting places or people. Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff