Card chargeback - don't give up
Discussion
Bought a pair of not inexpensive Raybans from a company called Blickers online.
They very quickly developed a fault where one lens would pop out of its frame when worn. Blickers, over 8 weeks of very slow to repond emails, point bank refused to exchange or refund, saying it was "normal". I sent photos, and even a video. They would not budge an inch.
Looked at small claims but they closed their UK Limited co this year so now are wholely spanish, so impractical to pursue.
I used a debit card and started a chargeback. Their bank rejected it a few weeks ago, and I got the option of deciding to pursue further, which I selected. I won (was told Monday was the deadline for them to object again and that has passed).
Moral of the story, try, even on a debit card.
They very quickly developed a fault where one lens would pop out of its frame when worn. Blickers, over 8 weeks of very slow to repond emails, point bank refused to exchange or refund, saying it was "normal". I sent photos, and even a video. They would not budge an inch.
Looked at small claims but they closed their UK Limited co this year so now are wholely spanish, so impractical to pursue.
I used a debit card and started a chargeback. Their bank rejected it a few weeks ago, and I got the option of deciding to pursue further, which I selected. I won (was told Monday was the deadline for them to object again and that has passed).
Moral of the story, try, even on a debit card.
The Gauge said:
Good result.
What's the procedure for starting a charge back? I've never done it.
Just call your bank - that's it - say you want to dispute a transaction. They'll credit it back, then fight yoru corner. What's the procedure for starting a charge back? I've never done it.
I emailed them the email convo I'd had with the vendor.
The vendor used teh exact same chat history as their "evidence" - thing is, that was evidence of my buying and receiving. Didn't undo the fact they goods were faulty and they would not consider an exchange or refund.
Griffith4ever said:
Rafka said:
Very well done op, easier if you d used a credit card though.
Why so? I know debit cards have a lower threshold, £100, but any other reason? Debit card providers are not legally obliged to help in this way. But they are in competition with the credit card providers. They voluntarily offer the same protection as credit card companies even though they don't have to. If they didn't do this, everyone would use credit cards instead of debit cards.
In practise, if you contact a credit card provider and ask for a chargeback, they are usually very obliging. If you do the same with a debit card provider you will get the same result, but you may need to be insistent in order to do so.
BrokenSkunk said:
Griffith4ever said:
Rafka said:
Very well done op, easier if you d used a credit card though.
Why so? I know debit cards have a lower threshold, £100, but any other reason? Debit card providers are not legally obliged to help in this way. But they are in competition with the credit card providers. They voluntarily offer the same protection as credit card companies even though they don't have to. If they didn't do this, everyone would use credit cards instead of debit cards.
In practise, if you contact a credit card provider and ask for a chargeback, they are usually very obliging. If you do the same with a debit card provider you will get the same result, but you may need to be insistent in order to do so.
Similar thing for me recently, Hotel booking via booking.com, paid £148 per night for 2 nights. Landlady was an absolute weirdo, and caused a massive argument and threatened to get someone to throw us out, but we stayed the first night as it was too late that evening. Left at 8am next morning without breakfast or any further argument, cancelled via booking.com, lodged a complaint with them and asked for one night refund £148 due to behaviour of landlady, (who they'd already had complaints about.)
They then messed about for two weeks supposedly contacting landlady who refused a refund, then said they were not liable and they couldn't make her refund us either.
Credit card company then contacted for chargeback and seemingly tried to slow time and put many obstacles in my way ( had to upload copies of credit card statement showing booking plus reference at least twice online), there was no way to ring them to explain in full what occurred being threatened by landlady etc, eventually they just gave in a refunded in full after a month, with no explanation as to why it took so long.
Was tempted to leave it but it's first time I've ever used facility with credit card company and we'd lost £148 plus paid another £160 out elsewhere for 2nd night.
They then messed about for two weeks supposedly contacting landlady who refused a refund, then said they were not liable and they couldn't make her refund us either.
Credit card company then contacted for chargeback and seemingly tried to slow time and put many obstacles in my way ( had to upload copies of credit card statement showing booking plus reference at least twice online), there was no way to ring them to explain in full what occurred being threatened by landlady etc, eventually they just gave in a refunded in full after a month, with no explanation as to why it took so long.
Was tempted to leave it but it's first time I've ever used facility with credit card company and we'd lost £148 plus paid another £160 out elsewhere for 2nd night.
Debit card chargeback is not based in legislation but is a marketing tool and is, as the name suggests, charged back to the retailer with the bank acting as arbitrator in the dispute and if the retailer objects then the bank may take your side or may not - when the bank agrees to the chargeback and it is credited to your account they specifically tell you that the chargeback might be reversed if the retailer objects.
Whereas a credit card s75 claim is consumer law, with it applying just between you and the bank and the retailer effectively has no say in it, and once the money is paid back to you that's it.
The s75 legislation has its roots back to the 1970s before most people even had credit cards and it was really intended to cover people taking out a specific loan to buy a fridge, cooker, sofa, etc. in shops, and it is just the luck of history that it applies to credit cards (and if the banks had their way the law would be repealed tomorrow).
Whereas a credit card s75 claim is consumer law, with it applying just between you and the bank and the retailer effectively has no say in it, and once the money is paid back to you that's it.
The s75 legislation has its roots back to the 1970s before most people even had credit cards and it was really intended to cover people taking out a specific loan to buy a fridge, cooker, sofa, etc. in shops, and it is just the luck of history that it applies to credit cards (and if the banks had their way the law would be repealed tomorrow).
Nope - wearing them now in Montenegro.
I've read up and I'll heat them in water and try and straighten the frames, at some stage - apparently that's why one lense pops itself out over time.
Going to speak to my bank when I return, to be 1000% sure its all done, then send an email , wearing them , with a finger, to the most obstructive "support" lady in spain I've ever dealt with.
I've read up and I'll heat them in water and try and straighten the frames, at some stage - apparently that's why one lense pops itself out over time.
Going to speak to my bank when I return, to be 1000% sure its all done, then send an email , wearing them , with a finger, to the most obstructive "support" lady in spain I've ever dealt with.
Always satisfying when you get a good outcome.
A few years ago we bought one of the big Berghaus tents from Go outdoors. On first use the stitching came away from one of the airbeam feet.
Contacted them and their solution was to take it to one of their service centres, which was an hour away. We refused (fuel and the fact it's 55kg so quite an inconvenience to us) but they held their ground.
Just requested £250 back from PayPal who we'd used to pay and they didn't contest it. Never bothered fixing it and in 5 years it hasn't got any worse.
Similarly bought a set of knock-off Le Cruset stuff from John Lewis. Several items arrived chipped, they were quite good at sending replacements so no issues there but several weeks (or could have been months) they contacted us to ask for the other ones back. No provision for shipping cast iron so just said they could come and get them, they never did. Gave those away to family in the end.
I find you never forget when a company attempts to shaft you, or even just provides sub-par customer service. I'm pretty good at holding a grudge too where as a good services buys a lot of loyalty.
A few years ago we bought one of the big Berghaus tents from Go outdoors. On first use the stitching came away from one of the airbeam feet.
Contacted them and their solution was to take it to one of their service centres, which was an hour away. We refused (fuel and the fact it's 55kg so quite an inconvenience to us) but they held their ground.
Just requested £250 back from PayPal who we'd used to pay and they didn't contest it. Never bothered fixing it and in 5 years it hasn't got any worse.
Similarly bought a set of knock-off Le Cruset stuff from John Lewis. Several items arrived chipped, they were quite good at sending replacements so no issues there but several weeks (or could have been months) they contacted us to ask for the other ones back. No provision for shipping cast iron so just said they could come and get them, they never did. Gave those away to family in the end.
I find you never forget when a company attempts to shaft you, or even just provides sub-par customer service. I'm pretty good at holding a grudge too where as a good services buys a lot of loyalty.
megaphone said:
Do you have to send the 'faulty' glasses back?
When I have done s75 claims previously (fridge/freezer, computer monitor, mobile phone, amongst others) the bank, who has suffered the loss, has simply asked for a declaration or photo that the item has been destroyed or given to charity (the option depending on what was wrong with it).I guess that with a chargeback the retailer could ask for the item to be returned, since they are suffering the loss, but in most cases I doubt they want to pay to get back a faulty sub-£100 product.
Griffith4ever said:
Nope - wearing them now in Montenegro.
I've read up and I'll heat them in water and try and straighten the frames, at some stage - apparently that's why one lense pops itself out over time.
Going to speak to my bank when I return, to be 1000% sure its all done, then send an email , wearing them , with a finger, to the most obstructive "support" lady in spain I've ever dealt with.
So they were faulty to the point you needed/wanted your money back, yet you're still wearing them. I've read up and I'll heat them in water and try and straighten the frames, at some stage - apparently that's why one lense pops itself out over time.
Going to speak to my bank when I return, to be 1000% sure its all done, then send an email , wearing them , with a finger, to the most obstructive "support" lady in spain I've ever dealt with.
Not a huge fan of that I'll be honest.
Tam_Mullen said:
So they were faulty to the point you needed/wanted your money back, yet you're still wearing them.
Not a huge fan of that I'll be honest.
Company sells faulty product. Not a huge fan of that I'll be honest.
Company doesn't want to exchange the faulty item or to get back the faulty item and issue a refund for it.
And you have an issue with the customer?
Tam_Mullen said:
Griffith4ever said:
Nope - wearing them now in Montenegro.
I've read up and I'll heat them in water and try and straighten the frames, at some stage - apparently that's why one lense pops itself out over time.
Going to speak to my bank when I return, to be 1000% sure its all done, then send an email , wearing them , with a finger, to the most obstructive "support" lady in spain I've ever dealt with.
So they were faulty to the point you needed/wanted your money back, yet you're still wearing them. I've read up and I'll heat them in water and try and straighten the frames, at some stage - apparently that's why one lense pops itself out over time.
Going to speak to my bank when I return, to be 1000% sure its all done, then send an email , wearing them , with a finger, to the most obstructive "support" lady in spain I've ever dealt with.
Not a huge fan of that I'll be honest.
slievenashaska said:
Tam_Mullen said:
So they were faulty to the point you needed/wanted your money back, yet you're still wearing them.
Not a huge fan of that I'll be honest.
Company sells faulty product. Not a huge fan of that I'll be honest.
Company doesn't want to exchange the faulty item or to get back the faulty item and issue a refund for it.
And you have an issue with the customer?
I am convinced people trawl threads here to try and apportion blame. And I knew it was coming the moment I posted that I am still wearing them (albeit having to pop the lense back in every single time I put them on)
Edited by Griffith4ever on Monday 21st September 09:24
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