its not just about speed!!
Discussion
Probably raising a much discussed issue here but....I'm annoyed! Driving into work this morning I overtake a stopped bus. Some nutter runs out infront of the bus/my car. I stopped....JUST. The nutter runs around the back of my car and onto another waiting bus. Didn't even thank me for saving his life. T**t!!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
Morgs26 said:
Probably raising a much discussed issue here but....I'm annoyed! Driving into work this morning I overtake a stopped bus. Some nutter runs out infront of the bus/my car. I stopped....JUST. The nutter runs around the back of my car and onto another waiting bus. Didn't even thank me for saving his life. T**t!!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
If you had been focused on your speedo at that moment or doing more than 30 in those circumstances, then you probably should have been prosecuted anyway.
I agree with the sentiment but then its been ranted over about a billion times and the fact of the matter is that it makes money and creates fluffy jobs-two things labour and their drones are great at 
Agreed. I always expect people to do whatever you think they wownt do.
Dibble said:
[Devil's Advocate]I should have thought that you could have reasonably expected pedestrians to be launching themselves from near a stopped bus... so maybe 30 was too much... [/Devil's Advocate]
Well done for not clobbering him anyway.
Well done for not clobbering him anyway.
Agreed. I always expect people to do whatever you think they wownt do.
Dibble said:
As my instructor on my Advanced Car Course said to me "Assume everyone else on the road is an idiot. Then assume you are too".
I had no idea how deeply ingrained in my subconscious at least the former part of this advice is, until the other day when a car actually going where it was indicating to genuinely startled me.
It's a bit worrying when you naturally assume they'll do the wrong thing, and you're right so often it comes as a shock when they don't...
vonhosen said:
Morgs26 said:
Probably raising a much discussed issue here but....I'm annoyed! Driving into work this morning I overtake a stopped bus. Some nutter runs out infront of the bus/my car. I stopped....JUST. The nutter runs around the back of my car and onto another waiting bus. Didn't even thank me for saving his life. T**t!!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
If you had been focused on your speedo at that moment or doing more than 30 in those circumstances, then you probably should have been prosecuted anyway.
The fact is regardless of the speed I stopped. My judgement was correct. We are advised to use our inititive and slow down between parked cars and around buses etc, which is what I did. Where is the leniancy when it comes to clear, open roads with a 30 or 40 limit, and you're pulled for doing 35, 45...
And I totally agree, you have to expect the unexpected!
vonhosen said:
Morgs26 said:
Probably raising a much discussed issue here but....I'm annoyed! Driving into work this morning I overtake a stopped bus. Some nutter runs out infront of the bus/my car. I stopped....JUST. The nutter runs around the back of my car and onto another waiting bus. Didn't even thank me for saving his life. T**t!!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
If you had been focused on your speedo at that moment or doing more than 30 in those circumstances, then you probably should have been prosecuted anyway.
But then he would not have been on the basis that there are no speed cops to see him "gawping at speedo" (und how do you prove that.. he ist looking at speedo.. at right speed ... but still has a near miss
- but could not prove he did not see the person nor could you prosecute because he was not speeding und did not hit anyone even if he stop only just in time when person emerge from the front of the bus.) Incidentally - Highway Code Rule 30 does advise me not to cross a road directly in front of or behind a bus .. but to wait until it move off und you can see in both directions. Back home they'd fine me if I did these things und observed doing so by a gendarme.. so you grow up not doing this
Ist a great pity that this Code ist not part of the compulsory reading list for school exams.
This same rule also tell me as pedestrian to look out for cyclists as well as cars when I get off a bus und wish to cross a road
Und if he were above the lolly.. he would only have been pinged if cam has him in focus. Assuming a speed cam ist before the bus stop .. und some are hidden some way behind the bus shelter but not in front of it where the dangers are.. photo probably obscured by the bus ..
Und likelihood in UK of a policeman being on patrol? About nil! But we are back to COAST.. und clues are in observation. People queueing tell me "bus on way - people may be running to catch it - und when they get off und rush to catch a connection - else be late for work .. common sense also fly out of their brain cell too.
So .. you see a hazard und auto-pilot should really kick in und foot ease off pedal und we slow to appropriately safest speed - und usually get passed by a cyclist
vonhosen said:
If you had been focused on your speedo at that moment or doing more than 30 in those circumstances, then you probably should have been prosecuted anyway.
If he had been concentrating on his speedo he would have probably seriously injured the guy as he wouldn't have saw him.
TripleS said:
WildCat said:
....you see a hazard und auto-pilot should really kick in und foot ease off pedal und we slow to appropriately safest speed - und usually get passed by a cyclist
Oh that'd be IG - two wheeled tearaway extraordinaire.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
He ist a right devil on that bicycle of his.
He recommends "jamming" to us.. this ist riding in primary postion within the flow und overtaking .. as opposed to undertaking at the nearside und filtering to get to the be the second "vehicle" in the queue He advocates stopping behind the first car at the junction "because this allows numpty in the queue to concentrate (und he get the chance to dingaling his bell or honk his hooter.. ) und his primary position means the numpty behind sees him" und 
those steps in the town centre of Durham.. .. no problem - he rides up und down them...und still managed to father four ... He ist a right likelyable lad .. und he's one of them BiB up there
as you know .. vonhosen said:
If you had been focused on your speedo at that moment or doing more than 30 in those circumstances, then you probably should have been prosecuted anyway.
Now ,now , Van - all those SCP people tell us that if he wasn't over the speed limit -he was driving safely - surely you're not telling us that drivers that don't focus on their speed ,but on road hazards and adjust their speed to hazards ( like the BIB OF YESTERYEAR DRUMMED INTO US ) - and spend time looking for possible hazards, not cameras or vans, aren't safe drivers.Be nice to see someone prosecuted for dangerous driving below the speed limit - just think of all the loverly publicity for anti scam sites, and handed to them on a plate by those advocating the religion of "under the limit is safe" -- not "driving at appropriate speed"
morgs26 said:
vonhosen said:
Morgs26 said:
Probably raising a much discussed issue here but....I'm annoyed! Driving into work this morning I overtake a stopped bus. Some nutter runs out infront of the bus/my car. I stopped....JUST. The nutter runs around the back of my car and onto another waiting bus. Didn't even thank me for saving his life. T**t!!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
My point is, I have no idea how fast I was travelling (probably somewhere around 30) but more importantly I stopped, which means I wasn't travelling too fast. Soooooo, if I was travelling at what I thought was a safe speed, why are these speed concious wasters drilling it into everyone about slowing down, and why are speed cameras coninually being put in places of little or no danger?
Driving tests should focus 100% on awareness, alertness, knowing how to control your car etc etc etc... If I had been fixed on my speedo perhaps I would have hit the t**t?? And yes I know its all about safe speed AND observation, but I have proved to myself many times that its more to do with good judgement of conditions. If everyone was taught this I'm sure there would be a dramatic drop in 'speed' related dealths/injuries. I'm not saying remove all speed limits; just ease up on the constant 'speed kills' attitude.
Rant over!
If you had been focused on your speedo at that moment or doing more than 30 in those circumstances, then you probably should have been prosecuted anyway.
The fact is regardless of the speed I stopped. My judgement was correct. We are advised to use our inititive and slow down between parked cars and around buses etc, which is what I did. Where is the leniancy when it comes to clear, open roads with a 30 or 40 limit, and you're pulled for doing 35, 45...
And I totally agree, you have to expect the unexpected!
Then you did what the law says you should do.
Drive at a safe speed for the circumstances, up to & not beyond the speed limit in force.
If you're overtaking a bus, then surely you wouldn't be looking at your speedo ensuring you keep to 30 for two reasons. Firstly, you should be concentrating on the road ahead fully for the obvious reason similar to that happening to you and secondly because the scamera is unlikely to snap you as there is a dirty great big bus in its way!
vonhosen said:
If you had been focused on your speedo at that moment or doing more than 30 in those circumstances, then you probably should have been prosecuted anyway.
Do you think that Mr sub-average driver knows that?
Or do you accept that excessive speed enforcement might increase danger in such situations by promoting unnecessary speedo checks?
safespeed said:
vonhosen said:
If you had been focused on your speedo at that moment or doing more than 30 in those circumstances, then you probably should have been prosecuted anyway.
Do you think that Mr sub-average driver knows that?
Or do you accept that excessive speed enforcement might increase danger in such situations by promoting unnecessary speedo checks?
I've said many times that prosecuting for the smallest of margins is not desireable & for a whole host of reasons. (IMHO)
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