Unlawful Killing Verdict .....
Discussion
From BBC News:
Two teenage boys who died when the stolen car they were in crashed into a police roadblock in one of the Mersey Tunnels were unlawfully killed, an inquest has decided.
Darren Franey and Scott Veach, who were both 14, crashed into a lorry which had been positioned at the Liverpool end of the Wallasey Tunnel by the independent Tunnel Police force in March of last year.
The pair were in one of two high-powered cars which had been stolen from the same address in Chester a short while earlier.
Merseyside coroner Andre Rebello has recommended either the policing of the tunnel should be transferred to Merseyside Police, or tunnel officers should be trained to national policing standards.
Following an investigation by the Merseyside force, the Crown Prosecution Service ruled that five Tunnel Police officers will not face criminal charges, but they are still suspended and face internal disciplinary action.
The two-and-a-half week inquest in Liverpool heard that the first of the stolen cars avoided the roadblock, but the second hit the lorry at up to 100mph.
Mr Rebello said both boys had died breaking the law, but added he doubted they understood the dangers of it.
"There may be, rightfully so, a public outrage that these two young lives were wasted in what was a criminal enterprise," he said.
He said matters revealed during the inquest would cause "public disquiet".
"Mersey Tunnel Police force does not appear to be a police force in a sense that the public understands," he said.
[Computer reconstruction of the crash]
A computer reconstruction of the crash was shown to the jury
"I do not doubt that the officers and their management are dedicated to public service and carry out useful functions.
"But for society in Merseyside and at the Home Office I have to ask the question: 'What Is the function of a police constable?"'
He added he would write to Home Secretary David Blunkett, Merseyside chief constable Norman Bettison and to Neil Scales, the chief executive of Merseytravel, which oversees the tunnel police, to recommend the changes.
"I have to make recommendations which could lead to changes in societies," Mr Rebello said.
Scott and Darren's families welcomed the coroner's recommendations.
They did not want to comment after the verdict, but their solicitor said: "The families are of the hope that good can come out of this tragedy."
A spokesman for Merseytravel, which administers the Tunnel Police, said it was considering the verdict and will issue a statement later.
Police Complaints Authority deputy chairman Wendy Towers endorsed Mr Rebello's comments.
"All police forces charged with controlling traffic should be trained to the standards set by the Home Office and the Association of Chief Police Officers and the role of Mersey Tunnels Police now needs to be examined," she said, adding she had written to the Home Office to express her concerns.
Two teenage boys who died when the stolen car they were in crashed into a police roadblock in one of the Mersey Tunnels were unlawfully killed, an inquest has decided.
Darren Franey and Scott Veach, who were both 14, crashed into a lorry which had been positioned at the Liverpool end of the Wallasey Tunnel by the independent Tunnel Police force in March of last year.
The pair were in one of two high-powered cars which had been stolen from the same address in Chester a short while earlier.
Merseyside coroner Andre Rebello has recommended either the policing of the tunnel should be transferred to Merseyside Police, or tunnel officers should be trained to national policing standards.
Following an investigation by the Merseyside force, the Crown Prosecution Service ruled that five Tunnel Police officers will not face criminal charges, but they are still suspended and face internal disciplinary action.
The two-and-a-half week inquest in Liverpool heard that the first of the stolen cars avoided the roadblock, but the second hit the lorry at up to 100mph.
Mr Rebello said both boys had died breaking the law, but added he doubted they understood the dangers of it.
"There may be, rightfully so, a public outrage that these two young lives were wasted in what was a criminal enterprise," he said.
He said matters revealed during the inquest would cause "public disquiet".
"Mersey Tunnel Police force does not appear to be a police force in a sense that the public understands," he said.
[Computer reconstruction of the crash]
A computer reconstruction of the crash was shown to the jury
"I do not doubt that the officers and their management are dedicated to public service and carry out useful functions.
"But for society in Merseyside and at the Home Office I have to ask the question: 'What Is the function of a police constable?"'
He added he would write to Home Secretary David Blunkett, Merseyside chief constable Norman Bettison and to Neil Scales, the chief executive of Merseytravel, which oversees the tunnel police, to recommend the changes.
"I have to make recommendations which could lead to changes in societies," Mr Rebello said.
Scott and Darren's families welcomed the coroner's recommendations.
They did not want to comment after the verdict, but their solicitor said: "The families are of the hope that good can come out of this tragedy."
A spokesman for Merseytravel, which administers the Tunnel Police, said it was considering the verdict and will issue a statement later.
Police Complaints Authority deputy chairman Wendy Towers endorsed Mr Rebello's comments.
"All police forces charged with controlling traffic should be trained to the standards set by the Home Office and the Association of Chief Police Officers and the role of Mersey Tunnels Police now needs to be examined," she said, adding she had written to the Home Office to express her concerns.
Mr Rebello said both boys had died breaking the law, but added he doubted they understood the dangers of it.
"There may be, rightfully so, a public outrage that these two young lives were wasted in what was a criminal enterprise," he said.
Tough crap, if they steal and kill themselves it's natural 'kin justice! Only weak-kneed softy liberals and socialists would even waste a breath on such scum. A life wasted?? FFS!!! THEY were obviously a waste of life!!! Time these PC politicos got a damn good thumping and then got their feet back down to realityland NOT in cloud cuckoo land!!!!
Steal my car and you'll get wasted, properly. .357 magnum wise, damned tealeaves....... NO SYMPATHY whatsoever, just praise that natural selection sometimes dishes out justice, as these socialist scum in the government won't!
From BBC News:
Mr Rebello said both boys had died breaking the law, but added he doubted they understood the dangers of it.
"There may be, rightfully so, a public outrage that these two young lives were wasted in what was a criminal enterprise," he said.
Personally, I am outraged that any members of the public could be outraged at these little scrotes biting the bullet. Maybe with less liberal namby pamby parenting and teaching methods, combined with laws that made scrotes of this nature fear getting caught, they would have been deterred from such actions. To think they could still be playing on their playstations or spitting at pensioners as I type.
DAZ
>> Edited by dazren on Tuesday 25th March 14:18
JMGS4 said:
Mr Rebello said both boys had died breaking the law, but added he doubted they understood the dangers of it. .
They do now, and hopefully a few other scrotes will think twice.
If we are not carefull we will adopt the US mentaility that we expect to always be protected from out own stupidity. I jsut hope th Plod concerned don't suffer..
>> Edited by gro on Tuesday 25th March 14:19
The link to the story:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2884525.stm
Apparently it seems they blocked the tunnel with a lorry .....
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2884525.stm
Apparently it seems they blocked the tunnel with a lorry .....
Guess they couldn't have blocked it completely because one car managed to get through. That in itself is pretty odd.
The usual criticism of inquests is that they are too limp-wristed as they set out to establish facts, not to mete out blame. That BBC story doesn't bother to report the incident in any detail at all, which is pathetic given that that is precisely what the inquest will have spelt out.
Leaves us with nothing much to base our judgements on, unless someone local has ssen a report in the weekly rag???
The usual criticism of inquests is that they are too limp-wristed as they set out to establish facts, not to mete out blame. That BBC story doesn't bother to report the incident in any detail at all, which is pathetic given that that is precisely what the inquest will have spelt out.
Leaves us with nothing much to base our judgements on, unless someone local has ssen a report in the weekly rag???
Bollocks to them, if they don't want to get killed in a police chase, don't get in a 
ing police chase. Once they have nicked a car, as far as I'm concerned they're fair game for anything that happens. If they hadn't stole the car the accident wouldn't have happened. It is their fault and no-one elses.
ing police chase. Once they have nicked a car, as far as I'm concerned they're fair game for anything that happens. If they hadn't stole the car the accident wouldn't have happened. It is their fault and no-one elses.
I suppose its stupid to ask the collective if they feel it was right for two 14 year old boys to die in this tragic way.
As I understand the law the Police have a duty of care towards the criminals and as such should not have completely blocked the carriageway.
I guess the boys got the harshest possible sentence - I expect they thought twoccing and racing a police car would be fun.
I see from the posts above - we are holding life cheaply these days
As I understand the law the Police have a duty of care towards the criminals and as such should not have completely blocked the carriageway.
I guess the boys got the harshest possible sentence - I expect they thought twoccing and racing a police car would be fun.
I see from the posts above - we are holding life cheaply these days
Life IS cheap nowadays. I'm not exactly broken hearted that they crashed in the tunnel and died, but then again I'm not,as some are on here, quite happy and indeed pleased that they died in the way they did.
Cheap two-bit comments on here and other threads about people dying in RTAs and spoiling their day are thoughtless and not worthy of further comment.
Cheap two-bit comments on here and other threads about people dying in RTAs and spoiling their day are thoughtless and not worthy of further comment.
I'm sorry that two young lives were wasted but really have little sympathy for them. They shouldn't have taken the risk and stolen the cars and if this hadn't happened someone completely innocent might have been killed by their reckless driving.
The people who moan about this will probably be the same people who argued that young Bulger's killers were victims too!
If you committ the crime then you risk the consequence.
The people who moan about this will probably be the same people who argued that young Bulger's killers were victims too!
If you committ the crime then you risk the consequence.
Not right, but inevitable giving their actions and driving abilities.
I suppose its stupid to ask the collective if they feel it was right for two 14 year old boys to die in this tragic way.
This stupid rule kind of defeats the reason for having a road block doesn't it? More importantly the driver could not stop within the distance he knew to be clear.
As I understand the law the Police have a duty of care towards the criminals and as such should not have completely blocked the carriageway.
They got the harshest sentence mother nature could dish out. Maybe others will learn from their fatal accident, although this is unlikely as their fellow car thieves will all be hearing it was the fault of the tunnel police.
I guess the boys got the harshest possible sentence - I expect they thought twoccing and racing a police car would be fun.
Only the lives of scrotes such as car thieves, terrorists and paedophiles......
I see from the posts above - we are holding life cheaply these days
regards
DAZ
>> Edited by dazren on Tuesday 25th March 15:48
Hands up anyone who ever did something truly stupid as a kid? Friend of mine demolished someone's garage with a pipe bomb. Pretty stupid, I think we'll all agree. Does that act entirely define him? Of course not. He grew up to be a mature and responsible adult. Labelling kids "scrotes" and writing them off is feeble.
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