Idea for the police..?
Discussion
Myself and my lady friend were watching traffic cops a few weeks back...specifically the one using the choppers a lot. Something which came out of it very clearly from the Police point-of-view was that the chopper entirely changes the chase scenario and for the better (in fact you saw people giving up on the spot).
Ms Nightmare is a bit of a pilot and happens to know a fair few chopper pilots, and pointed out that it's VERY expensive to put a helicopter in the air for any time (something like £10K a pop?). She also added that at all times there are LOTS of helicopters in the air, often not doing a lot which couldnt be diverted to something else....so we came up with an idea...
1) Write to all flying schools in the country offering the privateer helicopter pilots a chance to become 'chase specials' (or similar).
2) In order to join up, they will have to take advanced training paid for by the police/government/whoever (as I know the low hovering is somewhat difficult and dangerous)
3) An additional 'specials broadcast band' is added to flight control
Scenario would go something like this...
chase in action, police control room calls local airfield who send out a broadcast for the special in the air (if they have one) to switch to the other frequency. This then puts them in direct contact with the control room who then simply direct them like any other police chopper.
reason? huge increase in the number of choppers which could be used in this situation for no increase in cost (which Im sure is partly what limits the use of them). Obviously everything would have to be trained in and monitored carefully, but we couldnt really think of any serious sticking points as an idea....
what do any of you, and especially the BiBs think?!
cheers
Night
Ms Nightmare is a bit of a pilot and happens to know a fair few chopper pilots, and pointed out that it's VERY expensive to put a helicopter in the air for any time (something like £10K a pop?). She also added that at all times there are LOTS of helicopters in the air, often not doing a lot which couldnt be diverted to something else....so we came up with an idea...
1) Write to all flying schools in the country offering the privateer helicopter pilots a chance to become 'chase specials' (or similar).
2) In order to join up, they will have to take advanced training paid for by the police/government/whoever (as I know the low hovering is somewhat difficult and dangerous)
3) An additional 'specials broadcast band' is added to flight control
Scenario would go something like this...
chase in action, police control room calls local airfield who send out a broadcast for the special in the air (if they have one) to switch to the other frequency. This then puts them in direct contact with the control room who then simply direct them like any other police chopper.
reason? huge increase in the number of choppers which could be used in this situation for no increase in cost (which Im sure is partly what limits the use of them). Obviously everything would have to be trained in and monitored carefully, but we couldnt really think of any serious sticking points as an idea....
what do any of you, and especially the BiBs think?!
cheers
Night
Myself and my lady friend were watching traffic cops a few weeks back...specifically the one using the choppers a lot. Something which came out of it very clearly from the Police point-of-view was that the chopper entirely changes the chase scenario and for the better (in fact you saw people giving up on the spot).
Ms Nightmare is a bit of a pilot and happens to know a fair few chopper pilots, and pointed out that it's VERY expensive to put a helicopter in the air for any time (something like £10K a pop?). She also added that at all times there are LOTS of helicopters in the air, often not doing a lot which couldnt be diverted to something else....so we came up with an idea...
1) Write to all flying schools in the country offering the privateer helicopter pilots a chance to become 'chase specials' (or similar).
2) In order to join up, they will have to take advanced training paid for by the police/government/whoever (as I know the low hovering is somewhat difficult and dangerous)
3) An additional 'specials broadcast band' is added to flight control
Scenario would go something like this...
chase in action, police control room calls local airfield who send out a broadcast for the special in the air (if they have one) to switch to the other frequency. This then puts them in direct contact with the control room who then simply direct them like any other police chopper.
reason? huge increase in the number of choppers which could be used in this situation for no increase in cost (which Im sure is partly what limits the use of them). Obviously everything would have to be trained in and monitored carefully, but we couldnt really think of any serious sticking points as an idea....
what do any of you, and especially the BiBs think?!
cheers
Night
find large indor shoping center dump car
get lost in crown dump jacket in bin make get away
a pro will los em before chopper in the air
>> Edited by outlaw on Friday 28th March 20:37
.Yes Sussex Police use their chopper to do speed checks and it does seem like a horrendous waste of resources. Don't need many hours in the air to pay for extra bobbies on the ground. And most people would prefer to see Police on the ground.
I am sure just their presence must act as a deterrent. If a potential crook keeps seeing police in the area of his intended crime he is more likely not to carry out the crime.
However of course the helicopter is useful for taking accident victims to hospital. or chasing scroates.
I am sure just their presence must act as a deterrent. If a potential crook keeps seeing police in the area of his intended crime he is more likely not to carry out the crime.
However of course the helicopter is useful for taking accident victims to hospital. or chasing scroates.
Chrisgr31 said: Yes Sussex Police use their chopper to do speed checks and it does seem like a horrendous waste of resources. Don't need many hours in the air to pay for extra bobbies on the ground. And most people would prefer to see Police on the ground.
I am sure just their presence must act as a deterrent. If a potential crook keeps seeing police in the area of his intended crime he is more likely not to carry out the crime.
However of course the helicopter is useful for taking accident victims to hospital. or chasing scroates.
Just gos to show. How my cash there is to be scamed, out of the uk motorist with the grat speeding scam.
If they can aford to put chopper up for that.
One flaw with this is that every commercial helicopter would have to be fitted with night sun, video facility , thermal immaging equipment. They would also have to have a qualified observer sitting in the aircraft with the relevant mapping facilities and also be trained in the operation of such equipment and production of evidence from the equipment so that it can be used in court.
Police Air crews are not just plucked from a panda car to sit next to the pilot and operate the radio. They undergo an intense Police air observers course which includes navigating skills. It is a hard course to pass and quite a few do not manage it.
There is no point chasing a bandit in the air if there is no evidence at the conclusion of the incident other than what whoever was in the aircraft happened to see and remember.
Interesting thought but it will never be a viable proposition on the basis of cost alone.
Police Air crews are not just plucked from a panda car to sit next to the pilot and operate the radio. They undergo an intense Police air observers course which includes navigating skills. It is a hard course to pass and quite a few do not manage it.
There is no point chasing a bandit in the air if there is no evidence at the conclusion of the incident other than what whoever was in the aircraft happened to see and remember.
Interesting thought but it will never be a viable proposition on the basis of cost alone.
Chrisgr31 said: Yes Sussex Police use their chopper to do speed checks and it does seem like a horrendous waste of resources. Don't need many hours in the air to pay for extra bobbies on the ground. And most people would prefer to see Police on the ground.
Bit of an old wives tale this one. No air support unit would mobilise purely on the basis of capturing speeding drivers. They have VASCAR facility but cannot operate this without a prefed distance being radioed from a ground unit to the aircraft as the aircraft does not have the facility to measure the distance of the target car accurately ( I assume that is why the servicing and maintenance is calculated on flying hours and not distance covered )
Once the aircraft is in flight, the crew take the opportunity to do all manner of other related work such as aerial photography for intelligence and briefing purposes as well as genral patrol and search which is picked up from information transmitted over the various radio channels that they cross in order to reach the specific job/task they have been allocated.
There is no point using a helicopter alone for speeders as it is much easier, more productive and much more cost effective to use ground units. Gaining evidence of number plates of fast travelling vehicles is not easy from the air unless the aircraft is at a relatively low altitude.
I am sure just their presence must act as a deterrent. If a potential crook keeps seeing police in the area of his intended crime he is more likely not to carry out the crime.
However of course the helicopter is useful for taking accident victims to hospital. or chasing scroates.
Its useful for many other things than that.
They are excellent when used in conjunction with Police Dog units.
The fact they are in the vicinity and very visible/audible helps to keep suspects who are trying to escape, pinned down in one location. This gives tracker dogs an advantage in that the suspect does not keep on going and the dog is much more likely to detect them from various scent techniques.
They are also used a lot to search for vulnerable missing people (elderly and children in particular) as they can cover large amounts of area quickly, thereby saving a lot of ground resources being deployed to physically search on foot.
madcop said: One flaw with this is that every commercial helicopter would have to be fitted with night sun, video facility , thermal immaging equipment.
Hi Madcop....indeed they would....but the cost of that equipment isn't very much when compared to the cost of an entire chopper is it? It isn't every commerical helicopter either, just those who have done the training etc....and they would only be selected from those who spend a LOT of time in the air so are of most potential use
They would also have to have a qualified observer sitting in the aircraft with the relevant mapping facilities and also be trained in the operation of such equipment and production of evidence from the equipment so that it can be used in court.
hmm...trickier...though I cant see the training for this sort of thing being so onerous that most people couldnt do it if they tried..?? after all ther are civilians using speed cameras etc now...and that must end up in court evidence-wise?
dont doubt that for a second, but as long as the standards dont slip...?
It is a hard course to pass and quite a few do not manage it.
Interesting thought but it will never be a viable proposition on the basis of cost alone.
obviously you know more about this than me, but I still see a decent ROI justification here
oh, and Outlaw....top idea!....but maybe not as easy after said shopping centre has closed for the evening...at about 6:00pm!
N
I think outlaw means the underground car park at most shopping centres.
The plan is if you're trying to get away then lose the cop car chasing you then head underground before the chopper is in the air. Then get into the shopping centre dump your jacket in the bin and try to leave without getting your face caught on CCTV cameras.
You then hope that the cop car (that was) chasing you doesn't start going round all the car parks in the area.
Andy
The plan is if you're trying to get away then lose the cop car chasing you then head underground before the chopper is in the air. Then get into the shopping centre dump your jacket in the bin and try to leave without getting your face caught on CCTV cameras.
You then hope that the cop car (that was) chasing you doesn't start going round all the car parks in the area.
Andy
andytk said: I think outlaw means the underground car park at most shopping centres.
The plan is if you're trying to get away then lose the cop car chasing you then head underground before the chopper is in the air. Then get into the shopping centre dump your jacket in the bin and try to leave without getting your face caught on CCTV cameras.
You then hope that the cop car (that was) chasing you doesn't start going round all the car parks in the area.
Andy[/quot
Not quite what i said was a pro will lose the cars ushall be fore ther call in chopper and be gone.
or beter still advoid drawing atention to there selfs
in the first place shoping center is just an example.
the main items needed are a a large building with lots of pepole in it a crowd is need.
but that about the only chance of escape once a choppers on them.
but there have all ready **** up if they end up with the chopper on em.
and realy that a last chance get ot of jail free card escape plan.
>> Edited by outlaw on Saturday 29th March 19:11
rich 36 said: I too lead a sad life
(see profile)
But given the oppurtunity, would love to be taught to fly choppers, i've always loved those things, especiallly the one in Skippy, with the floats on
Whhoooaaaahh
now where have i put that ribena down ?
not that easy to fly many ppeps are crap at even when they try to learn
any fool can learn a small private plane piss easy realy
chopers are not that easy most lerners cant even fly on in a strait line for a while.
its like jugerling
feet control tail blades to stop the chopper spining instead of blades
the cycle stick cotronls the whole angle of the 4 blades
and the colective controls the cut angle of main blades
so to fly in a strait line
you need to balance tail
and drop nose a bit and increase angle in blades with the colective
but that works in any direction and is a job to cordinate for a lot of peeps.
>> Edited by outlaw on Saturday 29th March 20:01
deltaf said: And dont forget the throttle control on the collective lever mate!!!
Just another job where 6 hands would be ever so useful!!
yep spot on m8
always kill me when you wachem in the movis in a chopper waveing there arm about while flying LoL
just had a nasty thort numpties in chopper
LoL What you all forget on the cost front is this. As the Sussex police can demonstrate by catching speeding motorists with a helicopter they can demonstrate conclusivly it is vital piece of kit to increase road safety. As they can only spend the cash extorted from us on road safety, hey presto by this action it is includable in the money they can spend. As you all know every force wants it,s own even if it is only for Alistair Stuart to have a ride in. The cost is not justified ever as far as I can see. They spend an extortinate amount of money on all the kit to chase a Scote who when they catch him gets Community service. If they spent the money on more jails an policemen perhaps they would'nt need to chase them
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