Do I have a leg to stand on?
Discussion
The other day while out in town (admittedly quite drunk) I was approached by 3 police officers and asked to stop swearing. Me and my mate then decided to walk towards the taxi rank and go home. The police decided to follow us and listen to our conversation. Next thing I know i'm being handcuffed etc and they refused to tell me why at first! Then they say "you've had 3 warnings for swearing now, you little shit, get in the van. £80 fine for you". Lovely experience. Then once i'm at the police station they wouldn't let me use the toilet, wouldn't remove the handcuffs despite me being in some kind of locked room and wouldn't let me inform anyone that i'd been arrested! (my phone was ringing all the time but couldn't get it due to having no hands available).
Now looking at the public order act, section 5, which i was arrested for .. it says:
There must be a person within the sight or hearing of the suspect who is likely to be caused harassment, alarm or distress by the conduct in question. A police officer may be such a person, but remember that this is a question of fact to be decided in each case by the magistrates. In determining this, the magistrates may take into account the familiarity which police officers have with the words and conduct typically seen in incidents of disorderly conduct.
Town was dead that night. At 1am I doubt there's anyone in a town centre who will take offence to casual swearing in a private conversation.
Now i'm left with 2 options-
pay £80 fine in the hardest financial month of the year when i already have no money!
take police to court
Any input on this?
Now looking at the public order act, section 5, which i was arrested for .. it says:
There must be a person within the sight or hearing of the suspect who is likely to be caused harassment, alarm or distress by the conduct in question. A police officer may be such a person, but remember that this is a question of fact to be decided in each case by the magistrates. In determining this, the magistrates may take into account the familiarity which police officers have with the words and conduct typically seen in incidents of disorderly conduct.
Town was dead that night. At 1am I doubt there's anyone in a town centre who will take offence to casual swearing in a private conversation.
Now i'm left with 2 options-
pay £80 fine in the hardest financial month of the year when i already have no money!
take police to court
Any input on this?
My natural instinct would always be to fight for your rights, given that the police really didn't treat you as they should have. But then I take huge offence if any of my rights are taken away from me.
So it really depends on how pi$$ed off you feel, and how much you care about the incident. If it's just a minor inconvenience to you, and you can't be arsed with the hassle, then you could just pay the £80 fine and let sleeping dogs lie.
Personally I don't think I could possibly do that.
So it really depends on how pi$$ed off you feel, and how much you care about the incident. If it's just a minor inconvenience to you, and you can't be arsed with the hassle, then you could just pay the £80 fine and let sleeping dogs lie.
Personally I don't think I could possibly do that.
Take the police to court for what? Wrongful imprisonment? Unlawful arrest? Not if i were you. They'll take forever to schedule a court hearing for it and int he meantime you'll get harassed.
You can go not guilty and plead your case, but you were pissed remember, they weren't, so the judge may take their word above yours when it comes to descriptions of volume levels and why you got the first warning.
Or you can swallow your indignation, cough the £80, and keep a better eye out for the cops in future.
You can go not guilty and plead your case, but you were pissed remember, they weren't, so the judge may take their word above yours when it comes to descriptions of volume levels and why you got the first warning.
Or you can swallow your indignation, cough the £80, and keep a better eye out for the cops in future.
jspesh said:
Murray993 said:
Pissed up, got arrested for being gobby. I'd just cough up and move on. Chalk it down to experience.
Annoying bit for me is that it was never directed at the police! It was only in conversation to my mate. Nobody else around except the police, me and my friend.
Normal talking voice or more of a loud shouting voice??
Bearing in mind you were drunk!!
jspesh said:
The other day while out in town (admittedly quite drunk) I was approached by 3 police officers and asked to stop swearing. Me and my mate then decided to walk towards the taxi rank and go home. The police decided to follow us and listen to our conversation. Next thing I know i'm being handcuffed etc and they refused to tell me why at first! Then they say "you've had 3 warnings for swearing now, you little shit, get in the van. £80 fine for you". Lovely experience. Then once i'm at the police station they wouldn't let me use the toilet, wouldn't remove the handcuffs despite me being in some kind of locked room and wouldn't let me inform anyone that i'd been arrested! (my phone was ringing all the time but couldn't get it due to having no hands available).
Now looking at the public order act, section 5, which i was arrested for .. it says:
There must be a person within the sight or hearing of the suspect who is likely to be caused harassment, alarm or distress by the conduct in question. A police officer may be such a person, but remember that this is a question of fact to be decided in each case by the magistrates. In determining this, the magistrates may take into account the familiarity which police officers have with the words and conduct typically seen in incidents of disorderly conduct.
Town was dead that night. At 1am I doubt there's anyone in a town centre who will take offence to casual swearing in a private conversation.
Now i'm left with 2 options-
pay £80 fine in the hardest financial month of the year when i already have no money!
take police to court
Any input on this?
Now looking at the public order act, section 5, which i was arrested for .. it says:
There must be a person within the sight or hearing of the suspect who is likely to be caused harassment, alarm or distress by the conduct in question. A police officer may be such a person, but remember that this is a question of fact to be decided in each case by the magistrates. In determining this, the magistrates may take into account the familiarity which police officers have with the words and conduct typically seen in incidents of disorderly conduct.
Town was dead that night. At 1am I doubt there's anyone in a town centre who will take offence to casual swearing in a private conversation.
Now i'm left with 2 options-
pay £80 fine in the hardest financial month of the year when i already have no money!
take police to court
Any input on this?
Always 2 sides to every story.
I have had mates in similar situations who swear they were acting like angels... when in fact they were not.
I wasn’t trying to imply you aimed it at the police. Just being trappy with your mates really. Thing is when you have had a few, you don’t always realise what you are like (or perceived as being like).
£80 might feel like a lot today, but if you take it further and lose it will end up costing you more than that.
£80 might feel like a lot today, but if you take it further and lose it will end up costing you more than that.
jspesh said:
Murray993 said:
Pissed up, got arrested for being gobby. I'd just cough up and move on. Chalk it down to experience.
Annoying bit for me is that it was never directed at the police! It was only in conversation to my mate. Nobody else around except the police, me and my friend.
Effing and blinding in front of a police officer or an old lady/children is just as bad.Let it be a lesson for you to learn and watch your behaviour when drunk.
ProPlus said:
jspesh said:
Murray993 said:
Pissed up, got arrested for being gobby. I'd just cough up and move on. Chalk it down to experience.
Annoying bit for me is that it was never directed at the police! It was only in conversation to my mate. Nobody else around except the police, me and my friend.
Normal talking voice or more of a loud shouting voice??
Bearing in mind you were drunk!!
yeah, this was my first thought... you admit being 'pissed up', but think your behaviour was acceptable, were you really in a fit state to judge?
Do you have an option of pleading not guilty and if so what are the consequences of pleading not guilty and then losing?
Basically if it comes down to your word against the polices you'll lose.
The best you can realistically hope for is to cause the police as much paper work as you can.
Personally I'd pay while forming a rather unpleasant view of the police.
Basically if it comes down to your word against the polices you'll lose.
The best you can realistically hope for is to cause the police as much paper work as you can.
Personally I'd pay while forming a rather unpleasant view of the police.
Is this a wind up?
[rant ON]
You're drunk and swearing in a public place. No class.
The BiB warn you to stop. You don't. No class.
Now you are whining because they arrested you. Still no class.
Just pay your fine and next time you're out for a few beers try to behave like a man and not a child.
[/rant OFF]
There may be some points of your post which are worth following up with the police - certainly the charge under section 5 is not one of them, why did the cops approach you if they couldn't hear you?
...being called a little shit, lack of access to toilet, lack of access to telephone may be worth looking in to if you're willing to put up with the hassle.
As above, I'd chalk it down to experience and then decide on your future point of view of the cops...
...being called a little shit, lack of access to toilet, lack of access to telephone may be worth looking in to if you're willing to put up with the hassle.
As above, I'd chalk it down to experience and then decide on your future point of view of the cops...
Vesuvius 996 said:
Is this a wind up?
[rant ON]
You're drunk and swearing in a public place. No class.
The BiB warn you to stop. You don't. No class.
Now you are whining because they arrested you. Still no class.
Just pay your fine and next time you're out for a few beers try to behave like a man and not a child.
[/rant OFF]
What's all this about 'no class'? Normal conversation between me and a friend, police decide to listen in because they obviously have nothing better to do. I'm lumped with a fine for a ridiculous reason. How are you to judge me as having no class?
Fittster said:
Do you have an option of pleading not guilty and if so what are the consequences of pleading not guilty and then losing?
Basically if it comes down to your word against the polices you'll lose.
The best you can realistically hope for is to cause the police as much paper work as you can.
Personally I'd pay while forming a rather unpleasant view of the police.
Basically if it comes down to your word against the polices you'll lose.
The best you can realistically hope for is to cause the police as much paper work as you can.
Personally I'd pay while forming a rather unpleasant view of the police.
Why unpleasant? If he acted like an obnoxious git he would get treated like one.Do you want piss-heads outside your front door at 1am using bad language whilst police officers "just observing" the situation doing nought about it? Thought not!
That's the trouble these days, we want police to act against bad behaviour , and when they do we condemn them for breaching our "human rights".
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