Road to Responsibilty Or Complete Chaos?
Discussion
Cannot see if this already posted? But no matter....Tory Boy visit Netherlands where they experiment with no road signs und no painted tarmac .. und a lowered kerb... in which all road users "mingle und jingle" together. 
But... per those leading the experiment.. drivers, cyclists und pedestrians all make the eye contact, use the COAST system und generally negotiate with each other with interestingly (und remember who said this first
... )
[quote=politician observer (Tory) on BB Radio 2 yesterday]
Drivers took the responsibity of choosing a safe speed at which to proceed
But ... Paulie 
been saying this for years.. , whilst cyclists und pedestrians actually looked out a bit more for traffic.
So-OH! Will this work? We have to remember them foreigners have a "politer" ethic und that as one person rang in to comment.. they have always had more cyclists than here 24/7.
Will we have to retrain everyone? Would it be free for all.. und would the boy racers start racing down the humped up residentials at higher speed than they do over the bumps now... as "using them as a launch pad for "going turbo" at take-off" seem to be main result of those
But... per those leading the experiment.. drivers, cyclists und pedestrians all make the eye contact, use the COAST system und generally negotiate with each other with interestingly (und remember who said this first
... ) [quote=politician observer (Tory) on BB Radio 2 yesterday]
Drivers took the responsibity of choosing a safe speed at which to proceed
But ... Paulie been saying this for years.. , whilst cyclists und pedestrians actually looked out a bit more for traffic. So-OH! Will this work?
We have to remember them foreigners have a "politer" ethic und that as one person rang in to comment.. they have always had more cyclists than here 24/7. Will we have to retrain everyone? Would it be free for all.. und would the boy racers start racing down the humped up residentials at higher speed than they do over the bumps now... as "using them as a launch pad for "going turbo" at take-off" seem to be main result of those
IN this country, probably chaos.
Sad to say that most people I see around daily are selfish feckwits of the highest order. Simply walk around a superstore to witness the "I'm alright jack" and "After me" attitude prevalent these days. Then, place these morons with little peripheral vision or spacial awareness into a 1 tonne vehicle.
Sad to say that most people I see around daily are selfish feckwits of the highest order. Simply walk around a superstore to witness the "I'm alright jack" and "After me" attitude prevalent these days. Then, place these morons with little peripheral vision or spacial awareness into a 1 tonne vehicle.
jasandjules said:
IN this country, probably chaos.
Sad to say that most people I see around daily are selfish feckwits of the highest order. Simply walk around a superstore to witness the "I'm alright jack" and "After me" attitude prevalent these days. Then, place these morons with little peripheral vision or spacial awareness into a 1 tonne vehicle.
Sad to say that most people I see around daily are selfish feckwits of the highest order. Simply walk around a superstore to witness the "I'm alright jack" and "After me" attitude prevalent these days. Then, place these morons with little peripheral vision or spacial awareness into a 1 tonne vehicle.
Here's an idea,
put them all into 1 ton vehicles (imperial you notice, not one of these new fangled metric tonnes), and let them all out onto the roads on special days. Darwinism takes over....
We'll have to come up with a special name for these days, so we all know to avoid the roads.
mmmmmmmm
I know, we'll call them bank holidays
Edited by andmole on Wednesday 24th January 18:43
I'd fear chaos in this country as well. For true Darwinism I think we should ban all four wheeled vehicles for a year and make everyone ride high powered motorcycles. We could sell the idea on reducing congestion
It's amazing how your standards improve when you are vulnerable.
It's amazing how your standards improve when you are vulnerable.
Edited by 711 on Wednesday 24th January 18:51
I think the lowered kerb will cause a problem for guide dogs and partially sighted people as they have no reference point as they have at the moment at crossings and lights. The rumble strip on the pavement being key for unsighted people.
I think it will be chaos and you'll have lots of people thinking that others are travelling too fast when in fact they're not.
Why don't they say - the pavement is for pedestrians and the road is for cars. If you cross anywhere else apart from a proper crossing - it's at your own risk - or introduce jaywalking.
I think it will be chaos and you'll have lots of people thinking that others are travelling too fast when in fact they're not.
Why don't they say - the pavement is for pedestrians and the road is for cars. If you cross anywhere else apart from a proper crossing - it's at your own risk - or introduce jaywalking.
crmcatee said:
Why don't they say - the pavement is for pedestrians and the road is for cars. If you cross anywhere else apart from a proper crossing - it's at your own risk - or introduce jaywalking.
Or the opposite. Pedestrians could have the right of way at all times and cars could be responsible for avoiding them.
Some roads are pedestrian free, some roads have been made car free, most accommodate both. It isn’t appropriate for all roads to be car free or pedestrian free. We can just behave sensibly and predictably and look out for one another. On some roads pedestrians are forced to walk some distance to find somewhere to cross the road, but on most roads this would not be appropriate.
The rules in the Netherlands have been different for generations and most of their towns and villages are very differently designed to the typical UK development. Put it into a small rural town remote from most places and I dare say it would work quite well - if you transplanted the generations of experience of looking for cyclists as you cross the ubiquitous cycle paths. In many ways, from what I have read about it, all they have done is extended some of the rules they already had generally - like night time flashing amber at traffic light controlled cross roads - and applied them to a small residential area out in the stick.
Scaling it up to work in Amsterdam or Rotterdam would be the challenge.
When they have doen that it might be worth the consideration of the rest of the world.
Then there is the US 'take it in turns principle which probably has similar origins. I couldn't see that working in the UK either. Not without a serious cultural transplant.
Scaling it up to work in Amsterdam or Rotterdam would be the challenge.
When they have doen that it might be worth the consideration of the rest of the world.
Then there is the US 'take it in turns principle which probably has similar origins. I couldn't see that working in the UK either. Not without a serious cultural transplant.
crmcatee said:
I think the lowered kerb will cause a problem for guide dogs and partially sighted people as they have no reference point as they have at the moment at crossings and lights.
The kerb acts as a good way to keep cars of the pavements and possibly saved my life when I crashed last February - would've ended up going up an embankment and possbily rolling if the kerbing that just happened to be there hadn't pushed me back onto the carriageway.
nobleguy said:
crmcatee said:
I think the lowered kerb will cause a problem for guide dogs and partially sighted people as they have no reference point as they have at the moment at crossings and lights.
The kerb acts as a good way to keep cars of the pavements and possibly saved my life when I crashed last February - would've ended up going up an embankment and possbily rolling if the kerbing that just happened to be there hadn't pushed me back onto the carriageway.
What were the circumstances of your collision?
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