Getting out of my car - road rage
Discussion
Was just thinking and wondering how much trouble you can really get in to if you get out of your car in a road rage incident?
My general principle is to NEVER get out, regardless of provocation. Problem is, occasionally it is just wrong time and place and I can think of two recent incidents when I have jumped out. Luckily, on both occasions the other guy (both times I was NOT the cause or provoker of the incident) acted in a manner most befitting typical bullies and backed down with a small show of puffed up chests. I cant help but feel these pr1cks are constantly picking on 'victims' and probably were amazed that someone stood up to them and jumped out. Must admit that I was surprisingly in their face when they confronted me and that may have given them second thoughts.
Problem is; it will be only a matter of time when I come up against the idiot that doesnt then back down or back off and plants one on me. Hope it never happens but as these incidents invariably attract attention and witnesses I have thought up responses along the lines of the following:
1) Stick one on him as hard and fast as possible just to make sure he doesnt hit me again. Then approach witnesses and get names to vouch that he swung first.
2) Offer him one more go (loudly) and if he does feel brave and stupid, see above.
3) swallow my pride and realise I am up a blind alley and only option is the worng and ugly one.
or
4) swallowmy pride and put it down to experience; ie get back in my car.
I would be surprised if I ever resort to violence but then I think I have been very lucky and do have a very thick skin and calm temperament.
Surely self defence would be an adequate defence or anyone have any experience of genuine road rage rather than puffed chests and swearing?
Was honestly just wondering and no, I am not looking for trouble or a thug.
My general principle is to NEVER get out, regardless of provocation. Problem is, occasionally it is just wrong time and place and I can think of two recent incidents when I have jumped out. Luckily, on both occasions the other guy (both times I was NOT the cause or provoker of the incident) acted in a manner most befitting typical bullies and backed down with a small show of puffed up chests. I cant help but feel these pr1cks are constantly picking on 'victims' and probably were amazed that someone stood up to them and jumped out. Must admit that I was surprisingly in their face when they confronted me and that may have given them second thoughts.
Problem is; it will be only a matter of time when I come up against the idiot that doesnt then back down or back off and plants one on me. Hope it never happens but as these incidents invariably attract attention and witnesses I have thought up responses along the lines of the following:
1) Stick one on him as hard and fast as possible just to make sure he doesnt hit me again. Then approach witnesses and get names to vouch that he swung first.
2) Offer him one more go (loudly) and if he does feel brave and stupid, see above.
3) swallow my pride and realise I am up a blind alley and only option is the worng and ugly one.
or
4) swallowmy pride and put it down to experience; ie get back in my car.
I would be surprised if I ever resort to violence but then I think I have been very lucky and do have a very thick skin and calm temperament.
Surely self defence would be an adequate defence or anyone have any experience of genuine road rage rather than puffed chests and swearing?
Was honestly just wondering and no, I am not looking for trouble or a thug.
I saw a bizarre road rage incident the other day on the North Circular. A chavved up Range Rover stopped behind a truck at lights and the driver got out and picked up a cone and started swinging it violently at the driver's cab, ranting incoherently.
The driver in his cab had a massive height advantage and kicked out at his face before driving off.
Why interact with the other fellow if you've got more to lose than he has? Call the Police and report his behaviour. They've got nothing to lose...
The driver in his cab had a massive height advantage and kicked out at his face before driving off.
Why interact with the other fellow if you've got more to lose than he has? Call the Police and report his behaviour. They've got nothing to lose...
To be honest if you're finding yourself in these type of situations with some regularity (as you seem to be suggesting) I'd be taking a long hard look at myself.
Experience of real road rage incidents ?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/692329.stm
Is what amounts to a bit of DWDCA really worth being stabbed for ?
You've got no idea who or what you're dealing with & you may very well be ill equipped to.
Experience of real road rage incidents ?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/692329.stm
Is what amounts to a bit of DWDCA really worth being stabbed for ?
You've got no idea who or what you're dealing with & you may very well be ill equipped to.
I'm a placid chap and have been fortunate enough to never have had to deal with this situation, but I have formulated a plan for if it ever arises:
1. Wait for the other chap to pull over, and do likewise
2. Wait for him to get out of the car
3. Dump the clutch and
off sharpish (driving carefully within posted limits, ossifer)
4. If subsequently followed, drive to a police station
1. Wait for the other chap to pull over, and do likewise
2. Wait for him to get out of the car
3. Dump the clutch and
off sharpish (driving carefully within posted limits, ossifer)4. If subsequently followed, drive to a police station
I was run off the road by a guy in Lincoln a very long time ago. I was stupid enough to turn my car around and catch him up for a q & a session. Long story short I got £1800 fine dwc 300 hrs commintity service. Loss of job and a criminal record. 3 different witness statements of what I did to him.(punched once. Keys in field after he laughed at me and said these things happen). 3 statements saying he run me off road. No one stopped to check me. Made complaint to police when they interviewed me. Said no evidence (mine was the more non pc crime I guess).
Edited by fat tony on Thursday 24th May 16:09
fat tony said:
I was run off the road by a guy in Lincoln a very long time ago. I was stupid enough to turn my car around and catch him up for a q & a session. Long story short I got £1800 fine dwc 300 hrs commintity service. Loss of job and a criminal record.
damn. did the police see you? did he make a complaint after? did you tell them he ran you off the road. did you punch him!!!?CommanderJameson said:
I'm a placid chap and have been fortunate enough to never have had to deal with this situation, but I have formulated a plan for if it ever arises:
1. Wait for the other chap to pull over, and do likewise
2. Wait for him to get out of the car
3. Dump the clutch and off sharpish (driving carefully within posted limits, ossifer)
3a. If you genuinely believe your life to be in danger, disable his car by ramming the rear wheel arch before driving off to the Police station.1. Wait for the other chap to pull over, and do likewise
2. Wait for him to get out of the car
3. Dump the clutch and
off sharpish (driving carefully within posted limits, ossifer)CommanderJameson said:
4. If subsequently followed, drive to a police station
7db said:
3a. If you genuinely believe your life to be in danger, disable his car by ramming the rear wheel arch before driving off to the Police station.
Isn't there a potential danger of disabling your own car by doing that, though, leading to a very nasty situation?I fear with adrenalin flying around, weapons on clear view, i.e. if it was a real "need to get out of this or I'm going to die" situation, sod the car I'd be disabling the
er himself by running over his shoes.Would be pretty nasty afterward I expect, I doubt that's reasonable self-defence.
I have been in the suggested situtation myself. A girl crashed into my car and blamed me. It all got a bit heated (verbally speaking) and she refused to give me any details or move her car from the middle of the road. Eventually the police were called by a witness. Unfortunately not before her boyfriend (whom she had called) had shown up screaming out me that i had broken his fu**ing car and he ought to re-arrange my face. He was complete ChavScum and i very stupidly told him to go for it and rearrange my face.
He whacked me plum on the nose and i fell backwards on my car, in the haze of it all i did not see the officer arriving over the road and i got straight back up and put the guy on his back. It took several hours of statements etc and witnesses making statements at the scene for me to be released without charge.
The copper said it was clear to him that the guy had hit me first and also looked like he was going to do so again, so in his opinion i was vindicated to act in self defence. They guy was charged with assault and i never found out whether it got to court etc.
He whacked me plum on the nose and i fell backwards on my car, in the haze of it all i did not see the officer arriving over the road and i got straight back up and put the guy on his back. It took several hours of statements etc and witnesses making statements at the scene for me to be released without charge.
The copper said it was clear to him that the guy had hit me first and also looked like he was going to do so again, so in his opinion i was vindicated to act in self defence. They guy was charged with assault and i never found out whether it got to court etc.
Couple of points;
Von,
I think I have only ever got out of my car THREE times in 23 years of driving! 2 in the last couple of years. I have been spat at, sitting in my car with the window open and the girl who owned the car asked why I didnt get out and thump the guy; I was 100% in the right.
I have sat in my Disco with the window down whilst a guy screamed abuse at me through the open window as I dared take offence at him cutting me up and pushing me into a traffic island (narrowly avoided). I have reported Royal Mail drivers for being absolute tw4ts and I have received a warning letter from the Police! I HAD A WITNESS!!!!!
I do not as a rule EVER get out of my car. It is a route to places I have no wish or need to go.
Unfortunately; on the two incidents I was alluding to, I have been in pretty much stationary traffic and it was looking a little ugly when someone gets out meaning harm (b the look on their face) and you really have no choice in the matter but to bluff your way out! (God forgive my bluff ever gets called; hence the posting)
John Laverick,
You have hit the nail on the head! When I have sat in the car and tried to ignore what is going on, I have never felt as vulnerable! If the guy screaming abuse into my window had launched one at me, I would have been pretty much powerless and would have been soundly thumped. No thanks!
ps - There was a time, again in stationary traffic where an idiot simply threw things at my car because again, I had a slight problem with their behaviour!
pps- And NO! I DO NOT GO LOOKING FOR TROUBLE; but is it really a surprise what a state this country is in when everybody is told to ignore everything around them and dont stand up to idiots who think they can do what they like with impunity?
Von,
I think I have only ever got out of my car THREE times in 23 years of driving! 2 in the last couple of years. I have been spat at, sitting in my car with the window open and the girl who owned the car asked why I didnt get out and thump the guy; I was 100% in the right.
I have sat in my Disco with the window down whilst a guy screamed abuse at me through the open window as I dared take offence at him cutting me up and pushing me into a traffic island (narrowly avoided). I have reported Royal Mail drivers for being absolute tw4ts and I have received a warning letter from the Police! I HAD A WITNESS!!!!!
I do not as a rule EVER get out of my car. It is a route to places I have no wish or need to go.
Unfortunately; on the two incidents I was alluding to, I have been in pretty much stationary traffic and it was looking a little ugly when someone gets out meaning harm (b the look on their face) and you really have no choice in the matter but to bluff your way out! (God forgive my bluff ever gets called; hence the posting)
John Laverick,
You have hit the nail on the head! When I have sat in the car and tried to ignore what is going on, I have never felt as vulnerable! If the guy screaming abuse into my window had launched one at me, I would have been pretty much powerless and would have been soundly thumped. No thanks!
ps - There was a time, again in stationary traffic where an idiot simply threw things at my car because again, I had a slight problem with their behaviour!
pps- And NO! I DO NOT GO LOOKING FOR TROUBLE; but is it really a surprise what a state this country is in when everybody is told to ignore everything around them and dont stand up to idiots who think they can do what they like with impunity?
Von's example of Kenneth Noye is exactly the one I always use. You have no idea who or what the other person is. OK we will not go into the unsavoury reasons why Noye believed he could act like he did and get away with it.
The quote I like is the one contained in the last paragraph here.
The quote I like is the one contained in the last paragraph here.
article said:
Four years ago Evening Standard reporter Nigel Rosser asked a senior detective to describe exactly what Kenneth Noye was like. The policeman looked him up and down and replied: "A middle-class boy like you? Absolutely your worst nightmare." In Noye's 52 years, there are too many who have had to learn that the hard way.
By the way that article only tells part of the story, your hair would curl.The true road-rage incident I love happened a few years ago to a very good friend of mine.
He was driving to my house on our way to Silverstone when, at a roundabout, a truck forced him onto the centre of a roundabout, fortunately without damage to his brand new car. My friend sounded his horn which got the response of two fingers out of the open windon, followed by a head and the mouthed words to 'f*** off'.
My buddy proceeded down the road behind the truck on a 4-lane single carriageway but when he went to overtake, the truck tried to force him into the path of the oncoming traffic on 2 occassions. Then, when the truck stopped at a set of lights my buddy stopped alongside and got out. The driver opened his cab door and said, aggressively, "What's your f-ing problem then?" The reply from my buddy, "Nothing compared to yours, I'm Inspector xxxxx of the Met and you're nicked". he then got witnesses from the 2 cars behind, took the truck keys and phoned for a patrol car. The end result was that the trucker got banned for 18 months plus a big fine. The DD wsa considered so serious that a custodial was considered, apparently.
He was driving to my house on our way to Silverstone when, at a roundabout, a truck forced him onto the centre of a roundabout, fortunately without damage to his brand new car. My friend sounded his horn which got the response of two fingers out of the open windon, followed by a head and the mouthed words to 'f*** off'.
My buddy proceeded down the road behind the truck on a 4-lane single carriageway but when he went to overtake, the truck tried to force him into the path of the oncoming traffic on 2 occassions. Then, when the truck stopped at a set of lights my buddy stopped alongside and got out. The driver opened his cab door and said, aggressively, "What's your f-ing problem then?" The reply from my buddy, "Nothing compared to yours, I'm Inspector xxxxx of the Met and you're nicked". he then got witnesses from the 2 cars behind, took the truck keys and phoned for a patrol car. The end result was that the trucker got banned for 18 months plus a big fine. The DD wsa considered so serious that a custodial was considered, apparently.
I had a similiar incident not 2 hours ago. After getting 4 fillings at the dentist i decided to drive the long way home, something to do while the anasthetic wears off.
Roundabout, 3 lanes, going straight across, kept to the inside of the roundabout, guy on the right of me pulls right across while im going past him on the right, sound the horn.
Get to another roundabout, guy idicates towards his eyes and the road, i indicate towards his mirrors.
Other side of round about, pull up along side, window down. Me hardly able to speak, few obscenties shouted each way, me about his looking him going on about the road markings. Further down, pulls up along side again, call me a ponsy little tt- perhaps not a bad description to which i replied better than a fat balding old git. Then threatens me that if i do that again he will rip my head off. Pulls down the inside to the front, upon him going into the petrol station, i flip him the bird as i pass. Get to my estate, he is behind me, sped up brake really hard a few times as he tailgates me. Still following, nice elderly chap, while i crawl past asks whats wrong, of course i dont want to stop, guy eventually goes the other way.
I go back to see the old man, who tells me that there is no point, that i wasnt any lesser for not getting out and doing him.
What that idiot following me didnt understand was i am a law student and a criminal record is fatal for me.
I know if i get out the car, id flatten him, noting intentional, in a fight i tend to loose it. Using my new rock boots on someones knee cap brings anyone down instantly, tried and tested. As most hard men, they see a pretty small young guy, high on fashion, died hair and think ah ill act like a macho big man.
It brings some hope that people dont think any less of someone for not getting out. I cant help feeling that some would have regarded me a some sort of wimp. Before i started my degree, i was in fights all the time, never really loosing, but when i turned 18 i had to grow up, unfortunately i feel others will see that as a weakness.
Roundabout, 3 lanes, going straight across, kept to the inside of the roundabout, guy on the right of me pulls right across while im going past him on the right, sound the horn.
Get to another roundabout, guy idicates towards his eyes and the road, i indicate towards his mirrors.
Other side of round about, pull up along side, window down. Me hardly able to speak, few obscenties shouted each way, me about his looking him going on about the road markings. Further down, pulls up along side again, call me a ponsy little t
t- perhaps not a bad description to which i replied better than a fat balding old git. Then threatens me that if i do that again he will rip my head off. Pulls down the inside to the front, upon him going into the petrol station, i flip him the bird as i pass. Get to my estate, he is behind me, sped up brake really hard a few times as he tailgates me. Still following, nice elderly chap, while i crawl past asks whats wrong, of course i dont want to stop, guy eventually goes the other way. I go back to see the old man, who tells me that there is no point, that i wasnt any lesser for not getting out and doing him.
What that idiot following me didnt understand was i am a law student and a criminal record is fatal for me.
I know if i get out the car, id flatten him, noting intentional, in a fight i tend to loose it. Using my new rock boots on someones knee cap brings anyone down instantly, tried and tested. As most hard men, they see a pretty small young guy, high on fashion, died hair and think ah ill act like a macho big man.
It brings some hope that people dont think any less of someone for not getting out. I cant help feeling that some would have regarded me a some sort of wimp. Before i started my degree, i was in fights all the time, never really loosing, but when i turned 18 i had to grow up, unfortunately i feel others will see that as a weakness.
bi9_jk said:
Roundabout, 3 lanes, going straight across, kept to the inside of the roundabout, guy on the right of me pulls right across while im going past him on the right, sound the horn.
Happens to me every time I go out in the car and have to go right at a two lane roundabout.Let it go, it's a momentary inconvenience at worst usually - no need to turn it into a fully fledged road rage session.
And how much control/attention were you paying to your driving whilst conducting your little vendetta?
Both of you should be booked for DWDCA IMO.
timberwolf said:
I fear with adrenalin flying around, weapons on clear view, i.e. if it was a real "need to get out of this or I'm going to die" situation, sod the car I'd be disabling the er himself by running over his shoes.
Would be pretty nasty afterward I expect, I doubt that's reasonable self-defence.
Don't see why not, if you're being offered lethal force surely you can (and in my view, should try to) kill your assailant. That sounds to me both reasonable and proportionate. On the other hand, if you're in a car and the other guy isn't the law would probably expect you to try to escape by driving away. In circumstances, however, when there was two of you in the car, one gets out and finds himself threatened with a knife, surely it is reasonable and proportionate for the guy still in the car to drive as fast as possible directly at the assailant?Would be pretty nasty afterward I expect, I doubt that's reasonable self-defence.
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