Not sure if this is the right forum - defrauded on Paypal

[-JUT-]

Can anyone offer me any advice or experience on the following situation?

I have been scammed via paypal - somebody got into my paypal account, and sent two payments to themselves, one for £977 and one for £988. They only showed up on my bank account today, although paypal emailed me a couple of days ago to say that they suspected someone had accessed my account and asked me to change my security details (although at no point did they mention suspect payments or ask me to check for anything).

I spoke to Barclays who said it's an issue between me and Paypal. Initially when I reported the transactions as unauthorised to Paypal they stated there was "insufficient information" to prove the transactions were fraudulent so they closed the complaint and refused to refund. I have since pointed out that it was them who emailed me to tell me the security on the account had been breached, and asked for their address for service of documents as I intend to bring a claim against them for negligence if they do not investigate the matter properly and refund my money, at which point I got a back-pedalling reply stating that although I may have received an email saying the matter was closed, it is actually ongoing...

What would you guys do in this situation? The payments came off a debit card so I have no purchase protection, but I'm also annoyed at my bank for authorising the second payment as it took me over £900 over my overdraft limit and to my mind, they should have refused the payment.

I'm going to the police station after work to report the fraud, but are there any other steps I should be taking?

p.s. I know the guy's name and email address, but I'm not sure if it's OK to post it here. However I do not know him personally, and have no record of having any past transactions with him.

[GKP]

-JUT- said:

although paypal emailed me a couple of days ago to say that they suspected someone had accessed my account and asked me to change my security details

Oh no. Don't tell me you clicked on a link in the email 'they' sent?

[Mr_annie_vxr]

That email is nothing to do with paypal. They are not liable. You need to go back to your bank.

[-JUT-]

Hold your horses, I never said anything about clicking on a link!

Paypal emailed me on the 30th of June saying they suspected someone had fraudulently gained access to my account. This email contained no links, I didn't click on any links. I went to Paypal's own website manually, and changed my passwords etc as soon as I got the message. At the time the fraudster had archived the transactions so they didn't show in the transaction history on the main page, and I didn't check the full history (my bad, I know I should have done this). The first I knew was when the payments showed up online on my bank account this morning.

At no point did I receive the normal email from Paypal that you get when you make a payment - I suspect the see-you-next-tuesday fraudster changed the email address for the confirmation to that of his own email address, for the purposes of making these payments, then changed it back again. Or maybe it's somebody crooked working at Paypal. Who knows. All I know is that nobody actually told me these payments had been taken, I saw them for myself when I looked at my bank account this morning.

ETA: the payments show as being made on the 28th June, before Paypal emailed me to say they suspected my account had been hacked. So I think their statement about "insufficient evidence that the payments were not authorised" has been compromised and is frankly a weak attempt not to admit they've been had.

Edited by -JUT- on Tuesday 3rd July 18:40

[-JUT-]

P.S. the name used on the transaction is Ian Miles

The details Paypal hold are:

Name:
Ian Miles
Email:
[e-mail]
Payment Sent to:

[e-mail]

Tempted to add him on messenger just so I can hurl abuse at him! Any way to trace the tosspot from his email address?

[JustinP1]

-JUT- said:

P.S. the name used on the transaction is Ian Miles

The details Paypal hold are:

Name:
Ian Miles
Email:
[e-mail]
Payment Sent to:

[e-mail]

Tempted to add him on messenger just so I can hurl abuse at him! Any way to trace the tosspot from his email address?

Paypal should be able to get the IP address of where the transaction was made which will vindicate you and find out where the transaction originated from. The police will no doubt be involved.

I would keep quiet until then otherwise you could spook him and ruin the case.

[Apache]

Jesus, you are about the 4th person I know of who has been diddled via paypal.

[groomi]

I'm also in the process of trying to sort out some fraudulent transactions with my Barclays Debit Card. I believe the card details and my home address may have been taken from Paypal although have no proof. Barclays are playing ball so far, but I won't relax until the moneys back in my account.

[-JUT-]

I haven't received confirmation of the same from Paypal but my complaints online have now gone from "closed - p1ss off you're screwed" to "closed - refunded in full" - I'll believe it when I see it as my bank differs on it's opinion and the card on which the payments were taken has been cancelled. Thank god I didn't add direct account funding to Paypal! And bollox to using a debit card with them in future, credit card only so I've got some purchase protection.

[tigger1]

Good luck getting it back, but whatever happens DEMAND that this is dealt with as a crime BY THE POLICE, so that fraud doesn't disappear as it is already being under-reported (not helped by the fact that now banks are supposed to deal with it internally initially)

[streaky]

1) Is your PayPal password unguessable? Try a minimum of eight characters and include characters from sets "a-z, "A-B", "0-9" and "!£$%^& ...", etc. - if accepted by PayPal.

2) Open a separate bank account, maintain a minimum balance (commonly £1), get a Debit Card on this account and use this for PayPal transactions, transferring monies in and out to another bank account as required.

3) Never use a public (or office) computer for PayPal transactions.

4) Check your PC for Spyware, Keyloggers, etc.

5) Never reply to "phishing" emails (you said you didn't).

Streaky

[Marki]

-JUT- said:

I'm going to the police station after work to report the fraud, but are there any other steps I should be taking?

I dont think the old Bill will be interested , i belive they changed the rules on bank - card fraud , you can not report it its down to the bank institution to report as they see fit

[-JUT-]

I reported it to plod, and have informed Paypal that I have done so, and also put them on notice that I will issue a claim against them unless I have my money back within ten days as per their stated policy in the event of fraudulent transactions. I assume this has taken the wind out of their sails as I haven't heard anything directly from them on the matter, but looking at my complaints on the paypal website directly, the status has changed from "closed - bugger off and stop bothering us" to "closed - payment refunded in respect of fraudulent transaction" - my bank account doesn't agree yet though. They'll have trouble refunding it onto my now-cancelled debit card but I've told them it is cancelled and they have my bank details already.

[Goochie]

Whatch out for your bank charging you for an un-authorised overdraft too.

They should be able to refund it as a "goodwill gesture" though (assumign you've been a good boy for the last 12 months)

[-JUT-]

I already notified the bank of the situation, but I'm going to be pro-active and give them the crime reference number etc. and ask them not to apply any such charges then I've got a better ground for appeal if they do so later on.

[UK_WS6]

Apache said:

Jesus, you are about the 4th person I know of who has been diddled via paypal.

,
,
,
I closed my paypal account about 2 months ago.

If I want to pay then I will send a check or postal order.
if thats not acceptable then I won't buy.

Paypal and Fleabay are one of the same, and you can't trust either of them.

[NobleGuy]

-JUT- said:

...although paypal emailed me a couple of days ago to say that they suspected someone had accessed my account and asked me to change my security details (although at no point did they mention suspect payments or ask me to check for anything)...

I'm not sure they did you know....
Did you do anything about this mail (enter login details on a page etc)? If so, you've probably been phished. If you still have the mail, check the internet address of the page they ask you to go to. If it's not Paypal.com then you've been had I'm afraid (provided you took them up on their offer to change your details).

[-JUT-]

NobleGuy said:

-JUT- said:

...although paypal emailed me a couple of days ago to say that they suspected someone had accessed my account and asked me to change my security details (although at no point did they mention suspect payments or ask me to check for anything)...

I'm not sure they did you know....
Did you do anything about this mail (enter login details on a page etc)? If so, you've probably been phished. If you still have the mail, check the internet address of the page they ask you to go to. If it's not Paypal.com then you've been had I'm afraid (provided you took them up on their offer to change your details).

Trust me, I haven't been phished. I'm well aware of scams, and I know what to look for. As I said above, the email I got came from a genuine Paypal address, and contained no links for me to click on. It also came two days after the payments had been made. It wasn't a case of being phished, I can't see how anyone with an IQ over thirty would ever click on a hyperlink after receiving an email from a financial institution saying "we've lost your details, can you go here and type them in for us please" - you'd have to be a complete moron. Speaking of which, take this email inquiry I got yesterday about a car I had for sale:


1996 TVR CHIMAERA 4.0 2dr Convertible £ 8,800 ono‎
From: wahab masalmu ([e-mail])
Sent: 03 July 2007 18:46:12
To: ********************


HELLO,
GOODDAY..I AM WAHAB , AM INTRESTED IN BUYING YOUR CAR PASTED ON
THE WEBPAGE FOR PERSONAL USE FIRSTLY I DID LIKE TO KNOW THE PRESENT CONDITIONS INCLUDING THE MILLAGE AND IF ITS DEISEL OR PETROL AND THE RECENT PICTURE ALSO I WILL WANT TO KNOW YOUR PREFFRED MODE OF PAYMENT BANKER`S DRFTOR RO CERTISFIED CHEQUE, IWAIT TO READ FROM YOUR REPLY SOONEST SO WE CAN ARRANGE FOR QUICK PAYMENT.HERE IS
MY NUMBER 07024051121.
REGARDS.
WAHAB MASALAMU.

I know a scam when I see it!!!

[Marki]

-JUT- said:

1996 TVR CHIMAERA 4.0 2dr Convertible £ 8,800 ono‎
From: wahab masalmu ([e-mail])
Sent: 03 July 2007 18:46:12
To: ********************


HELLO,
GOODDAY..I AM WAHAB , AM INTRESTED IN BUYING YOUR CAR PASTED ON
THE WEBPAGE FOR PERSONAL USE FIRSTLY I DID LIKE TO KNOW THE PRESENT CONDITIONS INCLUDING THE MILLAGE AND IF ITS DEISEL OR PETROL AND THE RECENT PICTURE ALSO I WILL WANT TO KNOW YOUR PREFFRED MODE OF PAYMENT BANKER`S DRFTOR RO CERTISFIED CHEQUE, IWAIT TO READ FROM YOUR REPLY SOONEST SO WE CAN ARRANGE FOR QUICK PAYMENT.HERE IS
MY NUMBER 07024051121.
REGARDS.
WAHAB MASALAMU.

I know a scam when I see it!!!

You mean you dont want to sell your chimp to me :hehe


oh borrocks

[-JUT-]

Marki said:

-JUT- said:

1996 TVR CHIMAERA 4.0 2dr Convertible £ 8,800 ono‎
From: wahab masalmu ([e-mail])
Sent: 03 July 2007 18:46:12
To: ********************


HELLO,
GOODDAY..I AM WAHAB , AM INTRESTED IN BUYING YOUR CAR PASTED ON
THE WEBPAGE FOR PERSONAL USE FIRSTLY I DID LIKE TO KNOW THE PRESENT CONDITIONS INCLUDING THE MILLAGE AND IF ITS DEISEL OR PETROL AND THE RECENT PICTURE ALSO I WILL WANT TO KNOW YOUR PREFFRED MODE OF PAYMENT BANKER`S DRFTOR RO CERTISFIED CHEQUE, IWAIT TO READ FROM YOUR REPLY SOONEST SO WE CAN ARRANGE FOR QUICK PAYMENT.HERE IS
MY NUMBER 07024051121.
REGARDS.
WAHAB MASALAMU.

I know a scam when I see it!!!

You mean you dont want to sell your chimp to me :hehe


oh borrocks

No, not by banker's drftro or by cetisfied cheque... no matter how soonest you can arrange...