Attempt (in USA) to prove radar wrong using car's GPS
Discussion
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20071026-accused-speeder-to-cops-my-gps-proves-your-radar-gun-is-wrong.html
Check out that last paragraph!
Streaky
arstechnica said:
GPS-based tracking devices don't just help you figure out where you are and where you're going, they might also help you avoid a speeding ticket. Shaun Malone of California is contesting a speeding ticket in that state by arguing that his GPS-based tracking system shows that the officer's radar gun was wrong.
Malone, a 17-year-old who was clocked doing 62 MPH in a 45 MPH zone on July 4 of this year, has more than just a GPS on his side. As the AP reports, his stepfather Roger Rude is a retired sheriff, and is pushing Malone to fight the ticket. (As an aside, how awesome would it be to be Sherriff Rude?)
Ironically, Malone's parents had the GPS system installed in order to track the whereabouts and speed of their son, whom they readily admit has a lead foot. In fact, he has already been grounded for having gone over 70 MPH after the GPS was installed. Nevertheless, Malone's parents say that the data on the day in question shows that their son was not speeding in the vicinity of where the ticket was issued.
While many GPS systems don't log travel details extensively enough to be used as a defense against a moving violation, Malone's car was outfitted with a device that could do just that. According to Rude, all recorded plots on Malone's route show him to be driving under the speed limit. At the same time, Rude says, GPS-systems are clearly more reliable than radar systems, which, while good, are "not an infallible tool" and are subject to human error.
A Sonoma County traffic commissioner has to decide whether the GPS system can be accepted as a basis to challenge the ticket, but ex-sheriff Rude is prepared to push his case in court in the event of an unhappy outcome.
The debate is likely to come down to how often the GPS device calculated and reported ground speed. Petaluma police lieutenant John Edwards told the AP that since GPS is satellite-based, there's a delay involved, and that Malone may have sped up and slowed down in the window between measurements, which could be as long as 60 seconds.
GPS tracking systems like the one in Malone's car are becoming an increasingly popular way for parents to keep tabs on their kids, an outgrowth of the initial use of such devices in car fleets and trucking. Many consumer-oriented GPS navigation systems also have these capabilities, but Malone's was hardcore: the system would even e-mail his parents in the event that he drove too fast.
Malone, a 17-year-old who was clocked doing 62 MPH in a 45 MPH zone on July 4 of this year, has more than just a GPS on his side. As the AP reports, his stepfather Roger Rude is a retired sheriff, and is pushing Malone to fight the ticket. (As an aside, how awesome would it be to be Sherriff Rude?)
Ironically, Malone's parents had the GPS system installed in order to track the whereabouts and speed of their son, whom they readily admit has a lead foot. In fact, he has already been grounded for having gone over 70 MPH after the GPS was installed. Nevertheless, Malone's parents say that the data on the day in question shows that their son was not speeding in the vicinity of where the ticket was issued.
While many GPS systems don't log travel details extensively enough to be used as a defense against a moving violation, Malone's car was outfitted with a device that could do just that. According to Rude, all recorded plots on Malone's route show him to be driving under the speed limit. At the same time, Rude says, GPS-systems are clearly more reliable than radar systems, which, while good, are "not an infallible tool" and are subject to human error.
A Sonoma County traffic commissioner has to decide whether the GPS system can be accepted as a basis to challenge the ticket, but ex-sheriff Rude is prepared to push his case in court in the event of an unhappy outcome.
The debate is likely to come down to how often the GPS device calculated and reported ground speed. Petaluma police lieutenant John Edwards told the AP that since GPS is satellite-based, there's a delay involved, and that Malone may have sped up and slowed down in the window between measurements, which could be as long as 60 seconds.
GPS tracking systems like the one in Malone's car are becoming an increasingly popular way for parents to keep tabs on their kids, an outgrowth of the initial use of such devices in car fleets and trucking. Many consumer-oriented GPS navigation systems also have these capabilities, but Malone's was hardcore: the system would even e-mail his parents in the event that he drove too fast.
Check out that last paragraph!
Streaky
Atom said:
This is exactly the sort of technology that the UK Government wants us to have in all our cars under the excuse of road pricing. Watch out !
Ah, but Gordo's dropped road-pricing ... until the polls show he could win an election [where's the 'cynical' smiley when you need it?] - Streakystreaky said:
The debate is likely to come down to how often the GPS device calculated and reported ground speed. Petaluma police lieutenant John Edwards told the AP that since GPS is satellite-based, there's a delay involved, and that Malone may have sped up and slowed down in the window between measurements, which could be as long as 60 seconds.
Well that bo
ocks for a start. Even the most basic GPS system these days is capable of updating at 1Hz, and decent ones are as quick as 10Hz( i.e. 10 times a second). Perhaps the 60 second period comes from a logging system with limited memory so sample rate is kept well down? This item reminded a friend of a case over 30 years ago where a physicist at Los Alamos Labs protested a speeding ticket by trying to convince the judge (who was a retired physicist from the labs) that the thunderstorm caused the radar system to give a false reading. Reference.
Streaky
Report said:
At his trial he produced an involved theory of high-energy physics that suggested the radar speed gun readings were distorted by a nearby thunderstorm.
The judge's summation ran: "Only in Los Alamos would a defendant argue high-energy physics as a defense against a charge of driving with excessive speed. Only in Los Alamos would the Judge have the PhD necessary to know that he was talking utter nonsense."
Love it!The judge's summation ran: "Only in Los Alamos would a defendant argue high-energy physics as a defense against a charge of driving with excessive speed. Only in Los Alamos would the Judge have the PhD necessary to know that he was talking utter nonsense."
Streaky
Another correspondent offered this ... which is perhaps some judges in the UK might like to consider - since many of them also appear to be afraid of creating a precedent.
Correspondent] [This said:
brought to mind an old Joe Condon [whoever 'Joe' is or was] story. Seems his neighbor was hauled in for speeding in his Porsche and asked if Joe might be able to check the accuracy of the radar. Joe relished the challenge and agreed to serve as an expert witness. He borrowed the very radar from the police and set it up at the very spot of the ticket, where the cop lurked just where cars came into view around a wooded curve. The radar worked fine on several trials at the speed limit and then gave a startlingly high reading. A truck appeared out of the woods behind the Porsche; its big cross-section had been detected through the trees beyond the little stealth car. Joe testified to this at the trial, but his neighbor was found guilty anyway. After the trial the judge took them aside and told them what technicalities to appeal on. He had been willing to accept Joe's evidence that the radar might have detected a following vehicle, but was unwilling to get that fact recorded as a precedent.
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