supermarketpaking tickets
Discussion
Sorry if this question has been posed bfere, but are supermarket parkit tickets enforcable?
Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
timskipper said:
That was a well written and very informative read. Thanks 
Streaky responded to a similar query a while ago and even provided a template letter to send to the supermarket questioning evidence etc – it was so good I saved for possible future use.
Lo and behold, get back to station car park to find a parking ticket on the car – not chuffed but I didn’t have time to review so I went home and then went back to car park next day (wifey parks car in morning, I pick up in evening) to check signage etc. sure enough there was bugger all so I dusted off Streaky’s letter, amended as required and sent to NCP – here it is
[quote]
I am in receipt of the above detailed parking charge notice which was attached to my vehicle on 11/10/07 whilst in a vehicle park located at City railway station.
The parking charge notice states that my vehicle was “Not parked correctly within the markings of the bay space” (see copy attached) and I am therefore liable for a £25 penalty. When the parking season ticket (see copy attached) was purchased, and therefore a contract with the owner or controller of the said parking facility was entered into, there was no notification, either in writing or verbally, of any parking restrictions in the vehicle park and/or a penalty charge process for failing to comply with any restrictions that may be in force.
You will be aware that the terms of any such contract must be set out in such a manner as to be obvious to anyone with whom you wished to make the contract. These terms must comply with all applicable contract law, such as the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977.
Having revisited the vehicle park, I have, after a search, found terms and conditions for a vehicle park posted to a lamppost by the entrance of the car park however, there is no clear indication that these are the terms and conditions of use for that particular area, they are not located near any of the ‘pay and display’ points for the vehicle park which could lead someone to reasonably assume that those conditions apply for that area. Again, there is no visible written guidance given, nor was any given verbally, as to restrictions and/or a penalty fine scheme when purchasing a parking season ticket from the ticket booth at the station itself.
Reading through the terms and conditions posted near the vehicle park, and the applicable railway bye-laws, as duplicated in part on the back of parking charge notice, I can see no guidance or restriction which states that a vehicle must be deposited in a marked, designated bay only. There is mention that vehicles must not be left in a position to cause hindrance or obstruction to other users in the vehicle park or the railway in general however my vehicle was parked on a raised kerb area in such a manner as to avoid that.
I therefore dispute the parking charge notice applied to my car on the following grounds;
1) The vehicle was not causing an obstruction or hindrance to other vehicle park users, access to the parking areas around the vehicle was not restricted. The parking charge notice issued by your own operative is clearly marked to show the reason for the penalty fine as being “Not parked correctly within the markings of the bay space” and not “Parked causing a obstruction or hindrance” which is an available choice on the parking charge notice.
2) There are no visible restrictions (written, via road markings or signage) or any other guidance given that parking is restricted for the marked bays only in the vehicle park itself or in the terms and conditions of usage of said vehicle park.
3) The contract terms under which the penalty fine has been applied were not made reasonably obvious at the time the contract was entered into, nor are they displayed in the vehicle park itself in such a manner that one can reasonably assume they apply to that vehicle park.
Should you wish to pursue this claim, please supply evidence that the person parking the vehicle would have been aware of the contractual restrictions in place and had the opportunity to read the contract terms or was given guidance (verbal or written) on them and the penalty fine scheme in operation. Such evidence must be, as a minimum:
• a detailed route and timings of the vehicle's travel into and through the vehicle park;
• a detailed route of the driver's passage out of the vehicle and the vehicle park - this and the evidence listed immediately above are to show that the driver had reasonable opportunity to see and read the contract terms;
• photographs of all relevant signage in situ in locus in quo at the time of the ‘offence’ so as to show that the signs were actually readable and the ‘offence’ detailed on the parking charge notice attached to my vehicle is specifically referred to and stipulated as an offence;
• written evidence from the station staff that issued the week long parking ticket confirming that they are aware of the parking restrictions and penalty fine scheme in operation in the vehicle park and that they made the purchaser of the ticket aware of those restrictions and terms and conditions (or that there were any) at the time of purchase.
I request your reply by return, either providing the evidence requested above or indicating simply your termination of this correspondence.
[/quote]
Two days ago they wrote and said in light of my letter and in interests of customer satisfaction they have cancelled the penalty charge. Great, and we’ve stopped using the car park now so they’re not getting the revenue anymore either! won't be long before double yellows and signage goes up though cos they are missing a money making trick
I’ll try and dig out the original letter but I think I might have over-written with this.
Thanks Streaky!
Cheers
Refresher
Lo and behold, get back to station car park to find a parking ticket on the car – not chuffed but I didn’t have time to review so I went home and then went back to car park next day (wifey parks car in morning, I pick up in evening) to check signage etc. sure enough there was bugger all so I dusted off Streaky’s letter, amended as required and sent to NCP – here it is
[quote]
I am in receipt of the above detailed parking charge notice which was attached to my vehicle on 11/10/07 whilst in a vehicle park located at City railway station.
The parking charge notice states that my vehicle was “Not parked correctly within the markings of the bay space” (see copy attached) and I am therefore liable for a £25 penalty. When the parking season ticket (see copy attached) was purchased, and therefore a contract with the owner or controller of the said parking facility was entered into, there was no notification, either in writing or verbally, of any parking restrictions in the vehicle park and/or a penalty charge process for failing to comply with any restrictions that may be in force.
You will be aware that the terms of any such contract must be set out in such a manner as to be obvious to anyone with whom you wished to make the contract. These terms must comply with all applicable contract law, such as the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977.
Having revisited the vehicle park, I have, after a search, found terms and conditions for a vehicle park posted to a lamppost by the entrance of the car park however, there is no clear indication that these are the terms and conditions of use for that particular area, they are not located near any of the ‘pay and display’ points for the vehicle park which could lead someone to reasonably assume that those conditions apply for that area. Again, there is no visible written guidance given, nor was any given verbally, as to restrictions and/or a penalty fine scheme when purchasing a parking season ticket from the ticket booth at the station itself.
Reading through the terms and conditions posted near the vehicle park, and the applicable railway bye-laws, as duplicated in part on the back of parking charge notice, I can see no guidance or restriction which states that a vehicle must be deposited in a marked, designated bay only. There is mention that vehicles must not be left in a position to cause hindrance or obstruction to other users in the vehicle park or the railway in general however my vehicle was parked on a raised kerb area in such a manner as to avoid that.
I therefore dispute the parking charge notice applied to my car on the following grounds;
1) The vehicle was not causing an obstruction or hindrance to other vehicle park users, access to the parking areas around the vehicle was not restricted. The parking charge notice issued by your own operative is clearly marked to show the reason for the penalty fine as being “Not parked correctly within the markings of the bay space” and not “Parked causing a obstruction or hindrance” which is an available choice on the parking charge notice.
2) There are no visible restrictions (written, via road markings or signage) or any other guidance given that parking is restricted for the marked bays only in the vehicle park itself or in the terms and conditions of usage of said vehicle park.
3) The contract terms under which the penalty fine has been applied were not made reasonably obvious at the time the contract was entered into, nor are they displayed in the vehicle park itself in such a manner that one can reasonably assume they apply to that vehicle park.
Should you wish to pursue this claim, please supply evidence that the person parking the vehicle would have been aware of the contractual restrictions in place and had the opportunity to read the contract terms or was given guidance (verbal or written) on them and the penalty fine scheme in operation. Such evidence must be, as a minimum:
• a detailed route and timings of the vehicle's travel into and through the vehicle park;
• a detailed route of the driver's passage out of the vehicle and the vehicle park - this and the evidence listed immediately above are to show that the driver had reasonable opportunity to see and read the contract terms;
• photographs of all relevant signage in situ in locus in quo at the time of the ‘offence’ so as to show that the signs were actually readable and the ‘offence’ detailed on the parking charge notice attached to my vehicle is specifically referred to and stipulated as an offence;
• written evidence from the station staff that issued the week long parking ticket confirming that they are aware of the parking restrictions and penalty fine scheme in operation in the vehicle park and that they made the purchaser of the ticket aware of those restrictions and terms and conditions (or that there were any) at the time of purchase.
I request your reply by return, either providing the evidence requested above or indicating simply your termination of this correspondence.
[/quote]
Two days ago they wrote and said in light of my letter and in interests of customer satisfaction they have cancelled the penalty charge. Great, and we’ve stopped using the car park now so they’re not getting the revenue anymore either! won't be long before double yellows and signage goes up though cos they are missing a money making trick
I’ll try and dig out the original letter but I think I might have over-written with this.
Thanks Streaky!
Cheers
Refresher
bimsb6 said:
very good ,i suspect they just lost the will to live after reading all that .
twas the general idea.........but the rambling letter did include valid points - there is no warning about penalties or guidance on how you incur them so frankly they can 
themselves if they think they can then fine people without warning them first... tw@tsandygo said:
Sorry if this question has been posed bfere, but are supermarket parkit tickets enforcable?
Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
While I understand the desire not to park close to other people's cars considering the level of skill and consideration often displayed in supermarket car parks. The store however did provide adequate parking yet you decide to park in the roadway. This might cause potential problems for HGVs or emergency vehicles. Especially if all and sundry decided to follow your example. So I'm not surprised you got a warning ticket. Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
colonel c said:
andygo said:
Sorry if this question has been posed bfere, but are supermarket parkit tickets enforcable?
Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
While I understand the desire not to park close to other people's cars considering the level of skill and consideration often displayed in supermarket car parks. The store however did provide adequate parking yet you decide to park in the roadway. This might cause potential problems for HGVs or emergency vehicles. Especially if all and sundry decided to follow your example. So I'm not surprised you got a warning ticket. Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
Anyway old bean, I wasn't asking about the morals of why I parked there, just the legalities. Thanks for your views anyway, they were very interesting.
Anyway, once you get a blinkin' great ding in your pride and joy, you might prefer to park in 'self preservation mode'. You have heard of defensive driving, I employ defensive parking! LOL
Edited by andygo on Saturday 24th November 18:48
colonel c said:
andygo said:
Sorry if this question has been posed bfere, but are supermarket parkit tickets enforcable?
Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
While I understand the desire not to park close to other people's cars considering the level of skill and consideration often displayed in supermarket car parks. The store however did provide adequate parking yet you decide to park in the roadway. This might cause potential problems for HGVs or emergency vehicles. Especially if all and sundry decided to follow your example. So I'm not surprised you got a warning ticket. Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
Mojocvh said:
colonel c said:
andygo said:
Sorry if this question has been posed bfere, but are supermarket parkit tickets enforcable?
Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
While I understand the desire not to park close to other people's cars considering the level of skill and consideration often displayed in supermarket car parks. The store however did provide adequate parking yet you decide to park in the roadway. This might cause potential problems for HGVs or emergency vehicles. Especially if all and sundry decided to follow your example. So I'm not surprised you got a warning ticket. Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
andygo said:
colonel c said:
andygo said:
Sorry if this question has been posed bfere, but are supermarket parkit tickets enforcable?
Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
While I understand the desire not to park close to other people's cars considering the level of skill and consideration often displayed in supermarket car parks. The store however did provide adequate parking yet you decide to park in the roadway. This might cause potential problems for HGVs or emergency vehicles. Especially if all and sundry decided to follow your example. So I'm not surprised you got a warning ticket. Parked today in my local Waitrose in a non marked place. No yellow lines, absolutely no parking notice at all, so fair game I thought.
I parked on the exit road which is a good 2 lanes wide, but out of the way. I wasn't causing any interruption to traffic flow as everyone just makes one lane on the way out. The reason I parked there was to avoid another instance of an old codger using my car as a doorstop, resulting in a £50 dent man repair.
Anyway as I was leaving I noticed a warning note on my widscreen telling me I had parked in an 'Innaproprate place' and next time I would get a parking ticket from the parking enforcemnt company.
As there were no parking restrictions posted, am I correct in assuming they are talking tosh?
Anyway old bean, I wasn't asking about the morals of why I parked there, just the legalities. Thanks for your views anyway, they were very interesting.
Anyway, once you get a blinkin' great ding in your pride and joy, you might prefer to park in 'self preservation mode'. You have heard of defensive driving, I employ defensive parking! LOL
I was merely looking at the situation from the stores point of view. You probably parked with a degree of thought and consideration. It's the other 10 idiots that decide to follow suit that will cause the problem.
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