Discussion
Vascar and Police Pilot are 2 similar speed detection devices.
They both rely on Time/Distance and can be used in a variety of different ways, however, you must be able to put the Target vehicle on at a specific point and also take them off at a specific point. It does not matter what they do in the meantime (or whether they are out of sight) as long as you have them at both the begining and the end of the check.
They both rely on Time/Distance and can be used in a variety of different ways, however, you must be able to put the Target vehicle on at a specific point and also take them off at a specific point. It does not matter what they do in the meantime (or whether they are out of sight) as long as you have them at both the begining and the end of the check.
zorro said:
One for the RPU dudes....
How close do you have to be to the target vehicle and must you have a clear line of sight ie no other vehicle between you and the target...
...or are these trade secrets
Don't get confused about how these operate. They do not require anything other than hand and eye co-ordination by the operator. As Tony says it is a time and distance computer which converts the information into speed. The information is fed into the computer by the operator by hand using toggle switches. The target is always the time, the patrol car records the distance between the two points chosen by the operator.
Once the target is in the computer, the common point is used for the record of the distance. The target is then switched off when the second fixed point is passed and the patrol vehicle then travels to that same point to turn off the distance switch. The distance is logged and the time for the target to pass those points is converted into a speed.
There are many different combinations in which Vascar can be used.
From behind (Oooer) the target.
Target travelling towards the patrol car, the distance already stored within the computer (Pre-fed distance)Used on motorways between tow bridges etc (white squares or dots in the centre of the lanes)
Target along side the patrol car and then allowed to get away, then caught up many miles further on.
Target from behind where operator inputs 'distance' first and then 'time' when the target reaches the point the distance was activated.
You can even get a reading of a target travelling in the oposite direction by clever use of the toggle switches
If you can be seen by the officers operating, you are in danger of VASCAR. There is no directed laser or sound wave emmitting so is undetectable by any speed detection equipment. We used to have a set of binoculars in the glove box for those extra far off troublesome cases that think they have good observation
>> Edited by madcop on Monday 14th July 11:49
Pretty hard b
d this VASCAR then 
I knew pretty how much it basically operated cos I had a demonstration recently, it was a short course...one-on-one tuition...cost £ 60 and some bonus points. What I wasn't aware of was how you can get a reading of a target moving in the opposite direction ?? care to elaborate MC ?
{We used to have a set of binoculars in the glove box for those extra far off troublesome cases that think they have good observation}
I'm not sure if this is a bite or not ??
My original question was really about what sort of distance can you be behind a target and still accurately place him on a start point....without binoculars !
d this VASCAR then I knew pretty how much it basically operated cos I had a demonstration recently, it was a short course...one-on-one tuition...cost £ 60 and some bonus points. What I wasn't aware of was how you can get a reading of a target moving in the opposite direction ?? care to elaborate MC ? {We used to have a set of binoculars in the glove box for those extra far off troublesome cases that think they have good observation}
I'm not sure if this is a bite or not ??
My original question was really about what sort of distance can you be behind a target and still accurately place him on a start point....without binoculars !
Zorro, I am not a cop, but have read most of Madcop's postings with great interest and concluded the following. If the vascar equipped BiB can see the car pass under a bridge (shadow confirms this) and then passes under another bridge, or other measurable point such as the police car, the distance is measureable, as is the time, therefore it does not matter whether the police car is travelling in the same or a different direction.
kevinday said:
Zorro, I am not a cop, but have read most of Madcop's postings with great interest and concluded the following. If the vascar equipped BiB can see the car pass under a bridge (shadow confirms this) and then passes under another bridge, or other measurable point such as the police car, the distance is measureable, as is the time, therefore it does not matter whether the police car is travelling in the same or a different direction.
Not far away with your reasoning Kevin.
A vehicle traveling towards the patrol car is seen to pass under a bridge (or past a dead cat at the side of the road etc). As the patrol car approaches from the opposite direction, the time switch is flicked into the on position, starting the clock.
As the target vehicle closes in and the two vehicles pass and are next to each other, the time switch is turned off and at the same time the distance switch is turned on (the point that the two cars cross is the second point in the check).
The operator in effect reverse the switches at the point the vehicles cross being the second common point in the check. The patrol car then drives very fast to the point chosen as the first input into the check (bridge or dead cat) where the distance switch is turned of. The patrol car is then turned around and the offender is pursued and stopped or the registration number is taken and an NIP is sent in the post. It is no more difficult than that but somewhat more difficult to try and explain
zorro said:
{We used to have a set of binoculars in the glove box for those extra far off troublesome cases that think they have good observation}
I'm not sure if this is a bite or not ??
No, it is not a bite. We did used to have binoculars in the vehicle to use on the faster roads.
Bear in mind though that in my car we never touched anything on VASCAR below 100mph on prefed checks
zorro said:
My original question was really about what sort of distance can you be behind a target and still accurately place him on a start point....without binoculars !
How far can you see on a good day?
This is often a question asked in court in relation to identification evidence. I remember hearing someone being questioned by a particualrly arrogant Barrister in crown court about ID rules for identification, being told that on the particular night in question, the officer could see to the moon! (got a wry smile from the judge too)
The answer is that if you can clearly see the vehicle and do not lose sight and therefore continuity of the offending vehilce, over a mile away on the right sections of road, especially if the offending vehicle does not change lanes in that distance. Also bear in mind that a vehicle travelling at over 100mph does not take very long to reach the patrol car even if it is over a mile away. The registration can only be read depending on the quality of the eyesight of the officer when it is at a readable distance of course
zorro said:
Pretty hard b
Had a similar demo myself, except that it cost me more, whole thing captured on video too!
In my case it was a prefed distance between two white 'squares' and the first was at least 2/3 - 3/4 of a mile from the camera - no binoculars required as zoom lens was used from a very 'discrete' position by a clear straight road - which I doubt has seen many accidents but would certainly see much speeding.
Still it was the last day of the month and maybe quotas were down
Hasn't VASCAR been discredited in some countries because the operator can essentially point it at anyone to take the photo then do the timing separately? There is therefore no guarantee that the car/dead cat in the picture is the one that has been timed. I'm sure I read somewhere that courts in one country (Canada?) threw out a whole load of cases because of this.
(Please understand, I'm not suggesting UK police would do such a thing)
(Please understand, I'm not suggesting UK police would do such a thing)
VASCAR never lies... like Tony Blair!
Travelling along the M5 in my Chimaera, clear road sunny evening, 80-85 mph, round the bend, under bridge, see a marked car on hard shoulder. Just eased off the power and sailed past him at 65-70. Maintained this speed, passed under next bridge and seconds later they're after me!
Get into the car and see 99.1 on the display. I assumed this was a radio frequency... until they tell me this was my AVERAGE SPEED!!!! I try and reason with them, telling them I knew I was doing around 80 and I was prepared to take the FPN. No way they say. Not wanting to go to court I say what about the 10% error margin? They say that it would only bring it down to 90.09mph so it has to go to court. To cut a long story short I ended up with 6 points and a big fine.
All because they pressed the button too early!
B******s!
>> Edited by gugne on Thursday 17th July 10:01
Travelling along the M5 in my Chimaera, clear road sunny evening, 80-85 mph, round the bend, under bridge, see a marked car on hard shoulder. Just eased off the power and sailed past him at 65-70. Maintained this speed, passed under next bridge and seconds later they're after me!
Get into the car and see 99.1 on the display. I assumed this was a radio frequency... until they tell me this was my AVERAGE SPEED!!!! I try and reason with them, telling them I knew I was doing around 80 and I was prepared to take the FPN. No way they say. Not wanting to go to court I say what about the 10% error margin? They say that it would only bring it down to 90.09mph so it has to go to court. To cut a long story short I ended up with 6 points and a big fine.
All because they pressed the button too early!
B******s!
>> Edited by gugne on Thursday 17th July 10:01
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