Would this be a defence?
Discussion
Bought a Jaguar based Kougar yesterday with a high compression 3.8 engine.
The car has hardly been used (2000 miles since 1966) and I've found that the speedo takes an eternity to register the correct speed when either accelerating or slowing down.
I am getting this fixed but, meantime, have to depend on the speed of other traffic to try and gauge my speed.
If I get it wrong in the meantime, have I any defence that would be considered?
>>> Edited by Davel on Thursday 17th July 12:56
The car has hardly been used (2000 miles since 1966) and I've found that the speedo takes an eternity to register the correct speed when either accelerating or slowing down.
I am getting this fixed but, meantime, have to depend on the speed of other traffic to try and gauge my speed.
If I get it wrong in the meantime, have I any defence that would be considered?
>>> Edited by Davel on Thursday 17th July 12:56
Davel said:
Didn't know till I was driving back up from Oxford on Wednesday and I'm now trying to find either a replacement speedo or get it fixed somewhere.
I know that ignorance is no excuse but I'm trying to get it fixed but want to continue to use the car when the weather's ok.
I'm afraid there is no defence against speeding. You were or you weren't, or a new condition, you were but didn't sign the NIP.
Any which way, best be ultra careful.
Nope. A mate of mine bought a used Fiat Coupe Turbo, and discovered that the speedo wouldn't read past 74mph.
He discovered this because the police told him how fast he was going.
Went to court. Presented the recipt confirming he'd owned the car for 3 days, and the recipt showing the fault had been recitified the following day.
Was banned for 3 weeks and fined a lot of money.
For 102 on an empty M4....
He discovered this because the police told him how fast he was going.
Went to court. Presented the recipt confirming he'd owned the car for 3 days, and the recipt showing the fault had been recitified the following day.
Was banned for 3 weeks and fined a lot of money.
For 102 on an empty M4....
I assume the Kougar has a reasoably accurate rev-counter? If so, use this to calculate your speed. When on a motorway maintain a set speed or rpms, time yourself past the mile markers and get your speed accurately from calculation. Convert this to mph per 1,000 rpm and Bob's your Uncle (Well he may be I guess 
).
).Some years ago I bought a new BMW 7 Series when electronic speedos were just coming in. I got recorded through an old type Truvelo in Northampton at 47 in a 30. A couple of days later I noticed a lag in the speedo on acceleration when it would under-read and on decelleration when it would over-read. I reported this to the BMW dealer who checked it and confirmed, in writing, an error of approximately 15 mph.
When I went to court my brief used this, with a letter from the dealer and a letter of confirmation and apology from BMW UK, as mitigation after I pleaded guilty and I was fined a minimal amount and got no points. The magistrate commented that even with luxury cars dealers couldn't seem to be trusted to test cars properly before delivering them to customers, thus mitigation accepted and no points. A good magistrate and a good result.
When I went to court my brief used this, with a letter from the dealer and a letter of confirmation and apology from BMW UK, as mitigation after I pleaded guilty and I was fined a minimal amount and got no points. The magistrate commented that even with luxury cars dealers couldn't seem to be trusted to test cars properly before delivering them to customers, thus mitigation accepted and no points. A good magistrate and a good result.
plotloss said:
Dont think so, its your responsibility to ensure that the speedo works correctly.
Agree with Plotloss. If your car's not roadworthy, it's not legal to drive it on a public road. I strongly suspect that a defective speedo counts as unroadworthy. In which case you could open yourself up for more than the speeding penalty!
Otherwise, every Max boy out there would be fiddling with their speedo to get away with it.
Sorry this isn't good news! At least you're getting the speedo sorted.
Huge
Since a working speedometer is not even a requirement for an MOT then the legality of driving the car in question down the road is of no issue....
However knowing how fast you're going is your responsibility.
I've had this issue with our rally car which has an after market speedo fitted - how do you know its working properly.
I ended up timing my self down a stretch of motorway late at night when it was quiet.
You need to count the posts by the hard shoulder they are spaced at 100 metre intervals - 16 of them is pretty much bang on a mile (0.996) - at 60 mph it should take you exactly 1 minute - simple as that
As for your problem with it not registering soon enough then I guess a bit of time practising should soon alert you to how long it takes to reach the correct speed - just hold a constant rpm and watch the speedo catch up.
Till you get it fixed I'd certainly take it easy and err on the side of caution - even with the relevant recepts and letters I doubt this would get you off a fine/points although it might reduce a penalty if stopped by an officer. Still, if you explain that you have a problem with the speedo he might take the view that since you are aware of the problem you should be driving with this in mind.
cheers
Ex
However knowing how fast you're going is your responsibility.
I've had this issue with our rally car which has an after market speedo fitted - how do you know its working properly.
I ended up timing my self down a stretch of motorway late at night when it was quiet.
You need to count the posts by the hard shoulder they are spaced at 100 metre intervals - 16 of them is pretty much bang on a mile (0.996) - at 60 mph it should take you exactly 1 minute - simple as that
As for your problem with it not registering soon enough then I guess a bit of time practising should soon alert you to how long it takes to reach the correct speed - just hold a constant rpm and watch the speedo catch up.
Till you get it fixed I'd certainly take it easy and err on the side of caution - even with the relevant recepts and letters I doubt this would get you off a fine/points although it might reduce a penalty if stopped by an officer. Still, if you explain that you have a problem with the speedo he might take the view that since you are aware of the problem you should be driving with this in mind.
cheers
Ex
A working speedo may not be tested in the MOT but it still is a legal requirement from the construction and use regs to have a working and accurate speedo. I believe a discrepency of 10 percent is allowed but this is only allowed in respect of over reading. No under reading is allowed at all. As has been pointed out already it may work in mitigation but the only legal defences for speeding are to prove it wasn't you, to prove that you were forced to speed for example in order to save your own life or that of another, or to prove that the method of measurement was invalid. There are no other defences that I know of except for the obscure loopholes we hear about in here on a redular basis. How many of these actually work?
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