Why do they wait till Friday to send letters!

[Rich_W]

Hi all.

Just got a letter from Surrey Police stating that on X day at X time I am alleged to have commited "Driving without reasonable consideration for other persons using the road" also tagged on another page is "Dangerous driving" and "without due care and attention"

I reckon I know what this is for. I'd like to make clear that I have not hit anybody. I have not caused anybody to stop or swerve. There were no pedestrians waiting to cross the road, and no cyclists either. I did not break the speed limit in a built up area either. I know what I have done is "suspect/illegal" probably the sort of thing the police would stop you for though. (No, there were no marked cars in the area either) I wasnt on the phone either.

However, theres no mention in the letter as to the specifics of the offence, they are just asking me to identify the driver at this stage.

Sooo. Should I fill it in to ID the driver and sign it or should I see a Solicitor first. I have always had a clean licence from 1998 till now. I always thought Id get a speeding fine one day but this has thrown me a bit.

Thanks in Advance

Edited by Rich_W on Friday 1st February 20:36

[ChrisKKK]

Any action you take from now on will prejudice you so think very carefully.

A friend of mine insists he will only ever respond to a summons to court - thats one view.

Because of the obscure nature of the offences a solicitor may help un-ravel it.

There are options to weigh up so have a good think about it

[10 Pence Short]

What would happen if you failed to notify? Could you get the 6 points without having to attend the court hearing?

[FishFace]

If you don't reply you're very likely to be looking at 6 points.

[splitter / judas]

You must reply and provide details of the driver otherwise points will go onto your licence for failing to nominate. If a summons is ever issued then you can see a solicitor.

[10 Pence Short]

Certainly sounds like an intriguing case.

ETA, I would wait to see what happens after notifying before seeking the help of a solicitor.

Edited by 10 Pence Short on Friday 1st February 21:12

[Rich_W]

"Hypothetically" If I took the 6 points for failure to ID, is that the matter done and dusted? TBH its on the road I commute on every single day. So if they were inclcined they could easily find me.

At the back of my mind is that I dont want to antagonise the Police as should this go to court (Sadly I think thats likely) I dont want that to go against me.


EDIT
splitter / judas

Jumping to the summons will that likely have the specific details?

Edited by Rich_W on Friday 1st February 21:12

[10 Pence Short]

Rich_W said:

"Hypothetically" If I took the 6 points for failure to ID, is that the matter done and dusted? TBH its on the road I commute on every single day. So if they were inclcined they could easily find me.

At the back of my mind is that I dont want to antagonise the Police as should this go to court (Sadly I think thats likely) I dont want that to go against me.

That's why I asked about the failure to notify, as it might be that you need not attend and that would be the end of the matter, albeit with 6 points and a hefty fine. Having said that, if you know who was driving, I'm sure that'd be a case of Perverting the Course of Justice which would land you a spell at Her Majesty's should you be found out.

If you want to discuss it in private (I've been through a dangerous driving situation myself last year) you're always welcome to email me through my profile.

[odyssey2200]

So what did you do that you think this might be for?

Other that the crime of being a Motorist

[10 Pence Short]

Rich_W said:

Jumping to the summons will that likely have the specific details?

How serious was the incident? The police may choose to get you to the station and interview you.

If they don't and it gets to a summons, the summons itself won't contain that much detail. Your solicitor would apply for disclosure of the evidence against you which should get to you before any plea.

[Rich_W]

10 Pence

You have email.

[ChrisKKK]

Once you are identified, your ability to defend yourself successfully is a function of what they have against you, e.g. how many police / witnesses we are talking,what you actually did, in other words... once identified whatever you have done may be too difficult to defend against and you may loose your licence... so hence think it through.

The standard advise (especially from the Police) is always to respond to the NIP

[FishFace]

10 Pence Short said:

Having said that, if you know who was driving, I'm sure that'd be a case of Perverting the Course of Justice which would land you a spell at Her Majesty's should you be found out.

It's not. You can't pervert the course of justice through an omission. It has to be a positive act.

Rich_W said:

"Hypothetically" If I took the 6 points for failure to ID, is that the matter done and dusted?

Possibly. But be aware there may be other ways of identifying you which haven't come to light. CCTV etc.

[10 Pence Short]

FishFace said:

10 Pence Short said:

Having said that, if you know who was driving, I'm sure that'd be a case of Perverting the Course of Justice which would land you a spell at Her Majesty's should you be found out.

It's not. You can't pervert the course of justice through an omission. It has to be a positive act.

Imagine there was CCTV clearly identifying the driver, and the driver had declared on the 172 that they didn't know who was driving. How would that be perceived?

Couldn't it be argued that not identifying the driver when you know it was you is a positive act?

[esselte]

10 Pence Short said:

FishFace said:

10 Pence Short said:

Having said that, if you know who was driving, I'm sure that'd be a case of Perverting the Course of Justice which would land you a spell at Her Majesty's should you be found out.

It's not. You can't pervert the course of justice through an omission. It has to be a positive act.

Imagine there was CCTV clearly identifying the driver, and the driver had declared on the 172 that they didn't know who was driving. How would that be perceived?

Couldn't it be argued that not identifying the driver when you know it was you is a positive act?

CCTV evidence can show who was driving but it wouldn't mean the OP knew who was driving at the pertinent time...eg 2or 3 people sharing the driving on a long trip..not forced to know who was driving at any particular time...possibly not relevant in this instance but you get my drift...

[streaky]

I'd like to applaud the Royal Mail for delivering a letter the day it was posted ... at least according to the OP.

Unless, of course, the letter took a multiple of seven days to arrive ... which would not be atypical .

Streaky

[DucatiGary]

im actualy loving the way dan has worked this all out.

once a honest but made a mistake and didnt try and swerve the law kinda guy now a fully hardened, ive learnt to screw the system that screws us type o guy.

nice one, you've woke up.

[FishFace]

10 Pence Short said:

FishFace said:

10 Pence Short said:

Having said that, if you know who was driving, I'm sure that'd be a case of Perverting the Course of Justice which would land you a spell at Her Majesty's should you be found out.

It's not. You can't pervert the course of justice through an omission. It has to be a positive act.

Imagine there was CCTV clearly identifying the driver, and the driver had declared on the 172 that they didn't know who was driving. How would that be perceived?

Couldn't it be argued that not identifying the driver when you know it was you is a positive act?

It could indeed. The prosecution could look at PCJ in these circumstances, as the defendant has done a positive act. It'd be highly unlikely though as it'd be extremely hard to prove.

How to avoid any change of PCJ all together? Commit the same offence through an omission i.e. don't bother filling / returning the form.


The above should be considered very carefully and legal advice should be sort. I'm not advocating the above, merely pointing out legal differences. Of course, if you do declare and get interviewed / investigated there may well not be enough evidence for any prosecution. Only the OP knows what happened so will have to make that judgment call.