Loss of respect??? Once upon a time ...
Discussion
Whilst walking home from a Christmas party in December 2000 I was assaulted by some drunken idiot(I never did manage to find out who, although what I actually did to find out was probably in breach of every section of the Data Protection Act!) The police came round, took a statement, went away, and a few days later said they were unable to take the matter any further. They did, however, offer me "counselling" ....
On New Years morning 2001 I was burgled. By an inept burglar, I accept - he nicked a £10 note and a few cassette tapes (probably still pi$$ed on his way home from New Year revelries and had a "good idea" as he passed our house). The police came, SOCO came and, a few days later, I got a letter saying no further action would be taken.
One evening a couple of weeks later (whilst, coincidentally, my car was away for repair, and probably why it happened), the doorbell rang. I answered it (with the dogs) and found a dozen or so teenage lads in the garden, two of whom were trying to get through the side gate. The mental defective with the most brain cells of the bunch (that is, the one who actually knew how a doorbell worked ....) stared blankly at me whilst I asked: "Yes, what do you want" etc, and the dogs barked and growled. Eventually, the two Neanderthals who were trying to open a locked side gate finally realised that they needed cutting equipment if they were going to get anywhere, and meekly walked back up the side of the garage and out on to the pavement. The rest followed. I left it for a couple of minutes, then went out in the wife's car, spotted them outside the local Co-op, and rang the police. The response I got was: "Well, Sir, what do you think we can do about it? They've committed no offence."
So, the morale of this story is: "Well Sir, dreadfully sorry you got a pasting from somebody but, well, you know how it is, $hit happens sometimes, doesn't it." Or; "Well Sir, being burgled is part and parcel of everyday life these days - you can't really expect the police to do anything about it, can you." Or, "So, Sir, you say you're being harassed, but we cant even send a car round to "have a word" with the bunch of idiots - you see, Sir, they've committed no offence."
"Oh, Sir, and by the way, if we ever catch you doing 83 in a 70 limit, on a Saturday morning, on a dual carriageway, in light traffic, on a day with perfect visibility - and at the bottom of a hill, we'll fcuking nick you, you criminal reprobate ......"
IMHO this is how the system, and not just the police, is going to alienate a lot of ordinary people in a very short space of time, and cause a massive disrespect for the law and its enforcers, if this fcuking madness goes on much longer.
Any comments, anybody .....
>>> Edited by rs1952 on Friday 25th July 23:56
On New Years morning 2001 I was burgled. By an inept burglar, I accept - he nicked a £10 note and a few cassette tapes (probably still pi$$ed on his way home from New Year revelries and had a "good idea" as he passed our house). The police came, SOCO came and, a few days later, I got a letter saying no further action would be taken.
One evening a couple of weeks later (whilst, coincidentally, my car was away for repair, and probably why it happened), the doorbell rang. I answered it (with the dogs) and found a dozen or so teenage lads in the garden, two of whom were trying to get through the side gate. The mental defective with the most brain cells of the bunch (that is, the one who actually knew how a doorbell worked ....) stared blankly at me whilst I asked: "Yes, what do you want" etc, and the dogs barked and growled. Eventually, the two Neanderthals who were trying to open a locked side gate finally realised that they needed cutting equipment if they were going to get anywhere, and meekly walked back up the side of the garage and out on to the pavement. The rest followed. I left it for a couple of minutes, then went out in the wife's car, spotted them outside the local Co-op, and rang the police. The response I got was: "Well, Sir, what do you think we can do about it? They've committed no offence."
So, the morale of this story is: "Well Sir, dreadfully sorry you got a pasting from somebody but, well, you know how it is, $hit happens sometimes, doesn't it." Or; "Well Sir, being burgled is part and parcel of everyday life these days - you can't really expect the police to do anything about it, can you." Or, "So, Sir, you say you're being harassed, but we cant even send a car round to "have a word" with the bunch of idiots - you see, Sir, they've committed no offence."
"Oh, Sir, and by the way, if we ever catch you doing 83 in a 70 limit, on a Saturday morning, on a dual carriageway, in light traffic, on a day with perfect visibility - and at the bottom of a hill, we'll fcuking nick you, you criminal reprobate ......"
IMHO this is how the system, and not just the police, is going to alienate a lot of ordinary people in a very short space of time, and cause a massive disrespect for the law and its enforcers, if this fcuking madness goes on much longer.
Any comments, anybody .....
>>> Edited by rs1952 on Friday 25th July 23:56
Here Here. well said, I agree with every word you say but the average plod on the street just can't see it.Ask a hundred decent law abiding people what crimes they would like the police to pursue and i bet speeding would hardly ever be mentioned.drivers who get snapped doing a few miles an hour over the limit just get irate when they see all the crime around them but with very little action by the police.
"I see sir, these young lads came around to your house and you say they were acting 'menacing', did they actually do any harm?
oh, I see, they frightened your wife, I see, and they said they would pile your head in and they said in a 'menacing' way that unless you gave them your car keys, your child and your dog they would tie you and your family up in your house and set light to it
And you thumped the poor chap at the front!! come along now sir, It's going to be a long time inside for you sir....",
"now lads calm down and don't frighten the residents again or I'll have to send you on holiday"
I don't blame the Police but that is how it comes across.
oh, I see, they frightened your wife, I see, and they said they would pile your head in and they said in a 'menacing' way that unless you gave them your car keys, your child and your dog they would tie you and your family up in your house and set light to it
And you thumped the poor chap at the front!! come along now sir, It's going to be a long time inside for you sir....",
"now lads calm down and don't frighten the residents again or I'll have to send you on holiday"
I don't blame the Police but that is how it comes across.
gopher said:
"I see sir, these young lads came around to your house and you say they were acting 'menacing', did they actually do any harm?
oh, I see, they frightened your wife, I see, and they said they would pile your head in and they said in a 'menacing' way that unless you gave them your car keys, your child and your dog they would tie you and your family up in your house and set light to it
And you thumped the poor chap at the front!! come along now sir, It's going to be a long time inside for you sir....",
"now lads calm down and don't frighten the residents again or I'll have to send you on holiday"
I don't blame the Police but that is how it comes across.
I bet you were the one who rung the door bell !
It seems that nowadays the government have changed priorities. They think that by hitting motorists is a quick and easy way to hit prosecution targets and revenue targets. And to justify this persicution they need to make speeding look like a crime. Hence all the adverts on telly etc.
Speeding is something that probably every member of the public witnesses so they manufacture this "offence" to become anti social.
But in doing this they have taken the emphasis from real crime and put it onto us drivers/ riders. Not everyone will come accross a breakin - or a beeting in their lifetime so people although aware of the situation do not notice the effects or the increase in these crimes.
But by publicly showing distorted effects of speed and with high publicity convictions they try to justify their actions. How many times do we see in the papers etc about motorists speeding. and how many do we see regarding the anti social louts that make peoples lives a misery with violence and harassment as in your case????
The reasoning is - motorists are easy targets and usually admit their offences and pay their fines. Burgalars and the like will nearly always plead not guilty and rarely pay any fines. Hence criminalise motorists earn easy money. Nick a thief and hours of paperwork and loadsa money for no return.
Perhaps the government have turned convictions into a business or money making scam????
But i bet if people started to defend theirselves and property the emphasis will shift from the easy target to the real target!. (not that im advocating vigalanties here or nowt!!)
Just my opinion but it does p155 me off when this happends, and the police in fareness are under the control of the government and the gov's rules. and who knows whats said behind closed doors between ministers and Chief constables!!.
Im probably goin to get slated but as i say its my opinion!!
Be safe.
Gareth
Speeding is something that probably every member of the public witnesses so they manufacture this "offence" to become anti social.
But in doing this they have taken the emphasis from real crime and put it onto us drivers/ riders. Not everyone will come accross a breakin - or a beeting in their lifetime so people although aware of the situation do not notice the effects or the increase in these crimes.
But by publicly showing distorted effects of speed and with high publicity convictions they try to justify their actions. How many times do we see in the papers etc about motorists speeding. and how many do we see regarding the anti social louts that make peoples lives a misery with violence and harassment as in your case????
The reasoning is - motorists are easy targets and usually admit their offences and pay their fines. Burgalars and the like will nearly always plead not guilty and rarely pay any fines. Hence criminalise motorists earn easy money. Nick a thief and hours of paperwork and loadsa money for no return.
Perhaps the government have turned convictions into a business or money making scam????
But i bet if people started to defend theirselves and property the emphasis will shift from the easy target to the real target!. (not that im advocating vigalanties here or nowt!!)
Just my opinion but it does p155 me off when this happends, and the police in fareness are under the control of the government and the gov's rules. and who knows whats said behind closed doors between ministers and Chief constables!!.
Im probably goin to get slated but as i say its my opinion!!
Be safe.
Gareth
[quote]It seems that nowadays the government have changed priorities. They think that by hitting motorists is a quick and easy way to hit prosecution targets and revenue targets. And to justify this persicution they need to make speeding look like a crime. Hence all the adverts on telly etc.
Speeding is something that probably every member of the public witnesses so they manufacture this "offence" to become anti social.
But in doing this they have taken the emphasis from real crime and put it onto us drivers/ riders. Not everyone will come accross a breakin - or a beeting in their lifetime so people although aware of the situation do not notice the effects or the increase in these crimes.
But by publicly showing distorted effects of speed and with high publicity convictions they try to justify their actions. How many times do we see in the papers etc about motorists speeding. and how many do we see regarding the anti social louts that make peoples lives a misery with violence and harassment as in your case????
The reasoning is - motorists are easy targets and usually admit their offences and pay their fines. Burgalars and the like will nearly always plead not guilty and rarely pay any fines. Hence criminalise motorists earn easy money. Nick a thief and hours of paperwork and loadsa money for no return.
Perhaps the government have turned convictions into a business or money making scam????
But i bet if people started to defend theirselves and property the emphasis will shift from the easy target to the real target!. (not that im advocating vigalanties here or nowt!!)
Just my opinion but it does p155 me off when this happends, and the police in fareness are under the control of the government and the gov's rules. and who knows whats said behind closed doors between ministers and Chief constables!!.
Im probably goin to get slated but as i say its my opinion!!
Be safe.
Gareth
[/quote]
slated? seems pretty much on the money to me
>> Edited by Apache on Friday 25th July 22:47
Speeding is something that probably every member of the public witnesses so they manufacture this "offence" to become anti social.
But in doing this they have taken the emphasis from real crime and put it onto us drivers/ riders. Not everyone will come accross a breakin - or a beeting in their lifetime so people although aware of the situation do not notice the effects or the increase in these crimes.
But by publicly showing distorted effects of speed and with high publicity convictions they try to justify their actions. How many times do we see in the papers etc about motorists speeding. and how many do we see regarding the anti social louts that make peoples lives a misery with violence and harassment as in your case????
The reasoning is - motorists are easy targets and usually admit their offences and pay their fines. Burgalars and the like will nearly always plead not guilty and rarely pay any fines. Hence criminalise motorists earn easy money. Nick a thief and hours of paperwork and loadsa money for no return.
Perhaps the government have turned convictions into a business or money making scam????
But i bet if people started to defend theirselves and property the emphasis will shift from the easy target to the real target!. (not that im advocating vigalanties here or nowt!!)
Just my opinion but it does p155 me off when this happends, and the police in fareness are under the control of the government and the gov's rules. and who knows whats said behind closed doors between ministers and Chief constables!!.
Im probably goin to get slated but as i say its my opinion!!
Be safe.
Gareth
[/quote]
slated? seems pretty much on the money to me
>> Edited by Apache on Friday 25th July 22:47
renault-lacuna said:
Here Here. well said, I agree with every word you say but the average plod on the street just can't see it.Ask a hundred decent law abiding people what crimes they would like the police to pursue and i bet speeding would hardly ever be mentioned.drivers who get snapped doing a few miles an hour over the limit just get irate when they see all the crime around them but with very little action by the police.
Hi Renault.
I have read with interest your comments and views relating to Policing and especially to those you made to *999* in another thread.
This leads me to to conclude (In Renault like logic) that there are one or two public who are trying to do a good job by being decent people but the majority are just selfish self obsessed, self opinioniated, uninformed to55ers. Get my drift Renault
madcop said:
Here Here. well said, I agree with every word you say but the average plod on the street just can't see it.Ask a hundred decent law abiding people what crimes they would like the police to pursue and i bet speeding would hardly ever be mentioned.drivers who get snapped doing a few miles an hour over the limit just get irate when they see all the crime around them but with very little action by the police.
Hi Renault.
I have read with interest your comments and views relating to Policing and especially to those you made to *999* in another thread.
This leads me to to conclude (In Renault like logic) that there are one or two public who are trying to do a good job by being decent people but the majority are just selfish self obsessed, self opinioniated, uninformed to55ers. Get my drift Renault
Hey look everybody,
's taken a chill pill 
. Are we back on this topic again?
I thought it was (kind of) settled before in the fact that the police are generally a good bunch, trying to do right but hindered by legislation
I know a few officers and a few of my friends are in the processes of becoming BIBs. All of them are stand-up characters who I have nothing but respect for. They all agree that the law can stop them doing what they signed up to do, but have no control over that.
I have met little-shit coppers on a power trip before, we all have, but to generalise all police in one negative view is a little short-sighted!
Anyway, back on topic - sorry about what happened mate, I think you should be allowed to give the kids a good slap and have it overlooked just like the incident itself
Edited because my spalleng is crap
>> Edited by dick dastardly on Saturday 26th July 09:32
I thought it was (kind of) settled before in the fact that the police are generally a good bunch, trying to do right but hindered by legislation
I know a few officers and a few of my friends are in the processes of becoming BIBs. All of them are stand-up characters who I have nothing but respect for. They all agree that the law can stop them doing what they signed up to do, but have no control over that.
I have met little-shit coppers on a power trip before, we all have, but to generalise all police in one negative view is a little short-sighted!
Anyway, back on topic - sorry about what happened mate, I think you should be allowed to give the kids a good slap and have it overlooked just like the incident itself
Edited because my spalleng is crap
>> Edited by dick dastardly on Saturday 26th July 09:32
hi Deltaf
Have taken a little time out.
Too many posts asking the same sorts of questions that have been asked and answered many times before.
Also am in the middle of a 2 week Advanced refresher driving course so am away form home and my PC. There is internet access at the driving school but the terminal is in the instructors ofice which is locked after 5.30 p.m.
Have taken a little time out.
Too many posts asking the same sorts of questions that have been asked and answered many times before.
Also am in the middle of a 2 week Advanced refresher driving course so am away form home and my PC. There is internet access at the driving school but the terminal is in the instructors ofice which is locked after 5.30 p.m.
Hi MC, there seems to be a lot of fresh PHers around and the nature of the beast dictates the type of questions that get asked, mebbe we should have a FAQ section.
Son is still waiting to hear about further action after the ID parade cancellation but imminent replacement Pug (with tracker) has cheered him up
cheers Pete
Son is still waiting to hear about further action after the ID parade cancellation but imminent replacement Pug (with tracker) has cheered him up
cheers Pete
Apache said:
Hi MC, there seems to be a lot of fresh PHers around and the nature of the beast dictates the type of questions that get asked, mebbe we should have a FAQ section.
Son is still waiting to hear about further action after the ID parade cancellation but imminent replacement Pug (with tracker) has cheered him up
cheers Pete
Hi Pete.
Glad things are moving in the right direction for him (and you). Sorry I didn't get to find the link you e-mailed me. I am not literate enough to decode these url type codes into something material.
Oh no, not another Daily Mail report telling of police failure to make an impact on the number of burglaries solved, whilst £thousands are raked in from speeding motorists.
According to the paper, North Wales Police issued 4,200 speeding tickets in one month, taking £250,000 out of motorist’s pockets, whilst just 18 of 296 burglaries were solved in April.
Could it be that the 4,200 speeding drivers have taken their bat and ball home when it comes to assisting the police, contributing in some measure to these dreadful burglary detection figures?
At the risk of being labelled a “selfish, self obsessed, self opinionated, uninformed to55er” by people on here who clearly don’t like to hear the truth – it must be said that the police appear to have lost the plot. It’s no good blaming someone else for the abysmal figures when the BiB are directly charged with the duty of catching burglars. If the local council fails to grit the road do we go and blame the local butcher? Of course not.
Since the eighties, the demand for UK industry to achieve high efficiencies, with a drastically reduced workforce, has largely been met. Why then are some police forces marching in the opposite direction whilst whinging about a lack of manpower. They clearly have plenty of available resources to man the three talivans in my area, and maintain the myriad of gatsos. Time for a shift of these resources into proper crime fighting duties? I’m a realist who knows it isn’t going to happen.
I had reason to call my local constabulary a few weeks ago to complain about kids riding furiously on a local footpath, endangering the safety of walkers, on what was clearly a stolen moped. After being on hold on the non-emergency number for no less than eight minutes, my complaint was met with a cool, unbelieving response and an answer telling me that they had few officers available to deal with the matter. Goodbye. Events such as this and the one below chip away at the word respect.
I’ve lost count of the people who have personally related the story of their brush with the law – the majority of whom were NIP’d for venturing 6-7mph over the limit. Before the incident, most would have been more than happy to assist the police. Unfortunately for the BiB, they assure me their assistance is now withdrawn.
alienated
According to the paper, North Wales Police issued 4,200 speeding tickets in one month, taking £250,000 out of motorist’s pockets, whilst just 18 of 296 burglaries were solved in April.
Could it be that the 4,200 speeding drivers have taken their bat and ball home when it comes to assisting the police, contributing in some measure to these dreadful burglary detection figures?
At the risk of being labelled a “selfish, self obsessed, self opinionated, uninformed to55er” by people on here who clearly don’t like to hear the truth – it must be said that the police appear to have lost the plot. It’s no good blaming someone else for the abysmal figures when the BiB are directly charged with the duty of catching burglars. If the local council fails to grit the road do we go and blame the local butcher? Of course not.
Since the eighties, the demand for UK industry to achieve high efficiencies, with a drastically reduced workforce, has largely been met. Why then are some police forces marching in the opposite direction whilst whinging about a lack of manpower. They clearly have plenty of available resources to man the three talivans in my area, and maintain the myriad of gatsos. Time for a shift of these resources into proper crime fighting duties? I’m a realist who knows it isn’t going to happen.
I had reason to call my local constabulary a few weeks ago to complain about kids riding furiously on a local footpath, endangering the safety of walkers, on what was clearly a stolen moped. After being on hold on the non-emergency number for no less than eight minutes, my complaint was met with a cool, unbelieving response and an answer telling me that they had few officers available to deal with the matter. Goodbye. Events such as this and the one below chip away at the word respect.
I’ve lost count of the people who have personally related the story of their brush with the law – the majority of whom were NIP’d for venturing 6-7mph over the limit. Before the incident, most would have been more than happy to assist the police. Unfortunately for the BiB, they assure me their assistance is now withdrawn.
alienated
Good first post alienated. One of my friends is a volunteer fireman and he is surprised by how many squad cars turn up at a RTA with a couple of BiB on board, I think the resources are there, they just need diverting
(there was an item on TV last night describing how full the Police Colleges currently are)
(there was an item on TV last night describing how full the Police Colleges currently are)
madcop said:
Here Here. well said, I agree with every word you say but the average plod on the street just can't see it.Ask a hundred decent law abiding people what crimes they would like the police to pursue and i bet speeding would hardly ever be mentioned.drivers who get snapped doing a few miles an hour over the limit just get irate when they see all the crime around them but with very little action by the police.
Hi Renault.
I have read with interest your comments and views relating to Policing and especially to those you made to *999* in another thread.
This leads me to to conclude (In Renault like logic) that there are one or two public who are trying to do a good job by being decent people but the majority are just selfish self obsessed, self opinioniated, uninformed to55ers. Get my drift Renault
can't believe that reply above.selfish self obsessed, self opinioniated, uninformed to55ers. I repeat my charge again:Police quite content to ignore the main crime most decent people deplore, anti-social behaviour,burgalry etc etc.Its probably too strong to say they ignore it but the general public do percieve that these offences are not pursued whereas speeding is and that's probably down to it being an easy target!
I got 17 counts of unsolved car crime. my cars have been stolen, set on fire etc, have been attacked on my door setup, the plod have never done anything, but when I did 38 in a 30 only 50m from the 40 sign they had me processd in less than a week. we dont bother reporting it anymore. I notice Superintendant Olney of the Themes Valley Police Roads policing headquaters has written into their policy that accident without injury are no longer attended and proves they want to irnore certian offences to save money.
Rightly or wrongly I think it has to be said pople are getting alienated.
I do not blame the BIB who in the majority are decent people. but It only takes one bad one to change your Attitude.
I can add to the list of bad experiences with the BIB but I wont bother.
I have noticed in recent years the attitude of most Police has improved a great deal!!!
Unfortunalety we all remember the times when we needed them and they were unable to do any thing so this changes our attitude probably out of proportion
But even if we are wrong to be jaded the fact is a great many people are.
I do not blame the BIB who in the majority are decent people. but It only takes one bad one to change your Attitude.
I can add to the list of bad experiences with the BIB but I wont bother.
I have noticed in recent years the attitude of most Police has improved a great deal!!!
Unfortunalety we all remember the times when we needed them and they were unable to do any thing so this changes our attitude probably out of proportion
But even if we are wrong to be jaded the fact is a great many people are.
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