Monday 18th August 2003

What is their Agenda?

Charge of obstruction for man warning people of a speed trap?

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[DustyC]

I think the bib are proving that they WANT to catch people speeding.

If no one was speeding through their cameras they'd be upset!

[206xsi]

said:

Thames Valley Police have threatened to prosecute Mr Newman for obstruction

Obstruction of taxes!!!!

[trefor]

If everyone who exceeding the speed limit lost their license then the roads would certainly be quiet.

The trouble is, half of the Police force would lose their licenses too - the BiB on this very site have commented on colleagues getting points for speeding.

Bit like the marked Astra going down the A404 Marlow Hill into Wycombe about 10 days ago. Me in girlfriend's TT on inside lane obeying 40, then 30 limits. Them sitting in my blind spot grinning. Yeah right lads, like I'm going to give you an excuse. They they sail into the 30 limit at 35ish and don't slow until the bottom of the hill (junction). Nice.

[CHiP's]

Mr Paul Newman??.......WTF is he doing living in England!?!?

Does seem that TVP are making themselves look very foolish here......or may be just not aware of the fact that they seem to be admitting financial incentive to the "safety campaign".

Re the marked Astra........un-professional and hypocritical!!
30/40/50 limits should be rigourously adhered to by marked vehicles except for cases of emergency response.

[d_drinks]

I think this guy deserves a medal. The idea of posting speed limit signs to advise drivers of the speed limit, all this guy is doing is reminding drivers of the speed limit, just more proactivly than a sign !! To threaten to prosecute him is lunacy, and reeks of sour grapes that they can’t fulfill their quota from their favorite laybe.

IF they want speeds reduced this guy is helping if they want money then this chap isn’t helping, so what is then?….. slower speeds or money?…..

[outlaw]

CHiP's said:

Mr Paul Newman??.......WTF is he doing living in England!?!? Does seem that TVP are making themselves look very foolish here......or may be just not aware of the fact that they seem to be admitting financial incentive to the "safety campaign". Re the marked Astra........un-professional and hypocritical!! 30/40/50 limits should be rigourously adhered to by marked vehicles except for cases of emergency response.

THIS IS THE REAL WORLD

[CHiP's]

outlaw said:

THIS IS THE REAL WORLD

Indeed it is....BUT YOUR POINT??

The very fact that trefor fealt the need to highlight the actions of the two grinning morons in the Astra simply concretes my reply. All respect (if any) has been blown out by the fact that these two PANDA PILOTS have total lack of adherence to the limits, whilst waiting to pounce on the likes of trefor.

Fact remains the driver would have had it rigourously reinforced to him that he should obey the restricted limits before he had his driver authourisation granted.....for exactly these reasons!! He (they all) should be setting examples (and by that I mean good ones!!).

[gh0st]

Its all a matter of balance.

I wouldnt be so fked off with the rampant over enforcement of the speeding laws if, for ever 1 person done for speeding, 1 person was done for sitting in the middle lane and 1 person was done for cutting across a roundabout.

At the moment for every 1 person that is done for a real obstructive / dangerours driving offense another 300,000,000,000 get done for speeding (ooops slight exaggeration - OR IS IT!!! )

[thanuk]

outlaw said:

THIS IS THE REAL WORLD

So it's OK for the BiB to break the limits but you're public enemy #1 if you do it yourself?

[andysherratt]

This is sheer lunacy - the BiB will give speed detection equipment to people to help them enforce limits in their own villages, but they won't let you tell people about their own cameras!

Oh, just thought, it wouldn't be because he was reducing their income would it, surely not!!!

[wiggy001]

gh0st said:

Its all a matter of balance. I wouldnt be so fked off with the rampant over enforcement of the speeding laws if, for ever 1 person done for speeding, 1 person was done for sitting in the middle lane and 1 person was done for cutting across a roundabout. At the moment for every 1 person that is done for a real obstructive / dangerours driving offense another 300,000,000,000 get done for speeding (ooops slight exaggeration - OR IS IT!!! )

I wouldn't be so p!ssed off if for every person done for speeding, someone was done for rape, murder, assault or burglary.

[Sgt^Roc]

What you have to remember the Thames Valley area which is run by a chap called N. Olney and his Expert as he calls him M. Collis they are desperate for results. last year Thames valley had a 14% increase in KSI figure, for the last two years Thames valley plods have had targets to meet which has not reduced causality figures either, if challenged Mr Olney can become irritated very quickly and I'm not surprised they have made this statement, just to under line their shallow and transparent speeding policy that supposedly is driven forward on the basis of safety. I reported a dangerous driver who was in the process of! while I was calling the 999 and the Thames valley plods instructed me that I must report it in person down at the nick, of course I questioned this but he became as rude as they usually get. This is what you get when the Police try to run their operation as a business and not service, there usual statement that fines are channelled back to roads will be true but what they are not also saying is that the treasury have cut their normal funds drastically and told them to raise cash via fines in truth they are in fact telling the truth while at the same time disguising other embedded reasons better kept quiet.

[streaky]

[quote=Sgt^Roc]... This is what you get when the Police try to run their operation as a business and not service, ...[/quote]Funny that! I seems to read a lot in the paper at present about senior officers (to CC rank) apologising to citizens that they, "have not received the service they are entitled to expect"! Of ourse this seems to apply almost exclusively to those citizens who have been robbed and sometimes assaulted.

In a recent case, the excessive delay in a police response to a report of a burglary in progress followed a massive hike in the 'law and order' precept of the laocal rates to pay for, "higher profile policing". I suggest that the good burghers ask for their money back!

[206xsi]

If the KSI figures went up 14% in Thames Valley, I can suggest they place their Talivans in accident blackspots instead of A329 Vastern Road in Reading

Kerrrching goes TVP cash register....

[JMGS4]

said:

Thames Valley Police have threatened to prosecute Mr Newman for obstruction

So just put up a sign saying Danger! Speed! and publicise this........... WE all know what that means and a court/BiB cannot "do" one as this is only warning of the "dangers" of speed.......
BTW this has been successfully tried in Germany, the cops tried to prosecute using "obstruction of police doing their duty" wheeze, and got royally ed by the courts who ruled that the sign was only telling people to slow down!!!!!
Needless to say german police are not such politically ruled persons as in GB under labour scum....intelligent use of speed traps and intelligent TrafPols! i.e. no probs with drivers and with the repute of the Pols!

[james_j]

How do the signs "warning" of speed cameras, when there is no speed camera, fit within the law?

Then, as can sometime happen, just when you "know" there is no camera, one is installed as if to catch you out. This would seem to be entrapment.

[voyds9]

james_j said:

How do the signs "warning" of speed cameras, when there is no speed camera, fit within the law? Then, as can sometime happen, just when you "know" there is no camera, one is installed as if to catch you out. This would seem to be entrapment.

Take them to the advertising standards agency for false advertising

[GLancs]

The Association of British Drivers has condemned a statement made by Thames Valley Police that "If drivers cannot stay within the speed limits then they should give up their licence ."

Does this mean that the majority (if not all) of the UK's Police Force are going to walk the streets or attach their flashing blue lights to push bikes?!?!!!!

Some months ago I was caught doing 36mph in a 30 zone. A few days after receiving the NIP I followed the same marked police camera van that caught me and he/she was doing 34-35mph along the exact same 30mph stretch of road!?!!?!? They weren't rushing to get anywhere... yet some how the rules that apply to us don't appear to apply to them!??!

It's not the first time I've seen or heard of the police abusing their status.... and why do they do it???? Because they're human... just like the rest of us!!! So why (other than the obvious £££) are 'we' penalised so heavily for being human???

I wish people in power could see that aggressive traffic policing just makes normal law abiding people resent the police. Education will be far more effective than fines and point!?!?

[ledfoot]

GLancs said:

A few days after receiving the NIP I followed the same marked police camera van that caught me and he/she was doing 34-35mph along the exact same 30mph stretch of road!?!!?!?

Well why not ? That is within the ACPO guidelines.
What is your problem?

[GLancs]

"Well why not ? That is within the ACPO guidelines.
What is your problem?"

That may well be, but considering all the specialized training and education that the police get don't you think they should set an example????? Even drive just under the limit??

I think your missing my point which is that the police seem to be using the issue of road safety to increase revenue and hitting hard normally law abiding road users for(in my case)driving 1 or 2 mph over the ACPO guidelines that you mentioned. I have no idea what type of camera was used when I was caught but I was certainly not flashed. The van, although clearly marked on the front and side as a police vehicle, was not marked on the back and looked on approach as if it was an ordinary white van. There were no signs warning of speed cameras or a mobile unit (I've no idea if they have to warn you or not??) so I can only assume they wanted to catch people without them realising until it was too late.

On that occasion I wasn't consiously speeding but had I been flagged down and told/warned of my speed I would have taken notice. It's all very well to say that in a built up area you should know it's 30mph but that argument only works if you are aware of your speed. If you are in a particularly built up area I think most people would agree that they'd spend more time looking out for dangers that looking at the speedo. Because I found out two weeks later I could have been speeding without realising for the 14 days prior to receiving the NIP. Is that safe?

I personally believe that 30mph is too high in some areas and should be reduced but in my own experience signs that flash the speed limit at you when you are too fast are far more effective, instantly making you aware. Being pulled over makes you instantly aware.

I feel that the police need to be seen to be working with the public (both motorist and pedestrian) and not against them for a quick financial fix or they'll eventually end up with a low public opinion... which is not a situation I'd like to see.