citizen arrest for speeding?

[superlightr]

Can somebody do a citizen arrest on somebody who was speeding and then stops up the road?

Just becasue on my walks with the dog, around the residential area i live, its all a 30 and rightly so with schools, closes, small parks and houses etc did a max muppet in a renault 5 turbo come from the main road (40 limit) turned into this residentail area and then proceed to heavy foot it from about 20 to 70 or 75.

Later on my walks do I see max muppet talking with friends. Im fed up with twits like these giving respectable speeders a bad name, but serioulsy it was totally inapropriate speeding and dangerous for the circumstances.

Could I go up to max muppet and say your nicked and do a citizen arrest? What if there were others who would back me up?

[outlaw]

superlightr said:

Can somebody do a citizen arrest on somebody who was speeding and then stops up the road? Just becasue on my walks with the dog, around the residential area i live, its all a 30 and rightly so with schools, closes, small parks and houses etc did a max muppet in a renault 5 turbo come from the main road (40 limit) turned into this residentail area and then proceed to heavy foot it from about 20 to 70 or 75. Later on my walks do I see max muppet talking with friends. Im fed up with twits like these giving respectable speeders a bad name, but serioulsy it was totally inapropriate speeding and dangerous for the circumstances. Could I go up to max muppet and say your nicked and do a citizen arrest? What if there were others who would back me up?

NO you cant

Its not an arestable offence

like come back is 1 he will kick you head, in selfdefence.

or 2 he will have you nicked for assult and unlawful inprisoment.

or 3 sue for above and make a nice erner costing you a foutune

or all as I would if i was him.

pluss most peeps are very bad a exstomating speed so my guess is he was at around 50.
you be looking like a muppet if you do try it.

also what makes you think its so dangerous have you never broke a speed limet ?

or is it a case of not in my back yard ?

>> Edited by outlaw on Tuesday 2nd September 20:40

[superlightr]

I reakon it was 70 to 75. from my good estimate of speed. (promise)


Its a built up residential area with a 30 limit. a school, small parks etc. The limit actually justified unlike many others that arnt.

Yes I am concerned as it was in my back yard, but also becasue I drive around there and my wife, as well as all the horrible kids walk to school and play in the parks in the evening and cycle from their homes to friends etc. as i used to do when I was a nipper.

I would hate to have to administer first aid to some poor sod who happened to get in the way of this max muppet doing 70 in a 30 if he loses control and drives into a garden/pavement bus que, kids on the pavements etc.

I love driving fast my fellow PH , but this really was not the place to be doing 70, 60 ,50, or 40. 30 was ok as it was dry and vis was good and line of sight was reasonable in most places.

I do drive fast but do not do double + the limit in a 30. I certainly zonk it on the NSL when its sensible to do so.

I was just qurious if speeding or dangerous driving was an arrestable type of offence and what would happen.

Is Dangerous D arrestable or anyother bad driving type of thing arrestable?

[outlaw]

superlightr said:

I reakon it was 70 to 75. from my good estimate of speed. (promise) Its a built up residential area with a 30 limit. a school, small parks etc. The limit actually justified unlike many others that arnt. Yes I am concerned as it was in my back yard, but also becasue I drive around there and my wife, as well as all the horrible kids walk to school and play in the parks in the evening and cycle from their homes to friends etc. as i used to do when I was a nipper. I would hate to have to administer first aid to some poor sod who happened to get in the way of this max muppet doing 70 in a 30 if he loses control and drives into a garden/pavement bus que, kids on the pavements etc. I love driving fast my fellow PH , but this really was not the place to be doing 70, 60 ,50, or 40. 30 was ok as it was dry and vis was good and line of sight was reasonable in most places. I do drive fast but do not do double + the limit in a 30. I certainly zonk it on the NSL when its sensible to do so. I was just qurious if speeding or dangerous driving was an arrestable type of offence and what would happen. Is Dangerous D arrestable or anyother bad driving type of thing arrestable?

as far as im aware dangerous driving is not an arestable offece as such that could be used in a citzens arest.

un less there has been a resent change in law
but im not a bib.

one of them will be able to confirm that point.

but trust me a bib would be in shit for a aress for speeding and nothing else.


Have you ever watched a crime and thought of "having a go" and arresting the thief. The law says that you have the power to make such an arrest, but only if an arrestable offence is actually being committed. Apart from a bloody nose, you might also end up being expensively sued, and sometimes prosecuted, for assault, wrongful arrest or false imprisonment.

In 1991, a police officer was seen leaving a shop with a chocolate bar which he had apparently not paid for. The store detective, and a sales assistant, followed. A scuffle ensued and he ran off. A passer-by ran after him and made a citizen's arrest for shop-lifting. In the process, he in turn was kicked by the off-duty officer.

Later, the defendant was acquitted of theft, but found guilty on two counts of assault with intent to resist arrest. He appealed, saying that the arrest was unlawful. He was, again, successful. Once acquitted of the theft, the arrest has become, retrospectively, unlawful. Presumably, it would therefore be open to the former defendant to bring an action for wrongful arrest.

It is different for a policeman making an arrest. The police officer need only have reasonable grounds for suspecting there has been an arrestable offence.



Section: s24 Act: Police And Criminal Evidence Act 1984
Subject: Arrestable Offence

a) Offences for which the sentence is fixed by law (e.g. Murder);
b) Offences for which a person of age 21 or over (not previously convicted) may be sentenced to imprisonment for a term of 5 years (e.g. Theft 7yrs, ABH 5yrs, Criminal Damage 10yrs, Burglary 14yrs).

c) Offences deemed by statute to be arrestable: e.g.

All Football offences under the Football Offences Act 1991
Going equipped for stealing (s25 Theft Act 1968) - 3yrs
Fail to stop after injury RTC (Road Traffic Collision) - 6mths
Indecent photographs of children (s1 Protection of Children Act 1978)
Possession of offensive weapon (s1 Prevention of Crime Act 1953) - 4yrs
Possession of sharp pointed articles (s139 Criminal Justice Act 1988)
Publication of obscene matter (Obscene Publications Act 1959)
Publishing material intended or likely to stir up racial hatred (s19 Public Order Act 1986)
Sale of tickets by unauthorised persons (s166 Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994)
Taking a motor vehicle with consent (s12 Theft Act 1968) - 2yrs
Touting for car hire services (Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994)

d) Attempting, Inciting, Aiding or Abetting or conspiring to commit any of the above
Mnemonic to remember the above:
Sentence fixed by Law

Over 21, liable to 5 years or more imprisonment

Deemed arrestable by Section 24(2) Schedule 1 of PACE



so be carefull

and to be lawful strickly speeking you need too see them do it first hand not just suspect they did it.

but like you said if he lose it. however the fact is he aint lost yet

if he does ,then so be it let him take the wrap.
but i would ague that it aint the speed that dose it
its lack of obsovation that dose it.


having said that he may bounce it off the next lamp post as i have no idear of his skill

pluss i would Offences deemed by statute to be arrestable

if you dont want problems



>> Edited by outlaw on Tuesday 2nd September 21:45

>> Edited by outlaw on Tuesday 2nd September 21:50

[superlightr]

sure I agree it would not be sensible to do a citizan arrest unless you are completly sure of the cirumstances and even then it may not be a good idea.

Thank you for the time for your reply, I was intersted if there were say 4 people who all agreed that max muppet was driving dangeroulsly would it stick? Probably not, and also they/we are not experts such as the police (despite good jusgement)and thus you would need the police.

I just got fed up with totally and way over the top bad driving which may end up hitting me/wife etc in a 30. So there is not a lot a single person can do ie Citizen arrest apart from write to the council and police.

I wish the local police would spend more time in the residentail areas and target bad drivers. they are a lot more dangerous here then on a fast A or B road.

I wishe the maxmuppets would zip off around the A roads at a faat speed, not a problem with that, but not in a residential area.


Its the same old thing, inapropriate driving is the problem. You can be doing 30 in a 30 and it will be too fast but can equally be doing 100 in a 70 and it will be safe.

Bring back more police patrols.

[CarZee]

superlightr said:

I wish the maxmuppets would zip off around the A roads at a faat speed, not a problem with that, but not in a residential area.

The A roads are where all the cameras and talivans are - or they probably would go there instead.

Quite possibly another irritating side-effect of Gatsos - perhaps they just displace the problem, like CCTV does.

[superlightr]

CarZee, sad but true words.

Be nice to have the talivans and cameras in the residential areas but hey that may make too much sence for the local govt. (as much as I dislike talivans and cams)

[Don]

Pistonheads.

Place of so many interesting characters.

[outlaw]

Offences of dangerous driving.

1. For sections 1 and 2 of the [1988 c. 52.] Road Traffic Act 1988 there shall be substituted—
"Causing death by dangerous driving.

1. A person who causes the death of another person by driving a mechanically propelled vehicle dangerously on a road or other public place is guilty of an offence.

Dangerous driving.

2. A person who drives a mechanically propelled vehicle dangerously on a road or other public place is guilty of an offence.

Meaning of dangerous driving.

2A. — (1) For the purposes of sections 1 and 2 above a person is to be regarded as driving dangerously if (and, subject to subsection (2) below, only if)—
(a) the way he drives falls far below what would be expected of a competent and careful driver, and
(b) it would be obvious to a competent and careful driver that driving in that way would be dangerous.


(2) A person is also to be regarded as driving dangerously for the purposes of sections 1 and 2 above if it would be obvious to a competent and careful driver that driving the vehicle in its current state would be dangerous.

(3) In subsections (1) and (2) above "dangerous" refers to danger either of injury to any person or of serious damage to property; and in determining for the purposes of those subsections what would be expected of, or obvious to, a competent and careful driver in a particular case, regard shall be had not only to the circumstances of which he could be expected to be aware but also to any circumstances shown to have been within the knowledge of the accused.

(4) In determining for the purposes of subsection (2) above the state of a vehicle, regard may be had to anything attached to or carried on or in it and to the manner in which it is attached or carried.
"

there the section oin dangerous.

but personaly i would leve it alone and not get worke up m8

[superlightr]

thanks outlaw.

its just frustrating that there is not a lot being done about it by the people who should (ie the local govt) and there is not a lot I can do about it either apart from get out of their way and hope not to be at the wrong end of one of their drag strips as I walk my dog !

oh well, time for bed fellow PH friends. :snore:

[boxster]

Can you imagine the consequences if citizen's arrests were lawful for speeding?
Every "speed kills" numpty in the country
would have carte blanche to cart off us "respectable speeders" the moment we dared to overtake at 71 on the motorway.

[outlaw]

boxster said:

Can you imagine the consequences if citizen's arrests were lawful for speeding? Every "speed kills" numpty in the country would have carte blanche to cart off us "respectable speeders" the moment we dared to overtake at 71 on the motorway.

like to see em try
The BiB`s have had there work cut out some times with me

like to see a nummtie try

>> Edited by outlaw on Tuesday 2nd September 23:55

[jjr1]

If you tried to make a citizens arrest on me for speeding, I would give you one of two options

1) Take the beating like a man
2) Take the beating like a baby and cry

Your choice.......

[thanuk]

superlightr said:

Be nice to have the talivans and cameras in the residential areas

No it wouldn't - we'd all get nicked for doing 31 in a 30 and the scrotes attempting to do 90 through the houses would get free holidays to show them the error of their ways.

[s2ooz]

A sprinkling of nails on his route, would slow him down.. remove nails before passing yourself.

[lucozade]

Just do this:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/west_yorkshire/3200807.stm

[victormeldrew]

You could always just report to BiB, then wait for the scameras to show up. Just be warned where this happens the "concerned citizen" is often one of the first scamera victims.

[Tivster]

Actually a police officer can arrest for speeding, using the general conditional power of arrest if the numptie is stopped and refuses to provide the relevant details and they can't reasonably be ascertained by the officer. This applies to anyhting from dropping litter upwards....

Tivster

[swilly]

If your considering approaching this type of guy then simpler than attempting an arrest would be to nab his keys and lob em away or down the drain.

Although note the story RE the copper dragged down the road at 80mph in General Gassing for attempting just this.

[outlaw]

Tivster said:

Actually a police officer can arrest for speeding, using the general conditional power of arrest if the numptie is stopped and refuses to provide the relevant details and they can't reasonably be ascertained by the officer. This applies to anyhting from dropping litter upwards.... Tivster

how ever as the the relevant details you speack of are on there name address a dob

I would be very unlikely you would be able to nick under sec 25