"Slower Traffic but Deaths Rise"
Discussion
Taken from last nights Kettering Evening Telegraph:
[url]www.ketteringtoday.co.uk[/url]
Comments?
[url]www.ketteringtoday.co.uk[/url]
Evening Telegraph said:
Slower traffic but deaths rise
DRIVERS in the county are reducing their speed – but the number of road deaths rose by more than 30 per cent last year.
The number of people caught speeding dropped more than 15 per cent, from 100,000 in 2001 to 85,000 in 2002. No figures are available yet for this year.
However, deaths on the county's roads rose to 62 in 2002 from 46 the year before.
A report to the county council states that although the number of drivers caught speeding is still high, the reduction suggests motorists are beginning to get the message.
The proportion of county drivers exceeding speed limits is also falling. In 2001, motorists who live in the county committed more than 70 per cent of the offences detected through fixed site cameras. Now this figure has dropped to 24 per cent.
The proportion of accidents blamed on excessive speed is also falling.
A county council spokesman said: "The figures nationally have always suggested that more than one-third of fatal road accidents are speed-related. We are very happy that in Northamptonshire the figure has been brought down to 19 per cent."
Despite the number of speeding offences falling, the council is keen to remind drivers that in 2002 almost half of all fatal accidents were caused by driver error.
In 1999 a partnership involving Northamptonshire Health Authority, the county council, Northamptonshire Police and the Highways Agency was set up to focus on cutting speed and road deaths. The county is on course to meet the Government's target of reducing the number of people killed or seriously injured by 40 per cent of the 1999 figure by 2010.
Comments?
nigelbasson said:
Despite the number of speeding offences falling, the council is keen to remind drivers that in 2002 almost half of all fatal accidents were caused by driver error.
So why aren't they spending almost as much on preventing/reducing driver error as they are on installing speed , sorry "safety", cameras. Oh, of course that doesn't generate revenue, does it?
Hey, here's an idea. If they want to reduce accidents caused by driver error, why don't they:
A, pay for membership to the IAM for any drivers who commit to doing the training and passing the test within 12 months.
B, come up with an incentive for those that do so. Say a 50% discount on VED?
Lies, damn lies and statistics. Again.
It would be interesting to see what the scamera lot will respond with, assuming they bother. They'll probably claim that the increase in deaths is a statistical anomaly
and in fact the roads are safer.
Or have speed related deaths actually increased to 19% from the 7% that is quoted by the anti-scamera lot.
It would be interesting to see what the scamera lot will respond with, assuming they bother. They'll probably claim that the increase in deaths is a statistical anomaly
and in fact the roads are safer. Or have speed related deaths actually increased to 19% from the 7% that is quoted by the anti-scamera lot.
OK - the general gist of that article as I understand it, cutting straight to the chase, without all the political speak:
"We're still making loads of money from the cameras, although now it's mainly from people who don't live here - as they don't know where we hide them. We're also now catching less people from speeding - so this must be a successful campaign, people are finally getting the message to slow down. BTW, road deaths are actually up on the last few years, but that wasn't the point of it all in the first place really..."
"We're still making loads of money from the cameras, although now it's mainly from people who don't live here - as they don't know where we hide them. We're also now catching less people from speeding - so this must be a successful campaign, people are finally getting the message to slow down. BTW, road deaths are actually up on the last few years, but that wasn't the point of it all in the first place really..."
LexSport said:
Evening Telegraph said:
Despite the number of speeding offences falling, the council is keen to remind drivers that in 2002 almost half of all fatal accidents were caused by driver error.
So why aren't they spending almost as much on preventing/reducing driver error as they are on installing speed , sorry "safety", cameras. Oh, of course that doesn't generate revenue, does it?
Hey, here's an idea. If they want to reduce accidents caused by driver error, why don't they:
A, pay for membership to the IAM for any drivers who commit to doing the training and passing the test within 12 months.
B, come up with an incentive for those that do so. Say a 50% discount on VED?
That is exactly what I thought when I saw the article.
If the "safety partnerships" get their way and we all do indeed start driving at below the speed limit what are their plan regaring the next step?
I am going to write a letter in response to this, anyone like to put in a few ideas/quotes for me to work with?
mechsympathy said:
Lies, damn lies and statistics. Again.
It would be interesting to see what the scamera lot will respond with, assuming they bother. They'll probably claim that the increase in deaths is a statistical anomaly
Or have speed related deaths actually increased to 19% from the 7% that is quoted by the anti-scamera lot.
Errm, The Scamera lot have kindly given us an insight into how the figures are fiddled ( we knew anyway but lets play along)
See www.northants.police.uk/
Then "Road road policing" then "The story so far"
You will see the boast of a reduction in KSI of 31% in BIG red numbers but only when you roll down will you see - much less prominently - that deaths increased by 35%, though this percentage is not mentioned.
Suggest you all capture this page before it is removed.
Aren't figures fun.......
I tell you what, the cameras in Northants must be immensly strong, in that I've never seen one uprooted or at an unusual angle. At just about every junction, traffic lights, roundabout, bend etc there is a demolished sign or lamp-post where a car has hit them! These are the accident blackspots and prove that education is the main answer. No damage is evident at any of the camera locations!
Email sent to Northants police:
Subject: Congratulations on reduced KSI figures
Dear Northants Police,
I see from your website (www.northants.police.uk/safetycamera/story.htm) that KSI figures fell by 31% - congratulations you must be very proud, as indicated by by the bold headline!!!
Could I ask then why the fact that fatalities rose by 34% is hidden in much smaller print within the main text? Perhaps "safety cameras" are only successfully completing their primary task of earning money for the partnership/Treasury - and failing abysmally in their secondary task of reducing deaths?
Yours puzzled,
Subject: Congratulations on reduced KSI figures
Dear Northants Police,
I see from your website (www.northants.police.uk/safetycamera/story.htm) that KSI figures fell by 31% - congratulations you must be very proud, as indicated by by the bold headline!!!
Could I ask then why the fact that fatalities rose by 34% is hidden in much smaller print within the main text? Perhaps "safety cameras" are only successfully completing their primary task of earning money for the partnership/Treasury - and failing abysmally in their secondary task of reducing deaths?
Yours puzzled,
Email sent to Northants Scameraship:
Dear ,
I would like to quote an article to you from last night's Kettering Evening Telegraph (www.ketteringtoday.co.uk) and then perhaps discuss some of the information in the text:
------------------------------------
Quote from above
-----------------------------------
A council spokesman stated that: "Despite the number of speeding offences falling, the council is keen to remind drivers that in 2002 almost half of all fatal accidents were caused by driver error. ". This is blatantly untrue - it is nationally accepted that almost all accidents are caused by driver error. Very few accidents are due to non-driver error such as mechanical faults. This is backed up by the paper TRL323 published by the Transport
Research Laboratory (see www.abd.org.uk/one_third.htm).
TRL323 is coincidently the same document which proves that only 7% of accidents are caused by excessive speed, not "more than one-third" as claimed by a council spokesman.
However the thrust of my email is to enquire as to how the "safety partnership" in Northants will react to this news of a 34% increase in fatalities. Obviously cameras are only in place to create revenue for the Treasury, with a little siphoned off to yourselves. It is clear from this article that the partnership is woefully FAILING in it's purpose, and indeed I would suggest should be disolved and replaced by a body without hidden agendas?
Dear ,
I would like to quote an article to you from last night's Kettering Evening Telegraph (www.ketteringtoday.co.uk) and then perhaps discuss some of the information in the text:
------------------------------------
Quote from above
-----------------------------------
A council spokesman stated that: "Despite the number of speeding offences falling, the council is keen to remind drivers that in 2002 almost half of all fatal accidents were caused by driver error. ". This is blatantly untrue - it is nationally accepted that almost all accidents are caused by driver error. Very few accidents are due to non-driver error such as mechanical faults. This is backed up by the paper TRL323 published by the Transport
Research Laboratory (see www.abd.org.uk/one_third.htm).
TRL323 is coincidently the same document which proves that only 7% of accidents are caused by excessive speed, not "more than one-third" as claimed by a council spokesman.
However the thrust of my email is to enquire as to how the "safety partnership" in Northants will react to this news of a 34% increase in fatalities. Obviously cameras are only in place to create revenue for the Treasury, with a little siphoned off to yourselves. It is clear from this article that the partnership is woefully FAILING in it's purpose, and indeed I would suggest should be disolved and replaced by a body without hidden agendas?
...continued
Perhaps the good people of Northants, and those of us who are unfortunate to travel on the county's roads, would be better served by educated traffic police officers than by mindless cameras hidden behind signs and hedges? Please be assured I haven't visited the county since the policy of driver-persecution has been in place, thus not aiding the local economy by one penny - the same can be said of North Wales.
Please do reply and educate me as to how the partnership will 'progress' forward from here - I eagerly await your news. I'd suggest that maybe fatalities are up because drivers in your county are too busy watching their speedometers to concentrate on the roads?
Finally - I'd like to point out I am not a bitter driver. I have a completely clean record in the 12 years I have owned a vehicle on the roads, no accidents and no points. I consider myself to be a safe driver, keeping to within my limits, rather than just progressing at 30mph without due care and attention...
Kind Regards,
Perhaps the good people of Northants, and those of us who are unfortunate to travel on the county's roads, would be better served by educated traffic police officers than by mindless cameras hidden behind signs and hedges? Please be assured I haven't visited the county since the policy of driver-persecution has been in place, thus not aiding the local economy by one penny - the same can be said of North Wales.
Please do reply and educate me as to how the partnership will 'progress' forward from here - I eagerly await your news. I'd suggest that maybe fatalities are up because drivers in your county are too busy watching their speedometers to concentrate on the roads?
Finally - I'd like to point out I am not a bitter driver. I have a completely clean record in the 12 years I have owned a vehicle on the roads, no accidents and no points. I consider myself to be a safe driver, keeping to within my limits, rather than just progressing at 30mph without due care and attention...
Kind Regards,
Sent them:
Maybe youd like to comment on the things i have to say below, i certainly hope so.
On your website, especially the speed camera parts, theres a little paragraph explaing how smart your systems are at catching drivers out. It proudly proclaims how far away it can scam a driver from (up to 1km) and takes its reading in a third of a second. Very impressive......er not really.
Why do i say that? Well, the following applies to ANY of your nasty little setups, but dosent apply to a traffic cop(he's got discretion and intelligence).
Hypothetically speaking, if i was of a criminal mind,(glad to say im not tho) i could travel on EVERY road in Northampton at probably double or even triple the speed limits imposed by you people, and i could get away with it, probably indefinitely if i wanted to.
How? Easy. Your systems all rely on one thing to make them function effectively, and this where it all falls down for you.
You rely on being able to identify the car thru using its number plate.
What if i dont have one, either front or rear?
If theres no police officers present, how are you going to deal with that scenario?
I suggest you cant, so your "sooper dooper" system is actually rather naff.
All it allows you to do is screw over law abiding drivers like myself, while allowing scum to carry on regardless.
And, because its only a £30 non endorsable fine for no number plates, it makes it ooh so tempting for them.
How does that make you feel?
To deliberately target LEGAL drivers, while allowing the dangerous elements to escape?
You must be really proud of yourselves for alienating so many drivers against the police (its not their fault, its YOURS!!!!).
Your speed camera systems are an absolute sham, and a joke, as they dont have anything at all to do with "safety". They cant deal with drunk drivers, joyriders, illegal drivers or drugged drivers. Theyre useless at improving safety. Its all about boning drivers over for cash, and so that the government can meet its obligations regarding the Copenhagen Declaration, and make a killing in the process.
Before too long, there will be a day of reckoning for you "partnerships", i just hope youre never employed in this country again.
TTFN.
Maybe youd like to comment on the things i have to say below, i certainly hope so.
On your website, especially the speed camera parts, theres a little paragraph explaing how smart your systems are at catching drivers out. It proudly proclaims how far away it can scam a driver from (up to 1km) and takes its reading in a third of a second. Very impressive......er not really.
Why do i say that? Well, the following applies to ANY of your nasty little setups, but dosent apply to a traffic cop(he's got discretion and intelligence).
Hypothetically speaking, if i was of a criminal mind,(glad to say im not tho) i could travel on EVERY road in Northampton at probably double or even triple the speed limits imposed by you people, and i could get away with it, probably indefinitely if i wanted to.
How? Easy. Your systems all rely on one thing to make them function effectively, and this where it all falls down for you.
You rely on being able to identify the car thru using its number plate.
What if i dont have one, either front or rear?
If theres no police officers present, how are you going to deal with that scenario?
I suggest you cant, so your "sooper dooper" system is actually rather naff.
All it allows you to do is screw over law abiding drivers like myself, while allowing scum to carry on regardless.
And, because its only a £30 non endorsable fine for no number plates, it makes it ooh so tempting for them.
How does that make you feel?
To deliberately target LEGAL drivers, while allowing the dangerous elements to escape?
You must be really proud of yourselves for alienating so many drivers against the police (its not their fault, its YOURS!!!!).
Your speed camera systems are an absolute sham, and a joke, as they dont have anything at all to do with "safety". They cant deal with drunk drivers, joyriders, illegal drivers or drugged drivers. Theyre useless at improving safety. Its all about boning drivers over for cash, and so that the government can meet its obligations regarding the Copenhagen Declaration, and make a killing in the process.
Before too long, there will be a day of reckoning for you "partnerships", i just hope youre never employed in this country again.
TTFN.
, close but not quite. 
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