NIP - Careless driving
Discussion
My son who is 19 has received a NIP alleging "driving a vehicle carelessly or without reasonable consideration for other persons using the road".
He has filled it in and signed it unfortunately.
There is a long story behind all this but basically he does not remember anything that would warrant this, although details are correct as to where he was, (very general area on NIP.
He was not stopped or pulled over in any way and doesn't remeber any Police cars around at the time.
It would appear from NIP that the question was raised by a foot officer!
The NIP appears to have a section on reverse where the Police are supposed to tick that the NIP has been served by post or personally or post to office. This has not been signed and dated. Is this correct? Or does the recorded delivery count as that?
Without going into all the details he and his friends around the village are being targeted daily for traffic stops and producers. He had a record 21 in one period! All were for production of original docs as he carries photocopies, his car being fully legal.
After trying all sorts with the local lads it appears they are now trying this tack. There's 3 of them who have received a NIP at various places and times as above. They appear to be trying anti-social law out on these lads.
They are not angels but at least they have tax, insurance etc.
We are awaiting the outcome of the NIP. Does the offence details arrive when they decide if they are prosecuting? He has no idea of what they allege!
He has filled it in and signed it unfortunately.
There is a long story behind all this but basically he does not remember anything that would warrant this, although details are correct as to where he was, (very general area on NIP.
He was not stopped or pulled over in any way and doesn't remeber any Police cars around at the time.
It would appear from NIP that the question was raised by a foot officer!
The NIP appears to have a section on reverse where the Police are supposed to tick that the NIP has been served by post or personally or post to office. This has not been signed and dated. Is this correct? Or does the recorded delivery count as that?
Without going into all the details he and his friends around the village are being targeted daily for traffic stops and producers. He had a record 21 in one period! All were for production of original docs as he carries photocopies, his car being fully legal.
After trying all sorts with the local lads it appears they are now trying this tack. There's 3 of them who have received a NIP at various places and times as above. They appear to be trying anti-social law out on these lads.
They are not angels but at least they have tax, insurance etc.
We are awaiting the outcome of the NIP. Does the offence details arrive when they decide if they are prosecuting? He has no idea of what they allege!
As regards how many witnesses are needed - 1 is required for speeding PLUS corroboration of either a device ( speedo, video, vascar, laser etc. ) OR another officer who, with the first, is of the opinion that the vehicle is speeding.
For a due care, careless etc, only one witness is needed HOWEVER further witnesses or other evidence will make the case stronger.
Now looking at the rear of the form ( empty on yours ), these are simply printed / written in duplicate on the same paper - the other copy back at the station will
have been filled in and duly dated and signed by either the officer posting it or the admin type who did it on the officer's behalf.
For a due care, careless etc, only one witness is needed HOWEVER further witnesses or other evidence will make the case stronger.
Now looking at the rear of the form ( empty on yours ), these are simply printed / written in duplicate on the same paper - the other copy back at the station will
have been filled in and duly dated and signed by either the officer posting it or the admin type who did it on the officer's behalf. tasmod said:
My son who is 19 has received a NIP alleging "driving a vehicle carelessly or without reasonable consideration for other persons using the road".
He has filled it in and signed it unfortunately.
There is a long story behind all this but basically he does not remember anything that would warrant this, although details are correct as to where he was, (very general area on NIP.
He was not stopped or pulled over in any way and doesn't remeber any Police cars around at the time.
It would appear from NIP that the question was raised by a foot officer!
The NIP appears to have a section on reverse where the Police are supposed to tick that the NIP has been served by post or personally or post to office. This has not been signed and dated. Is this correct? Or does the recorded delivery count as that?
Without going into all the details he and his friends around the village are being targeted daily for traffic stops and producers. He had a record 21 in one period! All were for production of original docs as he carries photocopies, his car being fully legal.
After trying all sorts with the local lads it appears they are now trying this tack. There's 3 of them who have received a NIP at various places and times as above. They appear to be trying anti-social law out on these lads.
They are not angels but at least they have tax, insurance etc.
We are awaiting the outcome of the NIP. Does the offence details arrive when they decide if they are prosecuting? He has no idea of what they allege!
21 produsers is harassment i would contact a solisitor.
and make a complaint they wont do anything but it will give them some work.
tell the lad to carry a micro casset recoeder with him and recored every stop
and if it a silly reson for each stop write to the head of the station each time and ask for a writen explonation of the reson for the stop every time.
if they lie you have the tapes.
>> Edited by outlaw on Monday 6th October 18:21
I would suggest that being issued with 21 HO/RT1s over a short period is, indeed, abuse of authority. I would go to the police station and make a complaint. If your lad has produced documents every time then the records will be available.
I know nothing about this matter other than what you've posted but I reckon your lad has either an attitude problem with the police or he is making a nuisance of himself and the locals are putting pressure on the police to do something about it.
If this is so, what do you expect the police to do? Lie down and take it? They are only human and if you piss them off you must expect to be messed around. Whilst 21 producers might irritate your lad I would suggest that the most likely explanation is that he has earned it. That is life.
Get your lad to play rugby. Then he'll work out that if you step out of line retribution is swift and painful.
He wouldn't do this in France, Germany, Spain, Italy, Japan or Australia. The police there have other methods of dealing with youths who overstep the mark. Being issued with a piece of paper is mild in comparison.
Mind you, I agree with Outlaw (I think). Twenty one HO/RT1s is out of order.
Derek
I know nothing about this matter other than what you've posted but I reckon your lad has either an attitude problem with the police or he is making a nuisance of himself and the locals are putting pressure on the police to do something about it.
If this is so, what do you expect the police to do? Lie down and take it? They are only human and if you piss them off you must expect to be messed around. Whilst 21 producers might irritate your lad I would suggest that the most likely explanation is that he has earned it. That is life.
Get your lad to play rugby. Then he'll work out that if you step out of line retribution is swift and painful.
He wouldn't do this in France, Germany, Spain, Italy, Japan or Australia. The police there have other methods of dealing with youths who overstep the mark. Being issued with a piece of paper is mild in comparison.
Mind you, I agree with Outlaw (I think). Twenty one HO/RT1s is out of order.
Derek
Derek Smith said:
I know nothing about this matter other than what you've posted but I reckon your lad has either an attitude problem with the police or he is making a nuisance of himself and the locals are putting pressure on the police to do something about it.
I agree 100 per cent!
Modded Nova is it?
I think this might be a rare example of the police doing their job...
I don't want to go into this, it's too labourious.
I've been with him as passenger, I've been close anonymously when he was parked and then accosted.
I was dozing in passenger seat in slow town traffic when a traffic car put on blues and twos from 2 cars back and swerved alongside and put on stop sign. Driver then looked across, saw me now awake and then waved him on. He then switched off lights. 10 minutes later whilst parked in town we witnessed him do this again to a car with another young driver, this time pulling him over.
He and some of his mates from village were outside village shop. He had dropped me off to go in. I came out to find a traffic car had stopped and asked them all for their documents. The driver was examining them, the passenger already had his producer pad out.
I stood by and listened, the way they were being spoken to was disgusting, it was obvious they had no respect for the lads at all and were trying to bait them. I spoke up and the two officers then spluttered, stopped what they were doing, upshot was they appeared very embarrassed and made a hasty retreat.
Don't always blame the young lads. Don't make assumptions.
The local nick, know him by first name and they just take the producer at the desk and tell him they will sort it.
I've been with him as passenger, I've been close anonymously when he was parked and then accosted.
I was dozing in passenger seat in slow town traffic when a traffic car put on blues and twos from 2 cars back and swerved alongside and put on stop sign. Driver then looked across, saw me now awake and then waved him on. He then switched off lights. 10 minutes later whilst parked in town we witnessed him do this again to a car with another young driver, this time pulling him over.
He and some of his mates from village were outside village shop. He had dropped me off to go in. I came out to find a traffic car had stopped and asked them all for their documents. The driver was examining them, the passenger already had his producer pad out.
I stood by and listened, the way they were being spoken to was disgusting, it was obvious they had no respect for the lads at all and were trying to bait them. I spoke up and the two officers then spluttered, stopped what they were doing, upshot was they appeared very embarrassed and made a hasty retreat.
Don't always blame the young lads. Don't make assumptions.
The local nick, know him by first name and they just take the producer at the desk and tell him they will sort it.
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