Brunstrom Censorship Story Censored!
Discussion
It seems to be catching!
Paul Smith recently posted about the Brunstrom memo over on the Cumbria Safety Camera Partnership forums (www.cumbriasafetycameras.org/forum/) in order to get CSCP's views on it.
Amazingly, rather than allow discussion regarding it, they simply removed the 'offending' thread, stating that it was "removed in compliance with an ACPO request".
Stunning stuff - just how low will these guys stoop?
The thread discussing the censorship of the Brunstrom thread can be found here:
www.cumbriasafetycameras.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=238
Paul Smith recently posted about the Brunstrom memo over on the Cumbria Safety Camera Partnership forums (www.cumbriasafetycameras.org/forum/) in order to get CSCP's views on it.
Amazingly, rather than allow discussion regarding it, they simply removed the 'offending' thread, stating that it was "removed in compliance with an ACPO request".
Stunning stuff - just how low will these guys stoop?
The thread discussing the censorship of the Brunstrom thread can be found here:
www.cumbriasafetycameras.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=238
puggit said:
Reading through the Cumbria noticeboards I found some familiar names and familiar posts
It's a shame; a lot of very, very good posts were lost when their database recently became corrupted.
Particularly interesting is the way they are, for the most part, very helpful and co-operative, until they are asked about their targets, at which point they suddenly go completely silent. In fact, they completely blanked the thread that used to exist for a good couple of months, despite answering every thread around it.
The jist of the thread was that the targets they'd set themselves, if achieved, would be worse than the downward trend that already existed prior to their inception. In short, they expected to make things worse. They never would comment on that.
>> Edited by FastShow on Wednesday 3rd December 16:31
Cooperman said:richard.brunstrom@heddlu-gogledd-cymru.police.uk as per www.cais.co.uk/pdf/Richard%20Brunstom%20Presentation.pdf
Has anyone got an email address for the undemocratic Baron Brunstrom or his Police Authority?
We need to tell him and his Gestapo what we think of them all, in the best possible taste, of course!
It goes directly to him (in my experience)
puggit said:This is anothe rthing that anoys me, and without wishing to offend Welsh people, the internet is a modern invention so why the hell has he got an e-mail address using a histric language? Either he's an idiot (no don't answer that) or he's doing it as some kind of political statement! Or... he figures he's less likely to get e-mail with that address as it's not exactly memeorable to the great majority of Brit's
richard.brunstrom@heddlu-gogledd-cymru.police.uk
Rich... p.s. Should I assume Heddu-Goigglud means North Wales Police?
To be fair the argument falls over when you simply trade insults.
The whole speeding debate is a political one and ultimately Brunstrom will simply echo whatever the political mood is of the day.
If that was to drive flat out everywhere then he'd reflect that attitude.
I've read the memo and to be honest the guy clearly doesn't want to get involved with endless correspondence. Lets face it - it does seem that unless he turns around and says "No you are right" you will always write another letter.
The whole speeding debate is a political one and ultimately Brunstrom will simply echo whatever the political mood is of the day.
If that was to drive flat out everywhere then he'd reflect that attitude.
I've read the memo and to be honest the guy clearly doesn't want to get involved with endless correspondence. Lets face it - it does seem that unless he turns around and says "No you are right" you will always write another letter.
p290 kvp said:
I've read the memo and to be honest the guy clearly doesn't want to get involved with endless correspondence. Lets face it - it does seem that unless he turns around and says "No you are right" you will always write another letter.
You couldn't be more wrong.
Examine the letters on:
www.safespeed.org.uk/brunstrom.html
I ask: "What evidence do you have that these speed cameras (and the policies which support them) even might save lives? Any real evidence at all would be welcome." And he has no answer to offer. Do you think it is acceptable to promote speed camera policy if you can't answer such a basic question?
The truth is that there is no evidence that speed cameras saves lives, and I knew that when I wrote the letter. Thus the basis for the policy is exposed as "faith".
If I had been mistaken then he had the opportunity to reference the evidence and prove me wrong.
I have only ever asked simple, straightforward questions capable of a clear and straightforward answer. The sneeky part - if there is a sneeky part - is that I know in advance that they have no answers to offer.
I was genuinely amazed when the TRL failed to disown the travesty of science that is TRL421. I corresponded in private and only published the letters when it became clear that the TRL were determined to reject science in favour of political spin. I am very ashamed of them.
www.safespeed.org.uk/trl.html
Best regards,
Paul Smith
Safe Speed
www.safespeed.org.uk
CSCP have posted a 'justification' of the removal of the docs now here:
www.cumbriasafetycameras.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=241
Apparantly, "the cull" begins after lunch.
www.cumbriasafetycameras.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=241
Apparantly, "the cull" begins after lunch.
FastShow said:
CSCP have posted a 'justification' of the removal of the docs now here:
www.cumbriasafetycameras.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=241
Apparantly, "the cull" begins after lunch.
Pram down, toys everywhere!
Hi Paul,
Thanks for the links, and information. But I guess it kind of proves my point.
It is only my personal opinion but look at it from their shoes. They really couldn't give a fig about the validity of their data because ultimately you can prove pretty much anything you like with it.
Just look at the on going saga about the MMR vaccine.
These guys are just like you and me and everyone else. Keeping their heads down and earning a living. Isn't it easier to fob you off with "already published reports, etc, blah, blah" than get involved with a debate that ultimately they couldn't care about.
The problem for these people is that they get dragged into a political matter because it is easier for politicians to use them than speak for themselves.
Rather than bang your head against the wall - why not talk to the only people who will change policy and that is your elected PM.
Thanks for the links, and information. But I guess it kind of proves my point.
It is only my personal opinion but look at it from their shoes. They really couldn't give a fig about the validity of their data because ultimately you can prove pretty much anything you like with it.
Just look at the on going saga about the MMR vaccine.
These guys are just like you and me and everyone else. Keeping their heads down and earning a living. Isn't it easier to fob you off with "already published reports, etc, blah, blah" than get involved with a debate that ultimately they couldn't care about.
The problem for these people is that they get dragged into a political matter because it is easier for politicians to use them than speak for themselves.
Rather than bang your head against the wall - why not talk to the only people who will change policy and that is your elected PM.
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