RE: Govt Tackle Unlicenced Drivers
Wednesday 17th December 2003
Govt Tackle Unlicenced Drivers
There are a million of them on our roads!
Road Safety Minister David Jamieson has today unveiled the results of a major investigation into the extent of unlicensed driving on our roads.
The report found that although there are around a million unlicensed drivers on our roads compared with a total of 32 million legal drivers, these drivers account for less than 1% of total hours driven. However, unlicensed drivers are up to nine times more likely to have an accident than a licensed driver and are involved in about 7,000 injury crashes every year.
More Automatic Number Plate Recognition are now being used to tackle the problem, allowing police to target unlicensed vehicles on the road. Many unlicensed drivers will also be untaxed and will not have registered the vehicle in their name. David Jamieson said:"The unlicensed driver is an anti-social and dangerous menace to the safety of our roads. While the vast majority of drivers are law abiding, there is a class of criminal on our roads who drive unlicensed, untaxed, uninsured, and probably without MOT, showing little regard for the law or the safety of other road users. "These unlicensed drivers are up to nine times more likely to have an accident and are involved in about 7,000 injury accidents every year. We are taking robust action to deal with this menace, including the widespread introduction of Automatic Number Plate Recognition allowing police to target unlicensed vehicles on the road . "Offenders should be in no doubt that driving unlicensed is a criminal offence that we shall pursue vigorously ".Twenty three police forces are now involved in an extended trial of ANPR. The original trial for Project LASER, in Northamptonshire, showed that 82% of those stopped for being untaxed were also involved in some other form of criminality, 15% of arrests made related to unlicensed driving.
Discussion
These unlicensed and banned drivers need to be nailed asap. They do cause more accidents, generally because they are not in control of the often un roadworthy vehicle they have just "bought" or stolen or "aquired". There have been a numbr of high profile road deaths up here in the north east over the last few years, where the above "drivers" have killed innocent people. Both young and old. If tracking registrations is a way forward then so be it. I have seen enough folks killed unnecessarily.
sagalout said:
These unlicensed and banned drivers need to be nailed asap. They do cause more accidents, generally because they are not in control of the often un roadworthy vehicle they have just "bought" or stolen or "aquired". There have been a numbr of high profile road deaths up here in the north east over the last few years, where the above "drivers" have killed innocent people. Both young and old. If tracking registrations is a way forward then so be it. I have seen enough folks killed unnecessarily.
No one will disagree on these points but the fact remains that they will have just "bought" or stolen or "aquired" cars that they have no intention of registering to themselves. as a result the gadgets won't catch them, the only way to do this will be by getting more traffic police back on the roads and away from the current techo drive the government is going for. If you look back through previous threads most people on here will aggree that boxes aren't needed but more traffic police are.
The auto recog systems will not lead directly to a conviction or penalty. It will, however, allow to police to find unregistered cars and then pass the informaion on to local police to find and stop the car. When this is done, the person will be caught.
Those of you who think the 'boxes' should all be thrown in the bin and lots of police introduced instead are just being silly. Technology is a massive help to policing and should (and will) be increased in use. I do agree that more local police are needed to follow up the info gathered by the technology, but getting rid of all technology as a way of imroving enforcement is plain stupid.
Also, remember that when you see a piece of technology, there are police working 'behind the scenes' using this technology. Just because you can't see them on the street in their yellow jacket does not mean they are not somewhere doing useful work. Would you prefer that multiple police chase an offender for ages until they crash or give up, or would you prefer that with the use of technolgy they identify the crim' and simply pick him up at his house with little fuss?
Those of you who think the 'boxes' should all be thrown in the bin and lots of police introduced instead are just being silly. Technology is a massive help to policing and should (and will) be increased in use. I do agree that more local police are needed to follow up the info gathered by the technology, but getting rid of all technology as a way of imroving enforcement is plain stupid.
Also, remember that when you see a piece of technology, there are police working 'behind the scenes' using this technology. Just because you can't see them on the street in their yellow jacket does not mean they are not somewhere doing useful work. Would you prefer that multiple police chase an offender for ages until they crash or give up, or would you prefer that with the use of technolgy they identify the crim' and simply pick him up at his house with little fuss?
timf said:
if they haven't got a licence
do they really think they will register it in their own name.
About three years ago the police in Skelmsdale did a 'Clamp' swoop. They targetted every car with out a tax disk and clamped or towed it away. 100's of people had to explain (or not) how they had a car on the road with no tax, no mot and no insurance.
I'd happily carry my licence with me, to show to MR Plod if he were going to randomly pull over cars queuing up to go over the Runcorn Bridge
But AIUI, that's not the proposal. ANPR is operated by police officers. It just gives them another tool in deciding who to pull over.
As for unlicensed drivers not registering their cars, the car will be flagged by ANPR as an unregistered car. This is enough to pull over the driver and look into it further.
As for unlicensed drivers not registering their cars, the car will be flagged by ANPR as an unregistered car. This is enough to pull over the driver and look into it further.
Paul V said:
But surely cars won’t be unregistered, they’ll just be in the previous owners name still.
Only if the previous owner's been stupid enough to have not sent off his section of the V5 document. And I'm guessing he'll be sorting that out as soon as the first NIP drops on his doormat...
The non insurance issue should also be a major concern. Two people i know were knocked off their bikes. The first guy did a runner and the cops claimed the vehicle was reported stollen but could'nt say when. the second perp claimed he didn't have any id so the cops used the id of a passenger. End result; it was all bogus and the vehicle is registerd to someone else.
If your vehicle is unregistered and you are stopped with no ID then IMHO you should be arrested and the car impounded until you can provide the necessary details. Also add a three strikes rule whereby offenders who consistantly take the pi55 should get a stretch to think it over.
There is no doubt a correlation between this minor infringement and more major crime. Bang em up i say
If your vehicle is unregistered and you are stopped with no ID then IMHO you should be arrested and the car impounded until you can provide the necessary details. Also add a three strikes rule whereby offenders who consistantly take the pi55 should get a stretch to think it over.
There is no doubt a correlation between this minor infringement and more major crime. Bang em up i say
In additon to those who don't have licences what about those who are leagally allowed to drive on UK roads but don't have the first idea how they work?
One of the lads at work comes from India and he is allowed to drive in Uk for 1 year on his Indian licence- the worry? If he goes back to India (which he does every christmas ) and gets it restamped he gets another year in the UK.
What is the drivng test in India like? Apparently just a short run round the block (apparently... although I suspect I am being wound up a little bit- the next comment from this guy was that if your mates are in the back they pass to!)
I have been in his car as a passenger and I was VERY scared
. He is now taking a UK test becasue he knows he is a danger and has had loads of near misses and wants to understand UK roads, but this is his own idea not something he has to do.
>> Edited by stigproducts on Wednesday 17th December 21:12
One of the lads at work comes from India and he is allowed to drive in Uk for 1 year on his Indian licence- the worry? If he goes back to India (which he does every christmas ) and gets it restamped he gets another year in the UK.
What is the drivng test in India like? Apparently just a short run round the block (apparently... although I suspect I am being wound up a little bit- the next comment from this guy was that if your mates are in the back they pass to!)
I have been in his car as a passenger and I was VERY scared
. He is now taking a UK test becasue he knows he is a danger and has had loads of near misses and wants to understand UK roads, but this is his own idea not something he has to do. >> Edited by stigproducts on Wednesday 17th December 21:12
The foreign driver thing is a whole separate issue - but a very important one! They should make all non-eu people who want to drive in this country at least take a test before being allowed to. I've known three people involved in crashes with non-eu drivers and it has caused no end of problems in the insurance claim even thought the non-eu driver was entitled to drive.!
If someone is driving unlicenced, (and therefore uninsured) what's the point in giving them a driving ban when they're caught??? You may as well give them a pat on the back for all the good it does.
These are the people the govt should be tackling, not law-abiding drivers doing 2mph over them limit. Lock 'em up I say, and the more of them that can be caught the better, however it is done.
These are the people the govt should be tackling, not law-abiding drivers doing 2mph over them limit. Lock 'em up I say, and the more of them that can be caught the better, however it is done.
eein said:
The foreign driver thing is a whole separate issue - but a very important one! They should make all non-eu people who want to drive in this country at least take a test before being allowed to. I've known three people involved in crashes with non-eu drivers and it has caused no end of problems in the insurance claim even thought the non-eu driver was entitled to drive.!
So what do you do about tourists, visiting businessmen and others from outside the EU?
This country makes serious revenues from American tourists, for example. Are you going to tell them that they can't rent a car here. I think my friend with a £30m per annum car rental business would have a point of view with that, as would his 200 staff who would stand to lose their jobs.
It's a non-starter. Anyway, I think that would be in contravention of international agreements.
A major investigation like hell its another hidden aganda, if they had not abandomed the with roads and put gatso's up then there would have been deterrant, like everone alays has said Gatsos aint gonna stop anything other than speeders, of course It is my belief this is all prelude to something else just whatch out for that little spy in every car, then even people like us who are always paid up motorist will end up on one of their list somewhere, dont get me wrong I'm up for the law but this lot are after much more than that?
burwoodman said:
The non insurance issue should also be a major concern. Two people i know were knocked off their bikes. The first guy did a runner and the cops claimed the vehicle was reported stollen but could'nt say when. the second perp claimed he didn't have any id so the cops used the id of a passenger. End result; it was all bogus and the vehicle is registerd to someone else.
If your vehicle is unregistered and you are stopped with no ID then IMHO you should be arrested and the car impounded until you can provide the necessary details. Also add a three strikes rule whereby offenders who consistantly take the pi55 should get a stretch to think it over.
There is no doubt a correlation between this minor infringement and more major crime. Bang em up i say
And while they're inside, the rest of us get to drive a little easier.
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