F1 style flashing brake lights.. Legal?

[bazzo]

You all have seen the brake lights on F1 cars.. They flash very quickly when brake applied, probably 3-4 times a second i reckon...

Well I followed a car today that had a after market high level brake light fitted.. that was flashing just like an F1 car, ..

Is it legal? and would it be legal if the standard brake lights flashed in the same way?

My thoughts are it could/should be legal, after all, anything that makes the cars brake lights in front more visible must be a good thing?

Bazzo

[14-7]

I thought Fiat 500's had the same lights fitted that if the driver braked very hard the barke lights flash quickly?

Pretty sure also that it is written in to EU regs that it is legal so that superseeds UK law.

[Cyberprog]

Personally I find them more of a distraction. I'm often looking at the cars 2-3 ahead of the one in front, and the flashing snaps back my concentration to the one in front, rather than allowing me to just process the light when it comes on, without losing the focus on what else is happening up front.

[bazzo]

Thats interesting... dont suppose you have any info on the EU regs, or maybe a link?

I was pretty impressed to be honest. I was not looking straight ahead, cant remember why now, but the flashing really got my attention.

Now thinking of modding my car to do the same, if its legal.. Would be a real "pull me" if it isnt!!

[Burrito]

It's just like some models now flash the hazards if you brake hard. Guessing as it's factory standard that it's legal.

Must admit, I'm yet to see an f1 car with brake lights!

[thunderbelmont]

But.... F1 cars don't have brake lights......

So, to be pedantic, F1 brake lights don't flash or light at all.

F1 cars DO however have rain lights, which also come on when the pitlane speed limiter is activated.

[andym1603]

Hi,
F1 cars don't have brake lights. The lights they have are essentially fog lights that they use during wet races for the spray. They also flash when the pit-lane speed limiter is in operation.
I believe the flashing brake light for road cars is a modification for the led third brake light which will only flash for a set time to draw your attention to it.

[bazzo]

Ok.. So the F1 ones are not brake lights...

But how do i find out if it is 100% legal? Its the sort of thing that may be legal,
but a mis informed BiB may well pull ya for.. After all, its not something you see every day..

I will ask fiat dealership tomorrow about the 500 mentioned earlier..

[thunderbelmont]

From memory, only the emergency services are permitted to have flashing red lanterns.

Until recently (Von will correct me if I'm wrong), only the Police were officially allowed to have them as they were used for "stopping" other vehicles.

They are used on Police/Fire/Ambulances for "at scene" "rear guard", because it seems that there are far too many fkwits out there that can run into stationary emergency vehicles that only have blue or amber flashing lights at the rear.

They are "tolerated" in some areas when fitted to recovery vehicles for "rear guard" use on motorways.

[thecremeegg]

thunderbelmont said:

From memory, only the emergency services are permitted to have flashing red lanterns.

Until recently (Von will correct me if I'm wrong), only the Police were officially allowed to have them as they were used for "stopping" other vehicles.

They are used on Police/Fire/Ambulances for "at scene" "rear guard", because it seems that there are far too many fkwits out there that can run into stationary emergency vehicles that only have blue or amber flashing lights at the rear.

They are "tolerated" in some areas when fitted to recovery vehicles for "rear guard" use on motorways.

Dont think so, brake hard in a Veyron and the lights flash

[FasterFreddy]

thecremeegg said:

thunderbelmont said:

From memory, only the emergency services are permitted to have flashing red lanterns.

Until recently (Von will correct me if I'm wrong), only the Police were officially allowed to have them as they were used for "stopping" other vehicles.

They are used on Police/Fire/Ambulances for "at scene" "rear guard", because it seems that there are far too many fkwits out there that can run into stationary emergency vehicles that only have blue or amber flashing lights at the rear.

They are "tolerated" in some areas when fitted to recovery vehicles for "rear guard" use on motorways.

Dont think so, brake hard in a Veyron and the lights flash

Or an Astra

[Jakg]

I remember a new German saloon (S-Class?) doing something similar if you braked very hard as well... gotta be legal.

[attym3]

Driving along the M4 a while ago and the Vauxhall Insignia in front had to brake suddenly and all his brake lights started to flash.
I guess it is a feature you will see more and more of.

[jaf01uk]

They are an evolution of the "putting the hazard lights on on the motorway when slowing a lot" thing, when people started doing that it was illegal to use hazard lights when moving, but was considered a good idea so was changed in later re-writes of the Highway Code.
The brake lights only flash when the car is being braked beyond a certain level to warn following traffic you are slowing quickly,
If we could just get rid of those ridiculous 5 watt sidelight bulbs people insist on using in adverse weather we'd be laughing
Gary

[Mojocvh]

Dunno about from behind but the last euro rental I had put on the hazards when brake assist chimed in...

[streaky]

Statutory Instrument 1989 No 1796 The Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989 said:

Lamps to show a steady light
13.—(1) Save as provided in paragraph (2), no vehicle shall be fitted with a lamp which automatically emits a flashing light.

(2) Paragraph (1) does not apply in respect of-
(a) a direction indicator;
(b) a headlamp fitted to an emergency vehicle;
(c) a warning beacon or special warning lamp;
(d) a lamp or illuminated sign fitted to a vehicle used for police purposes;
(e) a green warning lamp used as an anti-lock brake indicator; or
(f) lamps forming part of a traffic sign.

The regulations were amended in 2005 to permit the use of flashing position lights for pedal cycles and attachments thereto.

Statutory Instrument 2005 No 2559 The Road Vehicles Lighting Amendment Regulations 2005 said:

Amendments to regulation 13 (lamps to show a steady light)
6. In regulation 13(2)—
(a) the word "or" immediately following sub-paragraph (e) shall be omitted;
(b) after sub-paragraph (f) there shall be added—
" (g) a front position lamp capable of emitting a flashing light (whether or not it is also capable of emitting a steady light) which is fitted to—
(i) a pedal cycle; or
(ii) a trailer drawn by, or a sidecar attached to, a pedal cycle;
and which, if it is a lamp which is required to be fitted pursuant to regulation 18, is capable, when emitting a flashing light, of emitting light to the front of the pedal cycle, trailer or sidecar (as the case may be) of an intensity of not less than 4 candelas; or
(h) a rear position lamp capable of emitting a flashing light (whether or not it is also capable of emitting a steady light) which is fitted to—
(i) a pedal cycle; or
(ii) a trailer drawn by, or a sidecar attached to, a pedal cycle;
and which, if it is a lamp which is required to be fitted pursuant to regulation 18, is capable, when emitting a flashing light, of emitting light to the rear of the pedal cycle, trailer or sidecar (as the case may be) of an intensity of not less than 4 candelas."

I interpret the Regulations as saying that brake lights can't be designed to flash automatically when the brake is applied (albeit in practice they would appear to so if cadence braking were used).

Streaky

Edited by streaky on Friday 16th July 14:11

[Blackbullet]

I was at the Leman Classic at the weekend and in between the races, fleets of BMW's, Merc and Focus RS's were doing fast passenger laps. Fortunatly we were at Arnarge on the Saturday evening and these guys were really hooning it, glowing discs on the BMW's and Mercs and some of the M3's brake lights were flashing.

[uk_vette]

I have seen several cars on the continent, that when they are stoped at traffic lights, and they apply hand brake, then the rear red's flash.
Not as fast as F1, but do flash.

'vette

[JumboBeef]

thunderbelmont said:

They are used on Police/Fire/Ambulances for "at scene" "rear guard", because it seems that there are far too many fkwits out there that can run into stationary emergency vehicles that only have blue or amber flashing lights at the rear.

Nope, ambulances are not allowed to have them. Cannot speak for fire but I am pretty sure that only police are allowed to use flashing rear red lights.

[red_slr]

A lot of BMWs have two stage brake lights or as they call it "Brake Force Display", but any car sold in the UK has this feature turned off. I think the 1 series had this feature since about 2005 ish and a lot of 3 series since the same time. Brake very hard and the second stage brake lights come on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h35smNCI6lY

It was my understanding that EU regs were to allow for this two stage effect - but not flashing. Its yet to be put into UK law, thus they turn it off in the ECU.