Time to end 12 points and your License gone
Discussion
Does anyone else think 12 points and your License is lost to harsh. Driving 35,000 + miles / year it is all to easy to make 4 small errors in 3 years. This in todays climate would be lose of Job, lose of house and extremely upset family. Sure the punishment for mugging 4 people or robbing a pensioner or 2 would be less severe. Again it seems the hard working people with something to lose pays the price whilst those without License or Insurance get away with it all or when caught would ignore the ban anyway.
williamp said:
sorry but no. I think its a good idea. If you are either stupid or dangerous enough to have 12 points in 3 years, you should'nt be on the road
Agreed, its a reasonable compromise. 3 points is a warning, and maybe bad luck. 6 points is getting careless, learn to stick to rules and observe. 9 points is try much, much harder.
12 points, and you've failed, consistently, to understand driving. Time for some serious learning.
There are enough people around that fail to realise that the rules are (mostly) there to protect others as well as themselves.
Having owned Ur Quattros , legacy turbos , Mx5 golf tdi (Nice !) and a few other semi sporty cars over 27 years. How come i have yet to get a point?
Do i drive fast ? Yes at times when i know its fine. Do i still enjoy my driving yes . have i done more than 150 yes . I tend to be a "Stealth" type driver. THINK THINK THINK and dont act like a idiot.
If your getting points hard luck ! You must be stupid.
Do i drive fast ? Yes at times when i know its fine. Do i still enjoy my driving yes . have i done more than 150 yes . I tend to be a "Stealth" type driver. THINK THINK THINK and dont act like a idiot.
If your getting points hard luck ! You must be stupid.
I have had a dream:
New drivers are awarded a licence with 10 points on this, which raises to 20 after 2 years probation period.
After the 2 year probation period, additional points can be added to the licence by the completion of recognised advanced driver courses.
Up to a maximum of 40 points can be held on the licence at any one time.
Offences reduce the number of points on the licence.
Drivers can opt for advanced courses in lieu of points for lesser offences (however they will not gain points for completion of course).
Offences to vary on a case by case basis. Severity of offences to be based on overall potential risk/danger, not simply based on an arbitrary speed - e.g. 120 MPH on an empty motorway is safer than 50 MPH past a busy school.
Offences, once spent, can be removed (i.e. the points added back to the licence) (if driver didn't opt for advanced course at time of conviction).
A driver must maintain their advanced status by re-qualifying, else they will lose the number of points awarded for taking the advanced course (e.g. if a driver gained 6 points for successfully passing his IAM assessment, yet fails to re-qualify for their advanced status, they will lose those 6 points).
Period between re-qualifying is based on the number of points currently held on the licence. e.g. 35 points = 35 months.
A driver can earn no more than 12 additional points on their licence in any 12 month period.
Random tests on driver's ability to be in place. If a driver fails to meet the standard, they are ordered to take immediate training to rectify. Failure to comply is met with immediate removal of licence. Licence is considered to be 'removed' until such training has been undertaken.
Each driver only gets ONE licence. They can add points to it, as above, but points will be deducted for driving convictions. Once the points reach 0, the licence is suspended. Drivers must re-take an extended test to re-earn their licence. If successful, their licence is reinstated with 3 points on it. They are then free, at this point, to complete advanced courses to start topping up their licence.
If the points reach 0 again within 10 years of the original suspension, the licence is removed indefinitely. There will be no other legal way to drive a vehicle in public for the rest of their life.
Penalty for driving without a licence - 3 years prison on first offence, 10 to life on second offence.
Insurance is to be taken out against the vehicle, not the person. A person's suitability to drive a certain 'class' of vehicle is directly linked to the #points on the licence. VED to be abolished. Duty on fuel to rise sufficiently to allow for all vehicles to be covered 3rd party only, provided they are on the road.
I don't know, I think it'd work! Good drivers don't have to worry. Good drivers can increase points for that safety cushion. s
t drivers will soon get their comeuppance.
New drivers are awarded a licence with 10 points on this, which raises to 20 after 2 years probation period.
After the 2 year probation period, additional points can be added to the licence by the completion of recognised advanced driver courses.
Up to a maximum of 40 points can be held on the licence at any one time.
Offences reduce the number of points on the licence.
Drivers can opt for advanced courses in lieu of points for lesser offences (however they will not gain points for completion of course).
Offences to vary on a case by case basis. Severity of offences to be based on overall potential risk/danger, not simply based on an arbitrary speed - e.g. 120 MPH on an empty motorway is safer than 50 MPH past a busy school.
Offences, once spent, can be removed (i.e. the points added back to the licence) (if driver didn't opt for advanced course at time of conviction).
A driver must maintain their advanced status by re-qualifying, else they will lose the number of points awarded for taking the advanced course (e.g. if a driver gained 6 points for successfully passing his IAM assessment, yet fails to re-qualify for their advanced status, they will lose those 6 points).
Period between re-qualifying is based on the number of points currently held on the licence. e.g. 35 points = 35 months.
A driver can earn no more than 12 additional points on their licence in any 12 month period.
Random tests on driver's ability to be in place. If a driver fails to meet the standard, they are ordered to take immediate training to rectify. Failure to comply is met with immediate removal of licence. Licence is considered to be 'removed' until such training has been undertaken.
Each driver only gets ONE licence. They can add points to it, as above, but points will be deducted for driving convictions. Once the points reach 0, the licence is suspended. Drivers must re-take an extended test to re-earn their licence. If successful, their licence is reinstated with 3 points on it. They are then free, at this point, to complete advanced courses to start topping up their licence.
If the points reach 0 again within 10 years of the original suspension, the licence is removed indefinitely. There will be no other legal way to drive a vehicle in public for the rest of their life.
Penalty for driving without a licence - 3 years prison on first offence, 10 to life on second offence.
Insurance is to be taken out against the vehicle, not the person. A person's suitability to drive a certain 'class' of vehicle is directly linked to the #points on the licence. VED to be abolished. Duty on fuel to rise sufficiently to allow for all vehicles to be covered 3rd party only, provided they are on the road.
I don't know, I think it'd work! Good drivers don't have to worry. Good drivers can increase points for that safety cushion. s
t drivers will soon get their comeuppance.Jasandjules said:
I am in two minds about this.
I kind of think that as it is "easy"* to get 6 points for speeding on the motorway that perhaps 15 points would be more reasonable.
Really?I kind of think that as it is "easy"* to get 6 points for speeding on the motorway that perhaps 15 points would be more reasonable.
6 points in one go generally requires at least 96mph, which is probably 100+mph on the offender's speedo.
Shouldn't people driving at 100mph+ be prepared to accept the consequences if caught?
Dangerous Dan said:
I don't know, I think it'd work!
No chance.The current points system is fine.
The bit that doens't work IMO is that people who speed are punished more than people who actually drive dangerously but within the speed limit.
A better system IMO is compulsary re-testing every 5 years. I get wound up when people say "Haha - I'm glad I don't have re-take my driving test... ho-ho-ho!" As if being a s
t driver is funny! I'd be happy to resit tomorrow as I'm confident I would pass. We need to remove/retrain drivers who can't pass a test. The fact that they could 30 years ago is irrelevant, we need retests every 5 years to keep driving standards up.Can't believe what some people are saying here.
Harsh is putting it lightly.
Under the rules, every driver should be banned for six months immediately. Show me a driver who says he's not exceeded the speed limit four times in three years, and I'll show you a liar.
The punishment is not proportional. Hitting 80 four times in three years should not subject anybody to the potential devastation of what might ensue: lost job, lost home, broken family...
The assertion that laws are there to protect everybody is becoming something of a farce as speed limits are needlessly falling and more trivial transgressions attract points.
It's more than harsh, it's persecution.
Before anybody starts, I have never had points on my licence over 47 years.
Edit..
Having said that, anybody who can't spell licence should be banned for life...
Harsh is putting it lightly.
Under the rules, every driver should be banned for six months immediately. Show me a driver who says he's not exceeded the speed limit four times in three years, and I'll show you a liar.
The punishment is not proportional. Hitting 80 four times in three years should not subject anybody to the potential devastation of what might ensue: lost job, lost home, broken family...
The assertion that laws are there to protect everybody is becoming something of a farce as speed limits are needlessly falling and more trivial transgressions attract points.
It's more than harsh, it's persecution.
Before anybody starts, I have never had points on my licence over 47 years.
Edit..
Having said that, anybody who can't spell licence should be banned for life...
Edited by mybrainhurts on Sunday 15th August 17:57
mybrainhurts said:
Can't believe what some people are saying here.
Harsh is putting it lightly.
Under the rules, every driver should be banned for six months immediately. Show me a driver who says he's not exceeded the speed limit four times in three years, and I'll show you a liar.
The punishment is not proportional. Hitting 80 four times in three years should not subject anybody to the potential devastation of what might ensue: lost job, lost home, broken family...
The assertion that laws are there to protect everybody is becoming something of a farce as speed limits are needlessly falling and more trivial transgressions attract points.
It's more than harsh, it's persecution.
Don't be silly.Harsh is putting it lightly.
Under the rules, every driver should be banned for six months immediately. Show me a driver who says he's not exceeded the speed limit four times in three years, and I'll show you a liar.
The punishment is not proportional. Hitting 80 four times in three years should not subject anybody to the potential devastation of what might ensue: lost job, lost home, broken family...
The assertion that laws are there to protect everybody is becoming something of a farce as speed limits are needlessly falling and more trivial transgressions attract points.
It's more than harsh, it's persecution.
You have to be going at a fair lick above the speed limit to get more than 3 points.
To that end, you get 3 chances to sort yourself out.
If you take more than 3 chances to sort yourself out, you deserve to spend some time on the sidelines.
mota said:
Driving 35,000 + miles / year it is all to easy to make 4 small errors in 3 years. This in todays climate would be lose of Job, lose of house and extremely upset family.
I don't agree.As a 'professional driver' you should be able to maintain a standard of driving above that of the casual road user and therefore you should be able to keep a clean licence.
You shouldn't be picking up points for anything other than speed and even that should be pretty hard to do. When I was a rep a £100 Road Angel kept me safe when my mind wandered to my sales figures in build up areas or 50mpg average speed stretches on the motorway nowadays TomTom's do the same thing.
It's not hard to keep within the law.
mota said:
Does anyone else think 12 points and your License is lost to harsh. Driving 35,000 + miles / year it is all to easy to make 4 small errors in 3 years. This in todays climate would be lose of Job, lose of house and extremely upset family. Sure the punishment for mugging 4 people or robbing a pensioner or 2 would be less severe. Again it seems the hard working people with something to lose pays the price whilst those without License or Insurance get away with it all or when caught would ignore the ban anyway.
Yet (IIRC) roughly 85% of people who get banned from driving have criminal records.Since the points system pre-dates the massive rollout of automatic law enforcement, I think the system needs review. I believe that in Germany speedcamera fines do not also include points? Police stops do. If that's so, we should adopt the same practice (or better still remove all remote speed monitoring). If its not so maybe we can have an EU zone first and do something sensible and motorist friendly first?? 
Before the scams, being done for speeding meant you had attracted the attention of a proper traffic police officer, so more often than not the serverity of the punishment (points) was justified. There were fewer of them too, and against that backdrop the points system was developed.
It simply is not justified to be sent bill and points in the post 14 days after a none event like driving 80mph down an empty M-way.
It also means we need an urgent review of all limits most of which are too low, and combined with scams and points collude to deprive people of a fundemental freedom where they are basically getting on with normal living and causing zero 'risk' or incovenience to others.
Before the scams, being done for speeding meant you had attracted the attention of a proper traffic police officer, so more often than not the serverity of the punishment (points) was justified. There were fewer of them too, and against that backdrop the points system was developed.
It simply is not justified to be sent bill and points in the post 14 days after a none event like driving 80mph down an empty M-way.
It also means we need an urgent review of all limits most of which are too low, and combined with scams and points collude to deprive people of a fundemental freedom where they are basically getting on with normal living and causing zero 'risk' or incovenience to others.
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